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I know this sounds strange, but my Angelfish who has been laying eggs regularly was due to lay eggs again and appeared to be full of them. Her tube was out but no eggs. She was like this for about 3-4 days. And would not eat. Eventually her breathing was labored as well. She died Friday morning and I am still sick over it.

Here are my numbers: 0 Ammonia, 0 Nitrite, 20 Nitrate, temp 79 degrees, bi-weekly water changes and gravel vaccuum with 30-40% waterchange.

Any ideas??

With every animal and humans there is a risk of complications while giving birth. I have heard of several other fish and a few applesnails that were unable to lay their eggs. I'm not sure the cause of it but I'm certain it's nothing you did wrong. I don't know if there's a way to help them maybe someone else knows.

Thanks for your response. Now I know I may not be crazy after all. She was soooo beautiful. I am still sick over it.

If livebearers can hold onto their fry for long periods, I wouldn't be surprised if egg-layers can do the same with eggs, or by some biological defect (size, limited plasticity, etc.) can't get their eggs out.

I had a female betta die under similar circumstances, but I'm not sure about the cause. it was my assumption that eggs not being released could be absorbed. Either I'm wrong or my betta and your angelfish wouldn't/ couldn't.

I'm sorry you are still feeling bad about it.

What gets me the most is that she was so very healthy, well, at least she appeared to be. Even when she died, she didn't even look dead when I found her. I will probably never know, but I keep blaming myself even though I had no way of knowing what was wrong. I think of all the fish I have lost in my aquarium "career", that one hurt the most along with a clown loach I lost a year ago. I never realized I could get so attached to fish just like I am to my cats and dog

i've heard several cases of this happening specifically to Female CT

Daka<<<<

I'm so sorry for your loss! I know I'd be devastated if my favorite fish died, too. You really do get attatched. I suppose, like mentioned, it was just complicated birth... That's tough.

I don't know a lot about egg laying fish, but there's something called "egg binding."

"The fish is severly bloated in the belly only (not the whole body). The fish may also be lethargic, exhibit rapid breathing and have a loss of appetite.
Egg binding can occur in freshwater fish during their spawning cycle. If a fish can not find a suitable mate, has been fed a poor diet, or if the tank or water conditions of the aquarium are not ideal for spawning, a fish may not be able to release its eggs. There is no medical treatment for egg binding. The only treatment for this is to let the eggs be naturally absorbed into the fish's body.This process can be aided with Epsom Salt soaks. Siphon a bucket of tank water and mix in one slightly rounded tablespoon of Epsom Salt for every gallon of water. Add an airstone, place the fish in the water, cover the bucket and allow the fish a 15 - minute soak. Repeat this treatment daily until the fish begins to recover. "

http://www.pbsco.com/conwayfish/tips.htm#K

I know this comes a little late for your fish, but hopefully now you'll know, and others, too.

Last edited by Mogmog at 17-Feb-2005 20:40

I've covered this with someone who had an Otocinclus suffer the same fate ... in this thread (link follows):

http://www.fishprofiles.com/files/forums/Bottom%20Feeder%20Frenzy/54930.html?200502181809]http://www.fishprofiles.com/files/forums/Bottom%20Feeder%20Frenzy/54930.html?200502181809[/link][link=http://null

It also occurs with livebearers that can't release their babies for some reason. The exact reason for these complications is, as cited above, largely unknown, though several factors (again listed above) would probably contribute.

Oddly enough, it is possible to apply a kind of 'massage' technique to expel eggs from a fish, a process known in fish farm circles by the rather odd term 'stripping'. However, this is usually performed on big food fishes such as farmed salmon, or large Koi. It's a LOT easier to perform this procedure on a 5Kg salmon than a 100 milligram Otocinclus, for example, as in the latter case, without an exceptional degree of dexterity and sensitivity, one risks crushing the poor fish. With a decent sized adult angelfish, this might be less of a problem, but again, requires a fairly good comprehension of fish anatomy, i.e., knowing where all the organs and tubes are, and also requires the aopplicant to know where to apply the pressure, and in which direction. I have contemplated the possibility of a caesaean-type procedure in such cases, but without the requisite veterinarian training, I would be loath to inflict further suffering on a fish. I have in the past, when I didn't know properly what I was doing, and fired with the gung-ho and somewhat misguided 'can-do' attitude of a teenager, attempted egg-stripping from an affected fish, but the results were less than delightful, even though I took pains to try and be careful, having read a fair amount on the subject beforehand courtesy of an article in one of my infamous 1970s TFH back numbers.

Part of the problem arises when the female fish can neither expel the eggs, nor reabsorb them. What happens then is that the eggs effectively die inside the female's body cavity, and of course dead material inside the body cavity is a recipe for disaster. Septicaemic complications rapidly take hold (usually courtesy of our dear old friends Pseudomonas and Aeromonas among the bacteria) and the fish's life expectancy plummets as a result. While it would make sense to remove the eggs as quickly as possible from an affected fish because of this, actually achieving this aim without injuring the fish, particularly in the case of a very small fish such as a Neon Tetra, is, as can be imagined, fraught with complications.

Anyone attempting this procedure on a small fish, I would advise NOT using the fingertips. Instead, try and obtain something that's plastic and very flexible, so that it bends under pressure. That way, you can use that as your 'massaage' tool, and hopefully control the pressure applied better. Of course, if the fish is wriggling about, this doesn't help: some method of anaesthetising the fish non-lethally is needed. Experimentally, one could try something such as vodka (because of its alcohol content), but that would probably have a less than delightful effect too. Ideally, one needs a proper anaesthetic for this, which probably means trying to obtain sodium pentothal - not easy unless you're a certified medical practitioner, and then you have the problem of dosage, because it only takes a tiny amount of sodium pentothal to knock out an 80Kg human being on the operating table!

I suspect Shini might have some answers with respect to these complications ...

Last edited by Calilasseia at 18-Feb-2005 20:40

Last edited by Calilasseia at 18-Feb-2005 23:51

Panda Catfish fan and keeper/breeder since Christmas 2002