FishProfiles.com Message Forums

I have paired Angels in a 20 gal tank.... Amidst their nipping one another - they are eating less than usual.... Their tank is never "crystal clear" anymore.... Is there a cleaning fish I could add to the tank that would help? (As the tank is "bare" - ANY bits of food left make a mess!) ---- I'm doing more frequent vacs with partial water changes ---- but it really hasn't helped much.....

To thine own self be true...

If by 'cleaning' the tank, you mean cleaning up all the uneaten food, you could:
A) Feed the angelfish less; or
B) Get a school of corydoras

Cories are excellent bottom cleaners, will be left alone by angelfish, and are very entertaining to boot.

If it's algae you want to get rid of, try some ottos.

---

And when he gets to Heaven, to Saint Peter he will tell: "One more Marine reporting, Sir! I've served my time in Hell."

With two angels in a 20, I wouldn't add anything at all - that's already pushing it. Just keep vac'ing, feed less, and consider, if the tank is always dirty, whether perhaps it's overstocked.

-Molly
Visit shelldwellers.com!

You don't have to put up with a bare tank. Put some sand in the bottom if you think the fry might get stuck in the gravel. Quikrete Commecial sand is nice white sand and settles quickly after you vacuum the tank. Then you can put in trumpet snails for clean up duty.

I'm assuming you put in a piece of slate, but give them a choice, those tall plastic amazon sword plants work well my pairs almost always choose them.

Good luck with the angels and don't forget to put a sponge over your filter intake.

Mike

Maybe an Apple Snail to eat any left over food.

Don't add Corydoras, 20gal. is too small for a pair of Angels & a school of Corydoras.

:88)

http://www.flickr.com/photos/corydoras/
Member of the Malta Aquarist Society - 1970.
http://www.maltaaquarist.com

Mike R, for a breeding tank a bare tank is infact best, it allows you to see any mess on the bottom and vac it up easily. Plus when the fry become free swimming this allows the parents to see them if they fall to the floor wheras if there was a substrate there that fry would be lost in the substrate.

Cories arn't the best idea for an angel breeding tank as they are notorious egg snatchers.

HTH

Oh and yeah for a 20g with 2 large angels and hundreds of angel fry being fed several time daily that tank is pretty overstocked anyway and needs water changes pretty regulary.

Hi Bonny,

I think it depends what you want out of the tank. If you want to be a large scale breeder of Angels and turn your basement or garage into a fish room then bare tanks are the way to go.

If, however, the tank is in your family room and you want to watch the fish going about the business of raising fry. Then make it a dasplay tank. Put in substrate, sand would probably be best, plants, Angels like to move the wigglers from the slate or leaf they hatched on to another plant and maybe even another fish or two for the angels to guard the fry against.

I have three breeding pairs and all have substrate, plants and a little rockwork. Two of them have other fish in with them.

That said I have to tell you that one pair always eats the wigglers as soon as they hatch. Another eats them as soon as they become free swimming and the third is a very young pair and eats the eggs the morning after they've spawned.

I've tried them with and without other fish in the tank and it makes no difference, they always do the same thing. Some might consider this a failure but if I need Angel fry I snatch a batch of eggs and hatch them myself. I still hope they might get the hang of it, especially the young pair but even if they don't I still get alot of enjoyment from those tanks.

I also have a pair of Krebensis that does just fine in a tank with all the ammenities. No other fish though as the Kribs are too rough on them. I love watching them herd the fry around and park them in this pot or behind that plant. It would appear much less natural in a bare tank. So I have to clean it three times a week, so what. It takes 15 minutes max.

Got a little verbose there, sorry, Mike

dreamweaver was asking about for breeding purposes so i replied thinking the tank was solely for breeding purposes. I have also bred angels in a community tank and yes in that situation there is no need to have a bare tank (however i have only got the fry to free swimming for 2 days befoe beibng eaten (by who i don't know))

Well dreamweaver you've got a couple opinions anyway. I will tell you if you intend to breed angels in any quantity you will need more tanks.

One batch of say 150 fry don't take up much room for the first 2-3 weeks, you can keep them in a 10 gallon. Then you split them into 2 10 gallons. 2 weeks later you cull and pull out all the runts so that brings you down to 60 in each 10 gallon tank. 2 weeks later you'll need at least another 10 gallon but 2 would be better.

So at the halfway point to saleable size you have at least 30 gallons of Angelfish and 10 gallon tanks no longer do the trick.

Time to cull for deformities, short fins and the smallest 10%. Brings you down to 100 fish to find space for. Two 29 gallon tanks will get them to dime size if you change water 3 times a week.

Of course this is only if you intend to sell them. You can give baby angels away much sooner, especially to large cichlid owners.

Whew! I read back over this and boy do I sound cranky!
I considered changing or deleting it but decided it was info you should be aware of.

It is not my intention to discourage you. I love raising fish but went into it not realizing how many tanks I would need. At this point I have a 30, 29, 20 2-10s set up plus 2-10s stacked and ready to set up just for raising the fry to saleable size. Plus I have 7 other tanks that I can put some larger babies in if I need to. They are community tanks and the breeders tanks.

But I have 3 pairs of Angels. But I also only save about 6 batches of eggs a year.

So have fun and start hitting those yard sales. My advice is make an area for the tanks, all but 3 of my tanks are in one room, put plants and rocks and substrate in all of them, even the grow out tanks, and enjoy yourself.

Got carried away again. Sorry, Mike