FishProfiles.com Message Forums

My friend has a black moor that for like a year has been swimming upside down and she believes has a tumor in it's eye. What could be wrong with this fish.
I have been reading how big they can get and everysite is differen't so does anyone know for sure, it's in a 10 gal, don't get mad at me I know they need bigger, but could that be the problem,could it's organs be growing and it's outside not.. Please help this fish... thanks

That fish needs at minimum a 50 gal tank to itself.

um, the fish may have sucked up to much air and is floating like that.

I'll try my hardest to get her to get a larger tank, and if this fish did suck up to much air how could you fix this and what causes a fish to suck up to much air.

well, there are many ways, but i can only think of two right now:
1) 90% works: try switching the food from flakes to a sinking pellet, so when the gold fish comes up to eat they don't suck up air instead of the food.

2)10% worksnote: saw this being done on fish on vaction in the carribean)take a small needle and push it into the swim bladder and take out the air manully.(note: this way should be avoid if u don't know what you are doing, again when i went fishing after we caught the fish they used a needle so the fish will not be stuck on the servface. so please take EXTREME caution if u attemt to do this!)

Cory_Di uses algae sheets with her goldies, to help them...I'll run and get her and maybe she can help...heidi

"I've got a great ambition to die of exhaustion rather than boredom." Thomas Carlyle

Hi Bruce

A couple of notes on Swim Bladder Disorder:

1) Nitrates must be below 40ppm and with a problematic fish, ideally below 20ppm. High nitrates are thought to contribute to SBD. In a 10 gallon it is a challenge and may mean daily, 60% water changes. But, I would recommend gradually increasing the amount of water changed. Start with 3 gallons the first two days, then increase it to 6 gallons. This would best be done with a python, especially if you don't have to worry about smaller fish. It attaches right to most faucets and creates a suction on one setting, then allows you to fill the tank. You add dechlorinator/chloramine remover as it fills. Ideally, you want to get down to 0-5ppm of nitrate after several daily changes. Always wait an hour before measuring after a change. Once you get to that level, then see how long it takes to get to 20ppm. It could be one day, it could be 2-3 days. When you hit 20ppm, do a large water change again of 60-70%. Measure the nitrates for weeks because they can creep up with time. The best nitrate tester is Aquarium Pharmaceuticals as it is cheap and will last all year.

http://www.petsmart.com/global/product_detail.jsp?ASSORTMENT%3C%3East_id=2534374302023693&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=2534374302030149&PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=845524441775175&bmUID=1111452957981

IMPORTANT: Temp should not be altered more than 1-1.5F optimally during water changes to prevent temp stress. Temp stress can bring on ich if the temp suddenly drops several degrees. Sudden rises can thrust bacterial infections into bloom.

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=3910&Ntt=python&Ntk=All&Ntx=mode+matchallpartial&Np=1&N=2004&Nty=1.

You can get a python at most pet stores if you don't want to get it online. It makes water changes a 5 minute job. I practiced with a big bucket the first time . Just don't use a bucket that has had chemicals in it.

The best thing is to get him into a bigger tank and it will reduce the amount of water changes required. Let the nitrate levels guide you. Once you are up to 60% changes, for several days, you can take it to 70%. Some would do this right out of the shoot, but I believe in keeping all things gradual.

2) Diet. Floating foods are bad for floaters. They need more water in the gut and more fiber. Feed only once daily and sparingly. First, fast the fish for 2 days. Then, feed the fish exclusively algae sheets (cut a 1 x 1 inch sheet for each 3-4 inches of fish). It can be hung on a veggie clip or cut up into flake sized squares. The algae quickly absorbs water and becomes gel-like. It also contains high fiber. You can also cut into thin, short strips and hand feed if it is easiest. If the fish should begin to correct itself in the coming days, then it is diet related. After a few more days of exclusive algae sheet feeding, add some frozen, thawed foods like bloodworms or brine shrimp (they are moist). Freeze dried floats too much. Alternate with high quality flake food (small amounts) that are less than 60 days old since opening.

If there is no change with algae sheets, then it is either a structural problem (other organs pressing against swimbladder), or infection or parasites. I was able to put my goldie back on high quality pellets (Hikari Oranda Gold), which are floating, but I put a 2 x 2 inch square in the tank at the same time the pellets are in the tank. When they are done with the pellets, they eat the water soaked algae.

3)For a really bad floater that has gone on like that, I would give a single dose of Praziquantel. It is a highly effective dewormer capable of driving out intestinal parasites in as little as four hours of being in bath. It is available in a new product by Hikari called Prazi-Pro. If you can't find that, pick up Jungle Parasite Clear Tank Buddies and make sure you see Praziquantel in the ingredient list. I feel it is always worth a try to flush potential parasites in serious cases, even while the diet is going on. In fact, put it in the water while the fish is fasting. Fish need not necessarily be emaciated to have worms. Praziquantel is plant safe, and highly safe for fish, including fry so it is not really a toxic med. It is very gentle with maximum effectiveness, and does not affect the biofilter at all.

4). If none of this works, then your last resort is a round of something like Medi-Gold or MetroMed. The latter is expensive and only available in larger bags. Medi-Gold can be purchased through Goldfish Connection.com. I am having problems with links, so just go to that website and look under medicated foods. As an alternative, you can try the new Jungle Anti-Bacteria Medicated food, but it floats heavily and doesn't have as good of blend of meds.

If that is ineffective, then goldie will have to live out his life as a floater. Many live for years like that and adapt. However, a big percentage of the cases can be controlled with diet. It is very, very important not to overfeed. They can live on just a little bit of food once daily. Some even feed every other day.

Update us on his progress

Last edited by Cory_Di at 21-Mar-2005 19:00