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hey guys i have a 20 gal tank i was thinking of putting bolivian rams in... how many would i be abl to fit? right now i have other fish in the tank but im going to see if i can trade the fish i have for a little store credit if i cant then i will just have to stick with the fish i have. but my local fs got a new shipment of bolivian rams and my mouth just dropped.....and i walked out of the store with amazement because i know i would have bought some even though i dont have room for them.... plz help i cant wait to buy them! oh and will they be O.K with some albino cories???

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whats the full stock list of the tank? they would be fine with cories and 2 pairs of rams would be ok in that size tank. i think with the cories it would look less crowded if you stuck to one pair. this also all depends on your other fish, you may be better off keepign the other fish. ram liek to see smaller fish around it makes them feel safe.

2 pairs or a thrio is best for a 20 but ive seen as many as 7 2 males 5 females but the maintence becomes much morework theyre fine with cories n prefer softer acid water with plants
i have a breeding pair in a 10gallon now n wood keep 4 in a 20 depending on ur other stock

ok guys thanks i think i will just wait and think about adding rams or completly restocking with rams im still not sure...oh do rams give birth to live fish ro do they lay eggs? i would really want to know about their breeding process!

I wouldnt suggest adding 7 bolivian rams to a 20 gallon tank. They are quite a bit larger than blue rams. I have a mature male who is tipping 3.5 inches and hes only a year old. I wouldnt hesitate to say he may fill in even more. Rams are also territorial, espescially the males, and you wouldnt really want to put more than 2 in a 20g tank. Even in my 90g I have 2 males and they squabble over the best spaces constantly. I mean, no harm is done, but they sure pick on each other.
I would say go for 2-3 Boliv. Rams, no more. They love space to swim, and they are a bottom fish, so the whole top of your tank will be empty. Perhaps you could do this:
3 Rams
school of 6-8 Small fish like White Cloud Mountain Minnows, Harlequin Rasbora, Danios of some type, etc.
A few corys - Depends on how many, remember Rams are bottom feeding fish, and will need extra food on the bottom. Feed them with algae wafers, bottom feeder meaty pellets, and sinking crumbles and shrimp pellets- that sort of thing.
Bolivian Rams are an egg laying fish. IF you want to see babies, I wouldnt put any corys in there. Corys would def. eat the eggs if they could get at them.
In the wild Bolivian Rams form Harems, 1 male to several/many females, and this male will spawn once every 3-4 months with all these females, and help protect the young. Usually they will occupy a territory that he will patrol, and his harem of females will live and lay eggs in his territory for him to fertilize.
You would be best to get a small group say start with 3, and when they mature you will be able to see which are males and females (around 2.5 inches or so this will be identifiable, or if they spawn while younger you will be able to determine from the genital papillae. Rams like gravel or sand for spawning, and will pit spawn, the male will dig a big pit in the gravel, and then dance for the females, and if one accepts she will join him and lay eggs in his pit. I have found rams to love semi planted forest like areas, say one bushy stem plant like ambulia or cabomba every 2-3 inches apart or so. They love it!
I hope this answers some of your questions, and if you have any more, feel free to ask away!
Good luck with your rams, they are one of my favorite fish, and my second favorite cichlid next to Angelfish!


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i have a lot of plants in my tank... i have 7 will that be too much? do rams like some space? i want to strip the whole tank and add sand... will the pants like it? right now i have black gravel the regular gravel you buy at the pet store... i want to make it the best looking tank with the best looking fish i want to have a cichlid species tank only... please list all the peacful/somewhat peaceful cichlids i can stock my tank with. i want colorful fish but unique looking one too!

Last edited by BabyBlueEyes at 10-Feb-2005 23:00

Well, a 20g doesnt give you much space.
Did you mean you have 7 corys?
Well, I suppose it is ok, but Rams do like a bit of space. They do get quite big, like think overall size about 3 - 3.5 inches long, and about 2 inches tall from belly to back, excluding all fins of course. However, as long as you clean your tank regularly and make sure they are getting enough food, you should be ok till the corys get bigger.
Sand is pretty, but hard to grow plants in. If you wanted to do that, you would need to consider a couple of things first: What type of plants you have? Whether you are willing to plant them in little terracotta pots? What type of filter do you have? Would you be willing to replace it if it is one that sand will ruin? Sand stirs up very easily, so can get up in your filter and ruin the impeller/and or motor.
I love black sand too...but have hesitated for these reasons. However, if you can afford the price of sand, perhaps you want to look into a product called "CaribSea Ecocomplete" It is a black sandy looking stuff you put in your tank to grow plants in! It doesnt have to be rinsed, and your plants will grow like wildfire! Im sure any cichlid would love digging in it.
You could have more than 1 type of dwarf cichlid: you could have 2 Bolivian Rams, and 2 of either: Blue German Ram, Aggassizi Dwarf Cichlid, Cockatoo Dwarf Cichlid etc
Or you could have 2 Bolivian Rams and a Keyhole cichlid or 2. That would be cool. Keyholes are slightly larger and then occupy more middle space I believe.
You do have some option....just be careful not to overstock and do good water changes 1 time biweekly


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the substrate you mentioned "CaribSea Ecocomplete", how well it mix with tahitian moon sand? will it rise to the top of the sand? is it as black as tahition moon sand?

Yes it is just as black! I have no idea if it would rise to the top of the sand, but I know it doesnt lift or swirl in a tank like sand does, it is kinda heavy like soil is!
I am going to use it to replace the bottom in my 2 smaller tanks this summer. I wanted black tahitian moon sand, but my desire to grow happy plants outweighed the moon sand, and then after I had already done gravel, I found out about EcoComplete, and I was sold on it. But we are moving, so I am going to do the change after we move. It looks and smells like a rich earth soil, very dark black and heavy. Im sure you could mix it with sand, you would just need to stir them together every once in awhile!


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that is awsome thanks so much pete! i will look into that black sand like soil! and thanks for the advice!

As someone who has bred Microgeophagus altispinosa (Bolivian Rams) I wouldn't suggest more than 2 in a 20 gallon tank. I would be very hesitant to keep Apistogramma agassizis or any other dwarf cichlid in the same tank as some can be quite aggressive and territorial towards the more peaceful Bolivians. Concerning your corys, be mindful that they are notorious egg thieves. Plus, corys and altispinosa both stay near the bottom part of the tank so there could be a tendency for crowding, etc.

JazzyB:88)