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I think we got it. Eye Fluke. - On my Rainbow. Now to find out how to treat the tank. I never heard of eye fluke.

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Curiosity killed the cat, but satisfaction brought it back.

Throw praziquantel and protozin at the rainbow, he''be tough enough to take it. Flukes , fungus, protozoa, all will be dead. You wouldnt be able to do that with the mormyrid in the same water.

OK, sounds like a plan. Now to find the stuff. QT tank is almost ready to go. Trying to set tne heater, making sure it is stable, old heater went to the frys. Thanks longhair for everything. you sure know your rainbows.

Wow, I can't find these meds except to buy them over the internet, and that was only PraziPro. Any ideas on where to buy?

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Curiosity killed the cat, but satisfaction brought it back.

Longhair, i found in my fish med box Aquatronic Flukes Control w/Potassium permanganate. Will this work and if so, can I mix it with the other?

Note: Male Rainbow's cone over eye is now clear, however, cone is still there, just hard to see. I am thinking this is what happened last time, thought infection was gone, but really was not.

ok, I just can't find any of these products,only PraziPro, what else should/can I use?

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Curiosity killed the cat, but satisfaction brought it back.

Prazi pro probably will kill the flukes ok as will the aquatronics stuff, if you cant find protozin, you can order it direct, they ship overseas.

http://www.waterlife.co.uk/waterlife/protozin.htm


Im not sure that the fluke meds will mix well with protozin, but the same company does sterazin, and that should mix ok, and it kills flukes very effectively.

Im not entirely sure what range of meds you can get where you are, if you go for reputable makes they should be ok though, see if you can collar an expert at the shop, or a knowledgeable customer if you cant wait for mail order.

I find esha products very effective for fungus too,esha 2000 fungus finrot and bacteria treatment is usually pretty good if you can find it.

Here is a picture of the red streak, and gunk in gill. The eye cone is clear right now so you can't see it.

Attached Image:

Larger of the two males

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Curiosity killed the cat, but satisfaction brought it back.

full image

Attached Image:


See my profile (link below) for fish and setup.

Curiosity killed the cat, but satisfaction brought it back.

Oh smashing , add bacterial gill disease to the list.

Cause is direct infection to the gills, no other surfaces of the fish need be affected, the slime you see is exuding directly from the gills rather like your lungs produce mucus when you have a serious lung infection. Its called bacterial gill disease, but unfortunately its often a combination of both fungus and bacterial infection. Protozin will kill the fungus as will anti fungus and finrot meds, but the bacteria might need a proper antibiotic. Try the antifungals first,you can try melafix, but I doubt it will have a lot of impact on it. Given the red area in the midbody the infection is spreading . If the antifungals and melafix doesnt work dont take too long coming to a decision to to call the vet for some water soluble antibiotics methinks. Keep the tank very well oxygenated, that infection will be limiting the breathing. You're on the clock with that kind of infection.Esha 2000 should cure the problem, nailing the fungus and bacteria simultaeneously

http://www.eshalabs.com/esha2000.htm

, but if you cant find some by tomorrow, I would give the vet a bell.

Excellent pic though, worth keeping for reference for other folks. We oughtta do that on this site.

Great, where do I find the stuff. Melafix is what is being used now until I find the right fix. Dam, I need it now.

I have on hand Maracyn and Maracyn-two any of the two will work???? Can't find eSHa 2000 in the US. Only overseas

ps what vet, this is las vegas

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Curiosity killed the cat, but satisfaction brought it back.

This help?

http://www.google.co.uk/local?hl=en&lr=&safe=off&q=vets&near=Las+Vegas,+NV,+USA&sa=X&oi=localr

Maracyn and maracyn 2 have to be worth a shot. First one should get the fungus and the second the bacteria. Try em by all means.

No, I know about those Vets, I used to work for one of them. However, fish Vets, there is only one and he seems to be out of town a lot. Not many people bring there fish to the vets.

Mr. Rainbow is in his new home, being treated with both Maracyn and Maracyn-two. He is not too happy about his small 8 gal box of a home but and losing his gal, but life could be a lot worse for him.

As for Little Mr. Rainbow, is very very happy. He has the female all to himself and Mr. Rainbow is not picking on him any longer. And the morning sun is just coming up. Couldn't have worked out any better for little Rainbow. Little Mr. is a Stud now.

I will keep all posted


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Curiosity killed the cat, but satisfaction brought it back.

I have been following the thread but I haven’t found anything to interject. It sounded like the bacterial growth/fungus that you mentioned in your March 6th post had cleared a bit after the addition of MelaFix.

I know that you have found these postings from Bob Fenner, a contributor to Tropical Fish Hobbyist (TFH):
The Elephantfishes, family Mormyridae, in Aquariums http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/mormyrids.htm

Reading that article and background pieces tell me that all mormyrids are wild fish with a high likelihood of Monogenean parasites that infect either gills or skin. Secondarily, the cautions in keeping this fish are: no metal producing agents or electrical field generating items should be used in their habitat. As a scaleless fish they will be susceptible to medications with copper. Additionally, since they use a weak electrical field to search for food, any magnetic or electrical field will create some imbalance.

