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As most of you may know, I have a job at my LFS. I'm pretty well informed with community tank type fish, but we also carry many species of cichlids, which I'm not very familiar with since I don't keep them. I'm good with shellies, but there are only articles for convicts and oscars on FP and I'd like to know a little more so I can be a big help to the customers that ask about them. I often get compatibility/minimum tank size q's and I always have to refer them over to my boss. I don't really have a specific question, but one tank is just labeled "assorted Lake Malawi cichlids" and that isn't too informative. I know there's a lot of cichlid fanatics here, so if anyone wants to give me some advice it's more than welcome. I figured I'd try here before googling since I usually get better results here.

-Formerly known as the Ferretfish

for now, since I'm pressed for time, the best I can tell you is to read through as many threads (especially the ones with "compatibility" or "tankmates for..." in the title) as you can here in Cichlid Central, the Malawi forum, and the American cichlids forum. You can also read through the Tanganyikan forum, but there are probably only a handful of Tangs readily available at most lfs.

That will be a good start for you, and whatever further questions you have post here and when I get home from work tonight I'll do what I can to help you out. .

Just wanted to add that Calilasseia has done some excellent articles in the American cichlids forums. A few of which I added further information to as well. Just be sure to change to "Show all threads" cause they are no longer announcements.

Jason

Last edited by jason_r_s at 15-Oct-2004 16:25

[link=Cichlid-Forum.com]http://www.cichlid-forum.com" style="COLOR: #4040FF[/link]

An excellent site for both African and New World Cichlids. Click the library link on the left and it'll tank you to a bunch of info on species, feeding, breeding, etc. Compatibility info is addressed in several profiles, and can also be found by searching the forums there.

Another site for compatibility info which I have found helpful in the past is:
[link=http://www.cichlidrecipe.com]http://www.cichlidrecipe.com" style="COLOR: #4040FF[/link]
Click the Cichlid Compatibility Chart link.

well...what DO you know about cichlids?

more than likely the tank labeled "mixed lake malawi cichlids" are an assortment of cichlid species called mbuna. Mbuna literally means "rock dwellers" and they live up to their names. Mbuna cichlids come from the rift lakes of africa and live primarily in shallow water, defending small cave territories. Most get to be about 5 or 6 inches in length and in terms of diet, they eat both plant and animal matter, but lean more towards plants. They're digestive system is not made for a high protein diet so it's real important they get they're fair share of vegetation.

American Cichlids 101


One thing to keep in mind is that just because a certain combo works out for one person doesn't mean it will work for someone else. Each fish has its own personality and individual level of aggression, but then again most people that are into cichlids know that already. Also, before I start, everything that follows is my opinion from what I've personally experienced and from what I've read on this and other forums.

Now, there are different classes of aggression amongst new world cichlids. I'm kind of making this all up as I go along so bear with me. Here are the classes of aggression, a description and as many examples as I can think of:

Group #1 Non-aggressive but somewhat territorial--These cichlids will usually not show aggression or be territorial towards non-cichlid fish, but you will probably see territorial issues amongst males. Breeding pairs of cichlids in this group will become much more territorial and slightly aggressive...especially towards any other cichlids and probably even towards non-cichlids. Typically though, the most you'll see is flaring. Most of these cichlids, unless breeding, won't actually fight with other cichlids. Examples of fish in this group would include Keyholes, Blue acaras (Aequidens pulcher), Severums (all in the Heros genus), Firemouths (and all other Thorichthys), several Cryptoheros species including C. altoflavus, C. myrnae, C. nanoluteus, C. sajica, C. spilurum and Honduran Red Points. Also the Rainbow cichlid (Herotilapia multispinosa), Nicaraguan cichlid (Hypsophyrs nicaraguense), Electric Blue Jack Dempsey (only this color morph...both the Gold and Regular dempsey will fall into the next class), Angels, most or all Rams, most Geophagus or Gymnogeophagus species (only exception I can think of would be G. brasiliensis), Oscars (and all other Astronotus species), Chocolate cichlid (and all other Hypselecara species), and several Herichthys species (H. labridens 'Media Luna yellow', H. bocourti, and H. pearsei). Another important thing to remember here is that most of these cichlids will eat other fish if they are small enough. Another cichlid that would most likely fall into this group that would come as a surprise is the Bay snook (Petenia splendida). I've often heard these referred to as "Gentle giants". The only problem you'll run into is they get huge (18"+) and have incredibly large mouths. They are also very predatory and will eat any fish small enough to be eaten. This, however, does not make them territorial nor aggressive.

Group #2 Medium aggressive and territorial--Males and possibly even females of this group will have territorial disputes with other males, and unlike the previous group these cichlids will be much more likely to fight. These fish will vary on how large of a territory they'll need. For instance, the Parachromis species in this gropu will need a much larger territory than most others. When breeding, unless you have a really big tank compared to the fish, you'll want to move out other cichlids and non-cichlids. Examples here would be the Gold Saum, Jack Dempsey (Archocentrus octofasciatus), Texas cichlid (Herichthys cyanoguttatus), Pearlscale cichlid (Herichthys carpintis), Quetzal cichlid (Paratheraps synpilum...there are probably a few other Paratheraps that would fall into this group, but I'm only familiar with a few of these species), Pearl cichlid (Geophagus brasiliensis), Convict cichlid (Cryptoheros nigrofasciatus), the Salivini and Cuban cichlid (Nandopsis tetracanthus--these two are kind of iffy), most Caquetaia species (spectabilis, myersi, and kraussi), and most Parachromis species (loisellei, friedrichsthalli and managuense*** see bottom note).

