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They ARE the blue ram...just tinier and plumper. I've been told they're just as hardy too, but like the temperature up a bit. Any other thoughts?

-Formerly known as the Ferretfish

I posted a thread about this a while back and got no replies. All it is is a blue ram that is breed to be like that. Pretty much the same as a blue ram just bigger heard thy were less hardy and there more $$$$ around here.

Eh, I'm not really a fan of fish that are bred to be a certain way. At least, this applies in most cases. The same goes with the balloon ram. I prefer the normal German rams, because they are more 'natural'. It is the same thing with plants. For example, I would rather have live plants than plastic plants. If I do have to get plastic plants, I will buy the most natural looking ones, instead of those neon-colored things.

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And when he gets to Heaven, to Saint Peter he will tell: "One more Marine reporting, Sir! I've served my time in Hell."

i'm kinda with sirbooks, these guys just look so.... wrong in my opinion. Anyway, you say you've heard that these guys are "as hardy as normal rams" I wouldn't call rams hardy.

Anyway, most fish that are selectivly breed for color/shape/whatnot are usually NOT as hardy as "normal" breeds.

I didn't realize they were bred in a harmful way for them to be like this...I just thought they were cute. In that case I guess I'll pass...

-Formerly known as the Ferretfish

can any one post a picture? I NEVER SEEN THESE B4!

Liana,

They are bred to be that way, but this does not mean they are bred in a harm full way....

Some breeders found a defect (for lack of a better word) that made them come out like this and then they cultivated it. There is nothing harmful about it.

As far as you natural purest go well...

Look at your dog..Do you think that most breeds of dog are natural....UMMM NO! We have breed them to be that way. Welcome to the wide world of modern man. Sorry folks this is how it is so get over it or denounce your humanity!!!

I for one am sick and tired of all the crap that goes on here with the naturalists that say we should not mess with things....

I tell you what...If we didn't mess with things we would all still be climbing trees and scratching our butts on the grass.

As long as the end result is an animal that lives a happy life without suffering is all that is important!

Liana, If you like them then get them. Treat them like you would any German Blue Ram..

Any domesticated animal has been altered from it's wild form by selective breeding. Though I really wouldn't call fish domesticated many of them have been bred to bring out characteristics that we, Mankind, find pleasing.

Angelfish are just one example of this.

Mike

EDIT(SP)

Last edited by Mike R at 19-Dec-2004 22:43

Actually, what makes them look that way is they're bred to have a grossly enlarged stomach and swim bladder that can create many problems down the line. They have problems swimming for more extended periods of time and do tend to have shorter like spans than "normal" german rams. As far as being more or less hardy, it really depends on the source and the genetics. German rams as a whole I would call a fairly delicate breed when compared to others.

As far as the ethics of creating balloon rams, it a fairly long and heated debate that can never really be answered because most people already have their opinions formed. Of course I'm the person who also doesn't approve of blood parrots and other man-made creation of fish. If the "mutation" causes problems for the animal I don't approve of it, but if it's strictly for appearance and their is no problem physically so be it. Flowerhorns are an example.

From my studies I wouldn't say that the Rams are the most hardy species out there, and I've noted even less so for that of Ram morphs, like the angel and ballon rams, etc.

Personally, I say, if you have the right set up, and you really want some of these guys then go ahead and get some. As far as I know they were not bred in a harmfull way, they were simply bred from what would be considered a genetic defect, and by that I mean they were born differently.
Heck, I was born with red hair and dark brown eyes, it's a very rare combination, I suppose I'm a genetic defect too... perhaps I should go off myself because I'm not as "natural" as the others.

I mean no offence, I'm just a sarcastic critter

Like I said, yours are aesthetic "mutations". They have an enlarged stomach and swim bladder that causes spine deformities. That cannot be argued. Any dissection of the fish and you can see that when compared to the anatomy of a normal blue ram. Yes, I have dissected both types of fish in an anatomy and physiology lab as part of a presentation I made.

That's basically like breeding people for scoliosis because you like the curvy or humped look in people.

Last edited by chapman76 at 20-Dec-2004 13:59

I think balloon anythings are just awful. They're just so horribly mutated... How do they get them to be that way anyway? Enlarged swim bladders? Bending spine? Either way, it looks so awkward and uncomfortable... I'm definitely not a purist (I breed fancy bettas for goodness sakes), but when they start looking totally bizarre and mutated, I'd say I'm certainly not a fan.

And I've always noticed that the more "cultivated" an animal is, the less hardy, long lived, etc they are than their "wild" cousins...

this isnt ALWAYS the case, but I just can't imagine something so deformed being entirely healthy.

I see it as if you want them, so be it. Just prefer people to be informed about what they're getting. It doesn't matter to me.

Well, After searching for this thread and reading it, I just canceled my hold on a pair of Balloon Rams. First off they cost 19.95 a piece! And Secondly they will PROBABLY not live as long as normal German Blue Rams. I feel anything that is picked out by humans and not by natural selection will not be as healthy. Think of a Dog clone, not as healthy w/ many problems.

BTW this thread sounds like a genetics lecture.

Chris