So, what is a Monogenean parasite? See the following reference: http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/FA033.

The following bits are clipped from that article. Emphasis is mine:

Monogeneans (flukes) are a group of parasites best described as flatworms. Monogeneans are commonly found on the gills, skin or fins of fishes and lower aquatic invertebrates. A few may invade the rectal cavity, ureter, body cavity and even the blood vascular system.

There are more than 100 families of monogeneans found on fishes of the world, in fresh and salt water, and at a variety of temperatures.

Most monogeneans are browsers, moving about the body surface and feeding on dermal (skin) mucus and gill debris. Monogeneans have a series of hooks that enable them to attach while feeding. Most species are host- and site-specific, requiring only one host to complete an entire life cycle. In fact, some adult monogeneans will remain permanently attached to a single site on the host.

Morbidity and mortality epidemics in cultured fish caused by excessive parasite loads are associated with crowding, inadequate sanitation and deterioration of water quality. Although monogeneans are commonly found on wild fish, they are rarely a direct cause of disease or death in free-ranging populations.

Treatment of monogeneans is usually not satisfactory unless the primary cause of increased fluke populations is found and alleviated. The treatment of choice for freshwater fishes is formalin, administered as a prolonged bath at 25 mg/L or a short-term bath at 150-250 mg/L for 30 minutes. Sick fish do not tolerate formalin well and all fish should be carefully watched during chemical administration (see UF/IFAS Extension Fact Sheet VM-77 Use of Formalin to Control Fish Parasites). If adverse reaction is observed, fish should be removed from the treatment tank at once and placed in clean water.

Potassium permanganate is also effective against monogeneans, and is the treatment of choice if columnaris bacteria or fungi are invading damaged tissues. Potassium permanganate can be administered as a prolonged bath at a concentration of 2 mg/L or as a short-term bath (30 minutes) at a concentration of 10 mg/L. Again, fish must be observed carefully while they are in contact with the chemical and they should be removed at once if adverse effects are noticed. For further information see UF/IFAS Extension Fact Sheets FA-23 The Use of Potassium Permanganate in Fish Ponds and FA-37 Use of Potassium Permanganate to Control External Infections of Ornamental Fish.

I would not use potassium permanganate to treat your morymid as the compound is prepared by fusing manganese dioxide with potassium hydroxide to form potassium manganate and then electrolysing the manganate solution using iron electrodes at about 60 degC. Remember, these fish do like any metal compounds. So knock down the infection in a hospital tank using erythromycin. Having resolved the bacterial infection, then use formalin. See: http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/VM061. The product may be purchased at Pet Solutions on-line, http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/VM061, but do check your LFS or big box store.


Hopefully your fish has Gyrodactylus as: Dactylogyrus is usually attached to the gills of freshwater fish. It reproduces by laying eggs, which are often resistant to chemical treatment, therefore weekly treatment over a period of 34 weeks is recommended. Gyrodactylus is usually found on the skin and fins of freshwater fish and produces live young, so one treatment may be adequate to control an infestation.




__________
"To steal ideas from one person is plagiarism; to steal from many is research."
researched from Steven Wright

I guess I will have to think about treating the elephant nose after mr rainbow. I only have 1 QT and mr elephantnose looks good right now, melefix works well on him, just not well on the others. Looks as if I have my work cut out for me. Maybe now I won't have time to clean Eheim pro II filter out everyweek. (god, I am not sure I can handle that, it will get too dirty)

Bob, thank you for the article on the elephantnose, I had not read that one before. I have had my Mr elephantnose for over 2 years now. He eats right out of my hand with lights on, loves to be watched; however,when I get the camera out he is off in his hidding space - a large tree truck with Java furn attached- when he wants to rule the tank, he just pushes the Rainbows out of the way - he is only 5" long- I feel as if I am very lucky to still have him around, that is why I am always very careful when treating him. I have found that Aquarsol, Melafix, and Revive (which I can't find anylonger) works wonders on them without any ill effect. I am alway too afraid to try anything new on them. I guess that is why I am having troubles curing him fully - hence, reaccurances of fluff on his back. His gills look clean, he is the flashing and whitepatch on his back. I am hoping that mr. Rainbow being sick is what is causing the elephantnose to breakout, for it seems to happen at the sametime.

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Alright, Mr. Rainbow is still in QT, today is his last day of Antibiotics that have killed both neg. and positive. He looks much better; however, still had red streak. My question is do I next treat for the fungus or the parasite? (meds that have been given are both Maracyn and Maracyn-two).

Lesley

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Curiosity killed the cat, but satisfaction brought it back.

Id go for the treatment in order of killing quickness, the fungus will probably kill quicker than the other , so do the antifungal next. Id treat both at the same time if I could, but that depends on the compatability of the meds.