Group #3 Extremely aggressive and territorial--These are the bad boys (and girls). These cichlids will be more than happy to fight to the death with other cichlids, and if the other cichlid is in a different group then 9/10 times these guys will win. Even with proper space, other cichlids and non-cichlids are not safe. Some of these cichlids might not mess with larger, non-cichlid fish but there are certainly no guaruntees. Breeding pairs of these fish must be kept in very large tanks and a divider should always be kept handy just in case. You'll have a much harder time keeping these cichlids with other fish than the other 2 groups. Examples include most Amphilophus species (citrinellum, labiatum, zaliosum, trimaculatum, festae), several Paratheraps species (P. bifasciatus, P. fenestratus), all Vieja species (V. argentea, V. maculicauda and V. regani--the regani might be an exception. also these are probably the least aggressive of Group #3), most Nandopsis species (haitiensis, istlanum, grammodes, beani, and uropthalmus), a few Herichthys species (H. pantostictus, H. steindachneri, H. labridens 'tamul/white'), the Umbee/Blue freckled monster (Caquetaia umbriferus) and a couple Parachromis (dovii and motaguense). Oh, the true Green terror (Aequidens rivulatus) would also most likely fall into this group.

Now, cichlids from Group #1 are most successfully kept with other cichlids from Group #1 or with non-cichlid fish. Cichlids in Group #2 can be kept with each other in large enough tanks. Cichlids in group #2 can be kept with some cichlids in Group #1 so long as the Group #2 cichlid(s) are small juveniles when purchased and the cichlid(s) from Group #1 are larger when introduced. Cichlids from Group #2 can also be kept with some cichlids from Group #3, again introducing them as juveniles and the Group #2 cichlid(s) should be slightly larger at introduction. Otherwise, cichlids in Group #3 are usually best kept solitary or in pairs unless you have a several hundred gallon tank.

Two popular types of cichlids I've left out are Crenicichla (Pikes) and Cichla (peacock bass) because I'm not as familiar with them. I'd say the Cichla genus would likely fall into Group #2, but most species in the Cichla genus grow huge and would require a several hundred gallon tank or pond. Also, they are highly predatory and will eat anything they can fit into their huge mouths. I do know several people that keep them with large oscars though. As for Pikes, some would fall into Group #2 and others into Group #3, but off the top of my head I couldn't begin to tell you which species went where.


***I'm sure there are many who would argue that the Jaguar cichlid belongs in Group #3. However, in my experience and a lot of what I've read from other experienced hobbyists, the Jaguar is not really aggressive per se. They are, however, extremely territorial and will fight with other cichlids in their territory. However, Given proper space, I don't think Jags would kill just to kill or go out of their way to pick a fight. They just need their space...a whole lot more space than any other cichlid in Group #2. I'd go with no less than a 180 to keep a Jag with another cichlid.

*edited to add Paratheraps and Vieja species.

Last edited by jason_r_s at 16-Oct-2004 02:09

OMG that's an amazing post, jason_r_s

Am on the verge of setting up a CA/SA tank, and that was a great help

Thanks a ton for that,
Dex

thanks Jason *throws purple gravel*

Well that certainly helped a lot! Now I just have to figure out which species we actually carry at work.

betahex- Thank You. Now the question...can they all be kept together? or only as juvies? Tank size? Tank mates? Those are the ones people usually want...the africans, b/c they have very nice colouring, and are relatively inexpensive.

I know enough of about Tangs, since we don't get that many in to begin with, and I want to set up a shellie tank when I get the time.

Can someone give me Rams 101??

I'm gunna dig up some old threads for some assistance. Thanks to everyone! And keep postin'

Last edited by FerretFanatic at 16-Oct-2004 20:55

-Formerly known as the Ferretfish

Rams and Apistogramma both have pretty much the same personalities.

Environment - lots of hiding spots and plants as they mostly hang out in the bottom 2/3 of a tank. Most people will use unglazed terra cotta pots. Driftwood is also another good option.

pH - slightly acidic to neutral is best

GH/KH - soft water is best (GH under 8) but can handle medium hard water.

Min tank size - 20g as best kept in trios (1m/2f) or better

Temp - typical tank temps mid 70's to 80.

Compatability - Any mid-top dweller really as they don't go up there much. Neon, cardinal tetras, hachetfish, harlequin rasboras, danios and the likes. Small schooling fish make them feel comfortable because they're "dither" fish. Bottom dwellers also work well. Most people keep cory cats with them as people who keep rams tend to do with in smaller tanks (40g or less). A school of otos (3 or more) is what I recommend to keep for algae control. Do not get them before the tank has aged for about 6 mo. as they need a good amount of algae.

Thanks everyone.

-Formerly known as the Ferretfish

I think the easiest way is getting involved with the species. I knew nothing about cichlids about 1/2 a year ago and now I'm a cichlidiot!

Start with a tank of them, soon you'll be researching on your own about various species.

I work at the LFS too, and most customers come in asking about the SW fish and corals, which I'm totally lost at. I starting gaining some knowledge by listening to my supervisor and boss talking to them.

I'd start with the various american cichlids, I find these are alot easier to know. Then go to lake malawi with the more common species, and work yourself to lake tanganyikan, the difficult species. This is usually more confusing as they have long scientific names and some dont have any common names (cyprichromis leptosoma, etc).

Hope this helps.