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Just me having a bit of a moan

Just was on youtube looking to see if there where any blue ram vids and of couse after it had finished came the "piranha VS goldfish/cichlid/mouse" I have got nothing against feed piranhas live food, but do we realy need to recorded it on you tube! And people with comments like "yes that goldfish had it comming" I think it is sick. Just my little moan

You have every right to moan , some of the fish and animal abuse videos on youtube are sick, totally inexcusable, and in many cases illegal.

Im not gonna moan about the legitamacy of live feeding, because thats not what these people are doing. They are choosing large prey items that fight and die slowly, rather than just being snapped up quickly thus saving a lot of sufferring. Fish and mammals are tortured and persecuted to beyond any level a good fishkeeper would find insane. They often say its natural but theres nothing natural about it. This is clear cut animal abuse. Death metal soundtracks, people luxuriating in the carnage voyeuristically, jeering, and waving about mutilated but still living fish and mammals only serves to highten the sickening effect. There are aggressive species housed inapropriately in conditions that force them to fight, and others have fights set up deliberately. This is animal abuse for entertainment and it should be stopped immediately.

The authorities must act.

Youtube has supposedly pledged to remove such video's so report them immediately, and if youtube fails to get them removed it might be worth reporting them to the state authoroties of the owners of youtube and the potential states where the abuses are committed.

I've had more than enough of people getting away with this.

If I was the law I would find every video of this nature track them to source and prosecute anyone producing them or hosting them. Given that one particular website has a number of contributors attached , I can't imagine anyone who isnt stupid would have a great deal of trouble in tracking these people down. These people should never be allowed to hold their heads up in a decent society. These people are not cool, they are mentally ill, maladjusted and evil , and we should not permit it.


I would appeal to anyone concerned to make this issue as public as possible, and individually and collectively do as much to prevent it as possible. Put pressure on authorities to act and eventually they will have to, or be seen as incompetant.

well said longhairedgit any animal abuse is sick and wrong! How is the animal meant to know as the owner says "it was only a joke"

yeah I seen the video "piranha VS goldfish" thats just cruel to put a goldfish in a piranha tank and let it pick the goldfish apart alive sick very sick poor little gold fishie

stuff like that ticks me off and disgusts me... I know they eat live food in the wild and all, but to do it for sport and tape it... not good in my opinion!

For me it's 100% cruel to film these things & i don't agree, with feeding live animals to fish.

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Member of the Malta Aquarist Society - 1970.
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Yeah, I dont think amateur filmaking of predation is an especially good culture. Lets be honest here with 99.9 percent of large predators you can train them to take dead food early on, unless of course you get some wild caught ones who wont take dead, and a few rare species that instinctively only go for live food. Most of the people on youtube who say their fish only take live food are either sickos covering their backside, or people actually dumb enough to fall for the pavlovian training of humans by fish! Not a great kudos point for their personal levels of intelligence! Snakeheads, piranhas, clown knifes, arowana, polypterus etc can all be trained to take dead foods. Ive always managed it, that they cant merely shows a lack of ability on their part.

Besides we all know its excuses, they want to witness the carnage their predators cause, their pathetic excuses never washed with me anyway.

TBH though, fish do eat fish in the millions, it is natural, but predators with a few exceptions like ogre catfish etc, always go for fish they can easily snap up in one go, nature generally works that way, and fry survival rates of nearly all species reflect this in the wild. Predators generally dont stuff things down that are too big. A clean kill is an important thing for a predator, it reduces the risks of injury to the predator, and coincidentally means a small fish is overpowered very quickly.99% of the time a predator will choose a prey that is sick, or easily overpowered at a level of maximum overkill, that way the event is quick, and no more painful than a seconds crunching need be. Its efficient feeding. Its the inefficiency of the keepers feeding regime that creates the sufferring.When the keeper choses the fish inapropriately for the predator, thats when things go wrong. But lets not kid ourselves here, these buggers do it because they want to watch the chase, the sufferring and the death throes of a stricken fish. A guppy getting sucked up would be too quick and unsatisfying for them to enjoy. Lets be honest here a lot of fishfood for omnivores that eat flake has fish meal sourced from piscines that have been netted, crushed in the net or suffocated above water for several minutes, and then crushed up and ground down into fishfood, so cruelty is relative. I dont see that being any better than a guppy getting snapped up in a few seconds, but nothing in captivity should have to suffer the pain and terror of being ripped apart slowly by pirahna or left floating mutilated from a snakehead attack. All these fish can be given bite sized meals, and the death should be almost instant.

Feeding an 8 inch goldfish to a 14 inch snakehead is not what happens in nature, never will be.

Basic rule of thumb, is dont put a feeder fish in the tank that a predator cant catch quickly, and swallow in one go. Anything else is cruel as hell.

