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Some of our responses to newcomers can be disheartening too. I for one will think over my responses to posts for at least a few minutes now - to try and break things gently to them so they will follow your advice instead of feeling talked down to by some faceless name on a forum.

Also, the most help I ever got when starting out here with a tank full of ich was going into the chat section. I was able to get a rapid response from members compared to posting up a thread.

Anyhow, sorry for getting heavy there. Back to subject.

Last edited by Troy_Mclure at 16-Oct-2004 23:21

This is just my opinion, of course....
But what I have noticed, at least with people I have met and know...
Some people don't really care about the fish and tank. Almost everyone I know is mis-informed, won't listen, or just doesn't care.
So for those people, they never start off well, and it doesn't end well.
But I also think a lot of people jump in, maybe do or don't start off well....and get tired of the 'work.' No one believes me that if you do it right, tanks aren't a lot of work...at least after you get it going.
....well, unless you add more tanks and difficult fish...then all of the sudden your tanks are breeding, and you have 10 of them...LoL

I have to say that I respect gary and his experience. And I say this in no way to encourage him to keep doing what he does. To be honest, his frankness and his objectivity is what I like with his repsonses. If there is anything that is not clear, then I would probably have asked more details.

I can understand though why people take it the wrong way. But I would rather be told someone's opinions on a matter I am querying than be told off for doing something that is not to other people's taste and not even get an answer to my question. Just my opinion.

Humility is not one of my better traits...

But there are times, but rarely, that I get the urge.

--garyroland.

i have only been keeping fish for a couple months, and i must say it would have been A LOT harder without this forum, i havent had any rude responses or been made to feel like an idiot, altho it does take a lot to offend me so praps thats why. The thing i try and remember is you pro's get A LOT of questions usually about the same old things, so to us its just one question but for you guys its like the 100th time youve answered it, dnt blame you if you give short, sharp, straight to the point answer I actually think they're more helpful, (not all the time) plenty of time to chat after problems been sorted!

i should also say im not thinking about quitting, i probably would have if i hadnt found this forum tho. who knows what i would have killed / done!

Consistency is a much underrated thing,a bit like fishkeeping keep things constant and all will be well beacause you know where you are starting from.

Gibson SG you know you want one!!

Yes and no Shearonlynn. "Things" always change Shearon, just not Gary's behavior. He's been pretty consistent for the past couple of years that I know of.

Last edited by Tammy at 18-Oct-2004 01:50

Well, it seems like some things never change. Actually, Gary, I was thinking that you had begun to 'mellow' a bit!:88)

Gary has never meant to be rude (well, maybe just once or twice...usually to me), but sometimes he gets his logical brain in gear before he can get a muffler on his fingers!

Gary is very straight forward and pulls no punches, but you can pretty much take what he says to the bank!

Gary your interpretation of being 'straight and to the point' actually does come across as rude from time to time.

This isn't anything new though, and you know it and like it. This is a behavior pattern that you have been exhibiting for a couple of years. So, someone bringing it to your attention shouldn't be any big surprise. Do you have notches in a belt somewhere?

You enjoy upsetting people and there are those who enjoy watching you upset people and encourage you or defend your behavior giving you an excuse to continue. I'm not sure who is worse.



Last edited by Tammy at 18-Oct-2004 05:14

Nobody has said you have been rude gary.

I'd like to announce appologies as I entered this thread through the front page. I saw the subject and thought it was in the rec room. I am sorry. My opinion stands though.

Last edited by Troy_Mclure at 17-Oct-2004 18:38

Here in the Water Quality Forum I must say I haven't seen any "rude" replies...

Some of my replies have been misinterpreted as "rude" but actually were direct and to the point, not personal.

You'll have to copy and paste the rude stuff in "Premium Members" so I can see for myself exactly what you're talking about.

Our Moderators and Mediators are rather touchy about rude replies and can be notified of such replies.

--garyroland.

Last edited by garyroland at 17-Oct-2004 15:17

Well Gary I guess that's were you and I differ. I don't think I have to be rude to someone in order to get my point across. That's a big part of the problem is thinking that way.

One good helpful reply that resolves a water quality problem is worth a dozen unhelpful insults...

--garyroland.

I agree with Troy, I am somewhat of a newbie after several years out of the hobby. Quite honestly there are some people who reply to some posts and just come off as plain rude, or you get chewed out because something you are doing doesn't sit well with the person replying. They tell you how much of a mistake you made or you shouldn't have done that or whatever. I too have thought again of leaving the hobby AGAIN, not because of some of the troubles I have had with my tanks. More or less because some people go out of their way to make other people feel stupid, when in reality we are all in this for the same reasons. I just don't see why people have to be like that. Don't get me wrong, the majority of people here are so nice. But the ones who aren't seem to be everywhere and sometimes, I think, just replying to see themselves reply! My two cents.

It's come to my attention that slightly more than 30% of new fish hobbyists drop out in the first year of keeping tropicals...

That's an awful statistic and sort of depressing.

Why??

It's the dreaded NTS...New tank syndrome.

Now you experienced hobbyists most likely know the ropes and the techniques of preventing NTS so my next article will come as no surprise.

In an effort to perhaps slow down the exodus of disappointed future hobbyists who start out with an instant water problem, my article will tackle the ins and outs of starting out right.

Who knows?? We may even pick up new and dedicated FP members in the process.

--garyroland.

Yeah Gary, I know... we've had struggles with the hideous green water... haven't had that happen since June (knock on wood) but now we're very cautious of the water in that tank. It's home to a few 3/4 in platy fry and a female betta so it's very much understocked and we will never again buy a small tank! Our 55g is so much easier to take care of! Looking forward to your next article.

-Beth

p.s. Learned the hard way, don't let your Mom feed fish while you're out of town-she squirted liquid fry food instead of letting it drip... original cause of green water.

Keep an eye on that 10 gallon, Beth. They're killers...

Great to see you're enjoying the hobby.

--garyroland.

You know, John, that's an excellent description...

"Depth and personality"...

Many times I've thought that same thought and wondered what I could do to change it.

I guess some of my trips to the local fish store to see what new fish just came in or to sell a few fish may have helped.

When I lost all 50 of my trops due to the two hurricanes, my first thought was I'm finished. But this was a chance to clean the dead and rotting fish out of the large tanks and start over with green Cobra Guppies, the very fish I started out with years ago.

At that time I had an excellent market for a special breed I developed, an all black Guppy with a large all white flowing tail and dorsal.

Think about working with something special. It may change your attitude.

--garyroland.

Wow, Shearon returns. That was a longer absence than even some of mine. It's good to see you back. Along with gary and probably everyone here, I too hope it was nothing too serious. So, the original trio is back again, eh?

Back to what gary said about NTS, I agree completely. When I first started, my tank was afflicted by this terrible malady and I almost quit. It is an excellent topic, gary.

Joe Potato

Well, my hubby and I are already planning our next tank... that will bring us up to 4 total... and we got our first 10g last January... so we're still going strong. Thanks to helpful advice we've read here, of course.

-Beth