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I am pretty sure these are africans, but what would be some fish that could go nicely with these.

Would there be any way of telling these two fish apart (male or female).

They are different fish.

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f250/aquapickle27/MyAfricans002.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f250/aquapickle27/MyAfricans001.jpg

†Aquapickle†

They are Africans.
They look like young Frontosa to me, though
it is very hard to tell from the pics.
Frontosa grow to be 16 inches or so long,
and need a massive tank of at least 180g.
The lighter color one is either a female,
or subdominant male.
Frontosa are a peaceful cichlid, as africans
go, prefer to be in a group of 5 or more,
and can be kept with any fish of suitable temperment
and large enough to not be eaten.
Frontosa are a Tagnayikan cichlid.
Heres the profile from this site:
http://www.fishprofiles.com/files/profiles/350.htm

The only other fish I can find right now that looks
similar is the Firebird Cichlid,
heres its profile
http://www.fishprofiles.com/files/profiles/231.htm


Come Play Yahtzee With Me!
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Actually i dont think it is a Frontosa, the guy at my LFS told me that they would max out at about 6in. And when i floated the bag in the tank they seemed pretty agressive toward the guppies i had in (which i removed).

The label on the tank at the store said that the fish in the tank were mixed africans, so i dont know anymore than that.

But thanks for the info.

†Aquapickle†

Looks like Midnight Demasonis...very much like the picture on THIS profile.

I have no idea if they are male/female though. These little Mbuna can be pretty aggressive, so be careful what you keep with them.

That profile says 2.5 inches, but the other type of demasoni gets about 4 inches, so I'm not sure. Your pictures are very close to the picture of the Midnight on that profile though. Looks almost identical IMO.

This picture on FPs profile looks like yours as well. This one is a little more blue, but in time I'm sure yours will color up to look more like this: http://www.fishprofiles.com/profiles/gallery.aspx?id=418

If this is in fact what you have, they are usually kept in groups. The more you have the better off you'll be because of their high aggression level.

What size tank do you have them in? If its big enough, 50+ gallons (75+ is better), then I'd go with a group of Demasoni (1m/5-6f) and then some other aggressive Mbuna. Make sure you have lots of rock work.

*Kristin*

Yeah those look a little more like it. I only have two right now (that is all the store had). I was looking at adding some electric yellows would that be possible?

†Aquapickle†

Those are metriaclima lombardois, aka Kenyis. Males turn into a deep yellow as they mature, while the females remain the same color.

I'm puzzling over this one because those pictures are pretty dark.

However, I think I can safely say that they are NOT Frontosas. Why?

Frontosas are sold by name. ALWAYS. They're difficult to breed, take a long time to raise to a saleable size, and carry LARGE price tags. Here in the UK, you can pay £10 each for juveniles that are under an inch long - a 3-inch adult will set you back £40-50, which at current exchange rates is around $95 US. I cannot imagine ANY dealer being mad enough to sell a Frontosa amongst a batch of "mixed Africans" at a modest price tag when it can command much more elevated prices by name!

I think AquaPickle would KNOW if he'd bought Frontosas quite simply because of the LARGE hole in the wallet that would result from the purchase!


Panda Catfish fan and keeper/breeder since Christmas 2002

Sorry about the dark shots, this tank has very poor lighting. If it had more light i would plant it, but for now it is very bare and i am thinking of ways to fill it in.

I did see another fish that looked a lot like these in another tank that was labeled "Kenyi," but that one didn't look so good.

Yeah i didn't pay too much for them, i got them both for like $13.

†Aquapickle†

Frontosa around here are quite common,
with a 3-4 inch fish being in the 10-15 dollar
canadian range.


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I was curious, could i mix some electric yellows with these fish?
If not what could go with them?
So is anyone sure on how to tell their gender apart?

Any other info would be very much appreciated.

THANKS!

†Aquapickle†

Kenyii is what you have!! no frontosa.. doesn't have the proper body shape for a juvenile! Male kenyi's will deveop into a yellow and the females are the blue.. for a change....in the cichlid world that is!

72 gallon bowfront:Tanganyikan Lake set up
75 gallon: A. Baenschi trio,Cyanotilapia Afra Cobwe(4), copadichromis trewavase, protomelas sp. tangerine tiger(breeding pair)

Sweet thanks for the info, i hope i got a pair that can breed i would like to find out a little more about how that all works.


†Aquapickle†

Right - if the fish closely reemble others in a nearby aquarium that were labelled "Kenyi" or "Kennyi", then you have Metriaclima lombardoi, formerly Pseudotropheus lombardoi, as someone above has already mentioned.

You'll soon know if you truly have lombardoi courtesy of one very interesting trait that this fish possesses. While the majority of Mbuna tend to differentiate into yellow/orange females and blue males, lombardoi has reverse sexual colouration - the females are blue with black bars, while the males are orange. The males usually have 4 or so egg spots on the anal fin as they mature.

This means, as I've repeatedly stated in other posts on the subject, that you have to exercise particular care integrating this fish with other Mbuna. This is because the usual rule for Mbuna is one male, several females ... the problem being that the female lombardoi can resemble the males of several other Mbuna species, and so you have to make sure you don't try keeping your lombardoi with overly aggressive species whose males closely resemble the female lombardoi, otherwise your poor female lombardoi are likely to take a beating. Likewise, the females of some other Mbuna species will resemble the male lombardoi, and the male lombardoi might launch a pre-emptive strike on what he thinks are competing males ... so the trick with integrating lombardoi is to pick other species that have conspicuously different colouration. Since the stripes on lombardoi are vertical, picking a fish with horizontal stripes such as Pseudotropheus auratus is one possibility if you wish to experiment with this pairing, but be prepared to rehouse either the lombardoi or the auratus if warfare should break out!

If yu're planning on a multi-species setup with lombardoi, I'd run with Pseudotropheus minutus (elongate body sufficiently different to be at low risk of attack on the basis of colour confusion), one of the Gephyrochromis species (which are odd enough not to be confused with anything else colour wise) and Metriaclima greshakei, which is radically different from all of the foregoing if the illustration of the fish in the Cichlid Room is accurate (which it should be, because the photo was taken by Ad Konings). I'd steer clear of some of the oddly coloured Pseudotropheus species such as Pseudotropheus tursiops, which despite being a lovely iridescent purple colour, is a hardcore criminal on a par with Melanochromis chipokae and best left to a very large tank full of similar ruffians.

Of course, if your lombardoi are being given a species aquarium, you've no worries, but in this case, take note NOW that any attempt to mix them with other Mbuna in the future requires extra special care, because of the unusual reversed sexual colouration and the compatibility issues arising therefrom.

Oh, and Sneaky, if your Frontosas are really that cheap, you could make a serious financial killing by buying a batch and bringing them over here to the UK - your specimens that fetch CAN$ 10 each would probably fetch about £40 here, which at current exchange rates is CAN$ 86 or thereabouts! Get someone to pay for your air ticket and you'd pocket a LOT of loot ...



Panda Catfish fan and keeper/breeder since Christmas 2002