Most perpetrators of course will know this already as an indisputable fact, consequently they should not be treated leniently and prosecuted to the laws fullest extent, especially so, if they have the gall. They use half baked natural theories to excuse themselves, and frankly if I was a policeman I would throw an extra month in the slammer and a lifetime ban on animal keeping on them for having had the cheek to try. If they think its clever to bait people then let them realise why its not a good idea. None of the extenuating excuses of live feedings that may have to be practised by zoos dealing with rare and wild caught species really applies to them. These people make damn sure their animals only take live food, and that is plain wrong, and a window for them to increase the scale of their abusive behaviour. They also train newbies to do the same thing and think that it is the done thing via websites, that as far as im concerned are nothing more places to groom fish abusers, so that they can hide their crimes in a larger mass of people. The naivete of their followers disgusts me, and frankly, it makes more work for the rest of us trying to improve things.

These people are not just animal abusers, they are a force for animal abuse, they are trying to spread animal abuse and they should be stamped on as quickly as possible.

Do not be confused. These people are scum.

Everyone is right here.i just watched that video to see for myself and it show any lack of Morality to feed an 8 inch goldfish to one piranha when 2 1 inch minnows could have done the job.

Est solarus uth mithas,My honor is my life

What about the bloody MOUSE??? It's interesting, because on the yahoo rat rights group we actually had a conversation about that last night/this morning.

Especially when the idiot who made the mouse one mentioned that the fish were getting their MONTHLY feeding. WHO the H### does that???? From what I've read, in the wild a piranha will only attack something like that if there isn't enough food available, that it wastes too much energy? Anyone care to back that up?

It's morons like those who make owning predators illegal. I want a piranha tank one day, but can't have one because of idiots like that! I love the way they look(even if they are boring hiders most of the time) but noo, people Have to get them for thrills and then let them loose when they see how dull they really are

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Well yeah its tough for the mouse, especially so because its placed out of its own element, its death is nothing but panic,pain and fear from end to end, it knows its in trouble, and compared to even a snakestrike and constriction a pirahna attack in captive circumstances seems especially inhumane. Besides, snakes are on average much pickier feeders than pirahna and I would actually argue its easier to train all pirahna to take dead food than it is all snakes. To drop a mouse into water in an inescapable glass box is cruel to start with, to then allow it to lose limbs and be slowly torn apart, dying in sheer terror is doubly so. I wont get into the arguement about equating suffering to intelligence though because such arguements turn fatuous fairly quickly, lets be honest here, most creatures above thelevel of insect know when they are in mortal danger and pain.

With snakes though, most should be able to take dead food and there is more of an excuse for them to have live when they need it. Pirahna live feeding is nearly always the fault of the keeper.Pirahna naturally scavenge , often finishing off stricken animals that are hit by bigger animals,thus its perfectly natural for them to accept stunned, freshly killed or frozen and thawed fish. They wont take truly rotten food, but it may surprise you just how rank a piece of meat will have to be before it gets no consideration at all, a 3 day old bloated capybara carcass isnt necessarily of the menu, Ive seen them do it.They do undoubtedly scavenge, in many areas scavenging will make a primary component of the diet, and that lifestyle is completely normal for them. Snakes dont scavenge, to take dead foods for them is something they only encounter in captivity and as such you expect difficulties. Besides for reptile keepers a live feed is a relative term, when practiced by good reptile keepers, the rat or mouse is offered to the snake stunned, or fatally brain injured but still twitching rather than fully alive and aware. Thusly it is not aware of or able to feel the reptiles attack. The true live feeder squad among reptiles keepers can get just as twisted as the live feeding fishkeeper squad though, and I will in no way make excuses for them. There is always a way to avoid a prey species undergoing a great deal of suffering and anyone who doesnt make the effort in captivity is basically a SOB.

Besides ive been bitten by snakes, and hurt though it does among the nonpoisonous snakes, its not gonna hurt like a piranha bite. If anyone has had an injury that includes being bitten through to the bone, or had a break or a bone chip they will be able to attest to that. Its a different league of pain from a series of skin deep recurved pinpricks. Plus when a snake bites a mouse that mouse isnt gonna live long, it wont be getting away, the chase is over, and most rodents asphixiate quickly, very quickly, sometimes in as little as 4 or 5 breaths. A piranha may chase a wounded fish around for ages with the fish its chasing effectively mutilated or disemboweled. That is gonna hurt..

Piranha may take capybara and horses, but rarely without there being a prior wound or a very desperate food shortage. Besides, who's idiot idea was it that we ever mimic the cruelty in nature, you dont go to a zoo and see them ushering zebras into the lion enclosure and wildebeest in with the crocs... both species take dead food and get dead food, and so do and should piranha.

Ooh! Very well said ^_^

Hm, I don't remember the link to it, but I've seen one guy get a mouse he FOUND dead in his apartment and toss it in, seems like a good way to poison a fish, and there was another idiot who killed a nearly fully grown lionfish because he found a freaking TOAD outside and tossed it into the tank. Well, turned out toady was poisonous. Bah, people in general need to do MORE research on what they are keeping and stores need to tell people how to PROPERLY care for the creatures at their mercy -_-

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