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Hi, all. Haven't been on in a while, but I have a question. I have not added any new fish to my tank in many months, and all seemed stable. However, very recently (about 4-5 days), I have a single large tinfoil barb that's sick. He's got fuzzy stuff growing off of his body and one semi-open wound. His eyes are cloudy, and he just hangs around the tank. Doesn't eat. The other barb seems fine, as do the rest of the fish.

The other fish include two South American cichlids (one dwarf Texas and one quite large buttokoferi), bala sharks, silver dollars, cory cats and a loach. Oddly, the cichlids get along quite well with the others, though the buddo likes to dig huge holes in the gravel, and trying to keep my (fake) plants rooted is futile. 19 fish total, 50 gallon tank, dual filtration (canister & bio-wheel).

Any clues as to what he's got and how he got it? I do semi-regular water changes (about every two weeks) of about 15 gallons and replace filter media (alternating) with every second water change. All chemistry is good EXCEPT pH which for reasons unknown to me has droppd to about 6 (from 7.5 last time I checked).

pH = 6, Ammonia = 0, nitrites = 0, nitrates are a bit high at about 35 mg/l, water temp = 80F.

Thanks. Don't have a pic yet but if the diagnosis is fuzzy (pun intended), I can take one.

Fuzz usually inidicates a true fungus infection or columnaris. The sore would lean towards columnaris, but fungus can invade wounds too. Sometimes it is several things all going on at once, even within a small area.

Since only one fish is sick, I stronly encourage quarantine. If you don't have a spare 10 gallon, just get a 10-14 gal rubbermaid bin that size from a dollar store. Pick from the middle of the pile and rinse very well with just water to ensure no sprays, soaps, aerosols contaminate it. An airstone, fake plant or two, and a lid so he doesn't commit suicide are generally good. If you have a spare heater that is even better, but watch it next to the plastic. If you have a glass plate, stick it to that at the bottom. If you transfer the fish with at least 8 gallons of the water coming from the tank, it i less stressful. Transfer him before adding more water, then top off the other two gallons ensuring it within 1-1.5F of the tank water temp (using the same thermometer). If you don't have a heater, place it in the warmest room and wrap it in a blanket after loosely fitting the lid. This will slow the drop in temp to room temp.

I also suggest quarantine as 10 gallons is cheaper to treat than 55 gallons and you don't have to worry about messing up your biofilter. I would recommend something like Fungus Clear Tank Buddies and even better, Furan-2. If you can't find either of those, then go with Maracyn and Maracyn-2. They can be dosed together and one will cover the external infection while the other will dose what is internal. You can always include the new Jungle Anti-Bacteria Medicated Food now available in more stores in the US and possibly Canada.

I'll be out much of tomorrow so others can follow up. I hope this helps. I'm thinking he either may be getting old and his immune system failing, or he was injured maybe from a fellow tank mate just kind of ramming him to let him know who's boss. Such mechanical injuries lead to infection. I always dose melafix at the first sign of an injury to prevent infection.

You have another option to use Melafix and Pimafix, but for something looking that bad, I like to go straight for something powerful.

Thanks for all the info; much appreciated.

What has perhaps caused the pH to drop so much? I think it's too low for these fish and might be exacerbating the problem? How do I correct the condition and get the pH back to about 7-7.5?

Thanks!

No doubt the pH is in trouble and I should have looked closer but it was quite late when I typed that out.

The low pH could be the result of your water source, or it could be the result of an aging tank. For example, if you use RO water or have a water softener, it may be taking all the minerals out or at least those that buffer it.

One way you can check this is to do a few tests.

1) Test pH right out of the cold tap/well source and note it.

2) Put some water right out of the cold tap into a shallow dish/glass (about 1/2 cup worth). Throughout the day, stir it vigorously. After 24 hours or more, check the pH and see how it compares to (1). Gases are in tap water and when they dissipate, you see what your true pH is in the absence of those.

3) Check the kH right out of the tap. This would measure carbonate hardness. If it is zero, then you pretty much have water stripped of minerals that buffer it (like R/O water).

4) Check the kH of your tank to see how it compares to the tap.

If you don't have a kH test kit, bag two samples in a lock-tight bag, label them (based on 3 & 4 above) and take to the fish store. Hopefully, they use a liquid test and can give you actual numbers, as opposed to ranges or descriptions.

If your kH is low, we can buffer it with baking soda. In fact, after you bag some of your tank water for the kH test, dissolve just 1/4 tsp of baking soda and add it. Test your pH the next day. Keep repeating in small amounts and watch the pH rise. In that size tank, you may even want to go to 1/2 tsp, but I like to err on the side of too little as you can always add more the next day. The pH will rise as the baking soda is added and raises kH. A good rule of thumb is to not expose the fish to more than 0.2 change in 24 hours. Today you can go from 6.0 to 6.2. Tomorrow 6.2 to 6.4. If you see that 1/2 tsp doesn't raise it that much, try 3/4 tsp or a full tsp the next day. If you have RO or softened water, there are things you can use to replace minerals like RO right when you do water changes. Fish absorb them so it is not good for them to be in such pure water.

It's odd that a fish would have fungus in such low pH as columnaris doesn't usually function in acid water. It is hindered in pH below 7.0. You may have a form of water mold invading what was once a wound.

You may want to isolate this fish to treat so you have more flexibility with treatment (shark may be sensitive as may cories to some treatements). If it is a water mold, then you still may have some luck with Fungus Clear as it does address both the bacteria that looks like fungus, and true fungus. If you must medicate your main tank, the other fish should be able to tolerate it, unless it says to dose at half strength (read directions) for scaleless fish. But, it would be more expensive in a 50 gallon than in a 10 gallon.
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Now, I mentioned there was a second way the pH could drop. Typically in older tanks or tanks where waste builds up the pH can drop over time. Old Tank Syndrome typically has high nitrates, and some ammonia showing, along with a low pH, but that's not to say it can't happen without ammonia. Provided you are regularly (weekly) gravel vac'ing out the waste, this would not be likely.

I'm more inclined to think you have a low or nonexistent kh. That is not good on the fish as it can allow wild swings.

Last edited by Cory_Di at 10-Mar-2005 17:29

I have one tiger barb which I had observed swimming curved inside and isolates itself from the rest of the barbs. It is the first time I had seen such behaviour. I tried to find some artciles whether it is ill or something else, but not sure about anything at this stage. I transferred the fish to a hospital tank in case

ph 7
Nitrites: 0
Ammonia: 0
Nitrates: 30 mg/l
90 litre tank