Thanks for the advice. I will try to find maybe another brand of med that I can combine the two. I tried to get your stuff you told me to use, but couldn't find any in the USA. In addition, the price for shipping from there was 45 pounds! 80 US dollars, can you believe it? that is just wrong

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Curiosity killed the cat, but satisfaction brought it back.

At lunch, I couldn't find anything that I could combined together; however, I do have Jungle labs, parasite guard at home, do you think that that the Metronidazole with help clear the fungus? That is only a two-day treatment as with AP Plus Anti-Fungus which I also have at home.

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Curiosity killed the cat, but satisfaction brought it back.

Kitty,

Take a deep breath - you're dealing with meds not spices. It isn't a touch of Maracyn with a sprig of paraguard plus a dash of salt and a spritz of pepper. Most of these things can be poisons! Please use them one at a time unless it specifically says on the label, "This medication can be combined with any other medication to create a bouillabaisse." Combine two meds and you will never know which med worked and which med killed Mr. R!

Go here to find meds:

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/NavResults.cfm?N=2004+113521



__________
"To steal ideas from one person is plagiarism; to steal from many is research."
researched from Steven Wright

The antiparasite food probably wont touch fungus, and neither will metronidazole, so just do the treatments in order should you be in any doubt.

Ok, fungus first then Parasite Jungle Labs. Just changed 50 of water and put carbon in, when I get home from work I will add the AP Plus Anti-Fungal drops. (I would think by then, tank will be clear of meds. Did I ever say, I hate sick fish!

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Curiosity killed the cat, but satisfaction brought it back.

Tonight, I tried treating the Rainbow with Aquatronics, Flukes Control. Ingredients: Potassium Permanganate. I only got 40 Min. I put him in a tub of 5 gallons with old tank water with lid sitting on top on container. Air and heat in container. He leaped out of container twice, lucky I was right there and put him right back in. I then put a weight on top of lid. He kept trying to jump out. I gave up after an hour, figuring he was going to do more harm to himself then the meds were going to do any go. So, into the big tank he went. He has a few scratches on him, but otherwise looks ok. I add stresscoat went putting him back in. Not a good day .

PS: reason he got this treatment was because all the other treatments didn't seem to do much, some but not much.

This morning, he looks a LOT better. His Gills are not all gunky.

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He still has the red strip on his side. (Infection) and gills are better but not fully clear. I am afraid his scratches are going to be infected too, and Mr. Elephantnose is getting his patches back. So, I need to treat tank with furan-2 because my elephantnose can take it. I just do not know if the fry can. I can put them in another tank to be treated, because I do not have on big enough for the both of them without stressing them out. (only 8 gal) and the 8 gal –along with my 10 gal is going through a “CYCLE” not a good time.


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Curiosity killed the cat, but satisfaction brought it back.

Thats bad luck, looks like the cycle of reinfection is proving very hard to break. Theres not really much advice I can give in this situation, if you havent got cycled tanks ready for quarantines ,( lets face it, most people don't) theres not a whole lot that can be done except try your best and rough it out. Its always gonna be a problem when you mix the more sensitive tropicals with other fish.

Sorry to hear its all going a bit pear-shaped.

nonononono,,, that is not what I want to hear. I don't want to lose any fish, not any. These are my kid, my babies. what next shall I try????

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Curiosity killed the cat, but satisfaction brought it back.

thinking hard now...

Do you have enough stuff in the big tank to supply the qt with an instant set up of mulm, old tankwater, and filter media? That way you wouldnt have to wait for the qt to mature, and the other fish get a bit of a clean..

..ultimately I think mr elephantnose might have to live in a different tank in the end, when finances permit etc.As your discovering daily, a fish that cant be treated with powerful meds often reinfects others , or prevents others from getting the treatment that perhaps even an entire tank requires. Sometimes its the tank that needs to be purged of infection and no amount of qt's stop the fish getting reinfected. Its the same situation with a lot of fish, like angels and discus together, certain species with certain vulnerabilities just keep reinfecting each other.

You have some nice breeding rainbows and a simply adorable mormyrid, it would be a shame to lose them if this keeps happening. If it were me , I might have the general community including the rainbows treated in situ with strong meds, and the elephantnose in his own tank free to be treated in situ gently , and given longer to recover. Then keep them seperate.

Last night, (for me that is) we must have been thinking the same thing. I did take my QT tank and swapped out the gravel from large tank. And added the water too. I would love to put the fry in there, but that tank has no light. (this is why it became my QT tank.) I am just trying to rig something up for the lighting. Last night I also added .50cc of NH4 to keep the good stuff going, and this morning it read, NH4 .5 - NO2- .25 NO3 - 20. Now, before adding anything, ALL read Zip!, zero, except the NO3 it reads almost 0.5, put not quite.

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Curiosity killed the cat, but satisfaction brought it back.

OK, Baby fish out of tank!!! Tank is cycled And today is Day 1 of Furan-2 and mr elephantnose seems to be taking it well. Have QT ready for him if need be with nice fresh want.

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Curiosity killed the cat, but satisfaction brought it back.