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Okay I think I will try that, I'm not really sure if this infact velvet. My angel is showing signs rapid gill movement now, but everything else is fine with it. Ill try to find that med.

Breathing heavily without flicking or flashing could mean other things, like infection or early dropsy.

If they are flicking, then you may consider half dose of some parasite med that is good for costia. Salt treatments are good, but the dose required is not good for scaleless fish.

Yes I repeated like the package said and it did have the indgredient you are talking about. I used a full dose then waited over 48 hours and did a 25% water change like it said and added another dose. Then i did the same but waited a few days this time. And now I just added the last dose in yesterday. I am going to use the parasite food tomorrow, because maybe it is an internal problem? Although it did say on the package of the parasite clear that it would treat internal and external flukes. Should I try a series of water changes?

Well I can see that one or two of my cories are kinda pale looking just a bit and they do breate heavily. My ottos also have the same breating problem and are confined to their little corner, it doesn't seem like they want to move any where else. What do you suggest I do then? It's been a while since they've showed these signs.

I am not using any pH adjusters. Dechlorinaters, yes. I have done 25% water changes after each treatment. I see the cories gills move rapidly! And the ottos seem to isolate themselves to the bottom of the tank.

Interesting. You are absolutely certain your ammonia and nitrite are zero, and not something like 0.25 or 0.5?

There are other possibilities. Bacterial infection in the gills. Ich can also invade the gills and sometimes only the gills in some fish. Medicating for this is a little more difficult. If you tried anything, I'd go for Rid Ich Plus at half strength after using activated carbon overnight and a water change. The problem with this is that if it is a bacterial infection, the formalin will further irritate them.

Not sure.

At the very least, I'd add some rock type aquarium salt for a slow dissolve. Cories can handle smaller doses if salinity is increased slowly. This will be soothing on the gills, replace any lost electrolytes and is mildly effective against parasites.

You could use 1/3 dose or 1 tsp per 5 gallons to start and see how they tolerate it. If you put it in a small glad type container with holes poked in the lid, you can sink it to its side and the salt will take about 2 days to dissolve. Nice and slow.

Here's what I do.
Cory_Di attached this image:


Last edited by Cory_Di at 29-Jan-2005 21:32[/font]

Well I'll do some tests tomorrow to make sure everything is okay. I've tried salt before and I usally put it into a fish net and let it dissolve.

Check your parameters again just as a sense check. If there are low levels of nitrites, it can cause itching.

Are you using any kind of pH adjuster?

And, are you using dechlorinator.

How frequently are they flashing/flicking? Some of that is normal, like if they are feeding and something gets caught. If you look carefully when they eat they take in food through the snout, then bits come out of the gills as they refine and chew it. Mind will bang themselves sideways if a piece of food gets caught in a gill, sometimes violently. Then, they'll carry on once it is dislodged. It is continuous flicking that is a concern.

Once your treatment period is over, I'd do a water change. That really should have checked it if it was truly gill flukes.

I have seen some flicking and darting around the tank and scraping.

Sounds like you may need something for parasites. However, if you treated with Parasite Clear, it can't be gill flukes - the prazi would have checked it.

I would get something that could cover a range of parasites including costia, chilodinella, etc. But, only treat them at half strength.

Formalin is a well rounded anti-parasitic and the treatment of choice for costia, if it is salt resistant. I don't know that salt treatment is an option for cories, at least at the 0.3% required if it is not salt resistant and 0.6% if it is, and even that may not work. Formalin is a component of Rid Ich Plus. Many of our members have found success with it, even with sensitive fish like loaches. I don't know about full strength so if in doubt, dose it at half strength. In fact, you may want to start with 1/4 dose like Saturday AM, then a couple hours later add the other 1/4 dose. It's just a slow acclimation. Follow treatment advice and whenever formalin is involved, make sure there is plenty of aeration and you may see the fish respirating more heavily It is a gas. Don't increase temp either as it is already robbing the water of o2. I wouldn't be surprised if your cories are gulping more air while it is in the water.

Let us know what you do and how it turns out.

It will kill snails, including those buried in the substrate, which could give rise to ammonia, if there are many dying in there.

Last edited by Cory_Di at 02-Feb-2005 20:53

Did you repeat the Parasite Clear after 48 hours?

I think gill flukes may require more than Jungle estimates on their dosing. For example, Prazi-Pro specifies 5-7 days of treatment. It is praziquantel, the same ingredient in Parasite Clear.

First, check your package of Parasite Clear and make sure it lists Praziquantel in the ingredient list. Jungle reformulated it without changing the package and you could have picked up an old one off the shelf. If you have Prazi, then this is what they need.

You may consider getting straight praziquantel and following instructions on the Prazi-Pro. I've only been able to get it through the web.

Here it is in liquid form, which I had not seen before. Otherwise, you get the powder form, mix it with a little water to make a slurry then put it in the tank. For intestinal worms its a one time dose. For flukes you have to go longer.

[link=https://http://store.yahoo.com/koilagoon/prproheaid4.html]https://http://store.yahoo.com/koilagoon/prproheaid4.html" style="COLOR: #C000C0[/link]

[link=https://www.goldfishconnection.com/shop/details.php?productId=30&parentId=21&]https://www.goldfishconnection.com/shop/details.php?productId=30&parentId=21&" style="COLOR: #C000C0[/link]

Hey - here is that liquid even cheaper.

[link=http://www.rockymountaindiscus.com/prazipro.htm]http://www.rockymountaindiscus.com/prazipro.htm" style="COLOR: #C000C0[/link]

Prazi is extremely safe, even for cories and other scaleless fish and plants at full strength.

Check your parameters one last time first. If there's even a hint of ammonia or nitrite, that would explain it. Anti-parasitic meds will only make such a condition worse.

Last edited by Cory_Di at 03-Feb-2005 09:44

I'm due for a water change either today or tomorrow so I'll check the water first then do my water change and see how the situation is. Thanks for your help.

Just a thought I had. Sometimes right after I do a water change some of my fish flash and flick. It depends on how soon I filled my water jugs from when they went into the tank. If I just fill them the day before, I get more of it. I do know that my water comes out of the tap at 7.0 and rises to 8.0. Last check of my tank pH was 7.7. When I do a 25% change, if the pH in the water I bottled hasn't risen to something closer to the pH of the tank, I think that is what causes it. I don't seem to see it when the water has aged at least several days or a week. I also notice more flicking when I use some water conditioners over others. I've had best luck with Prime and Stress Coat. Some others just didn't seem to do it.

Well my water's pH from the tap is 7.6 and my tank is stable at 7.6 also. It hasn't moved at all. I just noticed a goldish,whiteish spot above one of the fins on a cory. I've also noticed that it's skin was kind of mucusy. The rapid gill movements are only affecting some cories and I've noticed they will flick only when they are scared. For example I just fed them and they came out of their cave and when I moved they darted around the tank. I'm due for a water change tomorrow so I will do that and see how things are. My angel doesn't seem to have the rapid gill movements now and all the other fish are fine, except for my 3 ottos %!. They have became inactive and are still confined to their space. I'm going ot buy 3 more and see if that will get them more active.

Excess slime and flashing - costia comes to mind. Only salt therapy at 0.3% or 0.6% - most likely too much for cories and otos, or Formalin (half dose for cories) can kill it off, if that's what it is. This is where I would stick with Rid Ich Plus, just because many of our members have used it at half strength without killing their sensitive fish.

Unfortunately, microscopy is needed to veryify, but who has microscopes sitting around at 400 power.

Last edited by Cory_Di at 03-Feb-2005 22:33

Well I have used something called Nox-ich but I'm not quite sure if that worked. I think they have velvet since those spots. Does the goldish dusting havta be wide spread or can it be concentrated into certain spots? I'm going to do a water change today and run some carbon just to get any previous meds out and then I am going to treat with the Rid-ich + and see if that does anything.

Look at the active ingredients in the Nox-Ich. Are there any copper salts or any type of copper at all?

Know the ingredients. Mixing of certain components of ich meds can be very deadly. I believe it is copper that must be eliminated through water changes, not activated carbon. In fact, I think Mardel recommends maintaining "normal filtration" while using coppersafe. I have used it, then run activated carbon and still managed to get a significant copper reading. I had only did a 25% water change. I continued checking and it was coming down very, very slowly with each water change.

I believe Nox-Ich contains Malachite and Formalin. It is basically the same stuff as Rid Ich Plus. You may just need to use it longer and don't forget, if you are wisely using it at half dose, it may take more treatments over more days to get rid of the parasites. Straight formalin works for costia and it should work for velvet.

Formalin in any form is dangerous. Watch your breathing around the bottle and the tank - it is poisonous, cancer causing gas. Unfortunately, it is also highly effective for parasites and the only treatment for costia, other than salt. Malachite, copper - none of those will work. Without a microscope you can't say for sure if it is velvet or some other parasite. That's why I recommend something with formalin in it.

Yes, the gold dusting can be on only a portion of the body.

Here are some pics

[link=http://www.2cah.com/pandora/Disease.html#Velvet]http://www.2cah.com/pandora/Disease.html#Velvet" style="COLOR: #C000C0[/link]

Well, I am witnessing more of a spot, not a dusting. One of the cories colour is fading a bit. The active ingredient in the Nox-ich is Malachite Green and Sodium Chloride. It says to use for 3 consecutive days and use half dose or less for scaleless fish,cories and tetras. I really do no want to take a change with formalin seeing how dangerous it is to human health, and where could I get that?
EDIT: What exactly is a cyst? I am running through the disease identification just to check out diseases and i would just liek to know what a cyst is?

Last edited by ericm at 04-Feb-2005 11:56

My cories have had the gill flukes for the longest time. 3 of them died and I used Jungle Anti-Parasite food and things seemed to get a bit better. I replaced the three that died and things were quiet for a bit. Then gill flukes started to come back again to all the cories and spread to my ottos and angelfish but a very mild case for them. I treated the tank using Jungle Parasite Clear. Things are a bit better but one of the cories or at least 2 still having gill problems. They breathe rapidly and flash and scrape a lot. My 3 ottos spend all their time at the bottom of the tank walls which is not normal for them and they are always in the same spot and dont move around the tank much. What is the best solution?