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Ok Sirbooks and some other's (sorry still new and dont remember any names ) and they suggested some clean up crew...but at the time i knew like... this much about them... NOTHING...so I FINALLY made my way to the LFS today... looked at everything.... (they have live figi rock for $7.99 a pound... OUCH) and so..... I was looking at the fish (they had like NO gobbies ) but anyway's... I was looking at the clean up crew... they had these crabs and hermits and snails ( im NOT going to do snails) and the um....oh shrimp... and I was looking at prices and I just wanted to LOL so (sorry...) what are some good clean up crew for a 10gall nano....??? THANK YOU! oh and if you could a little info....

29gall-2 bolivian rams, 6 neon tetra, 4 lemon tetra, 2 lamp eye tetra, 6 black skirt tetra(which are rescues...long story, but finding good home soon), 4 zebra danio 10gall, pretty much nothing but plants....2gall-female betta
1gall-female betta

Personally I think snails are very important to a tank and one of the most important parts of your cleanup crew in a small tank. They stir the substrate which hermits don't. Clean the glass which hermits also don't and you can't always get every piece of glass without disturbing the whole tank. Are better at finding left over food and getting into cracks in the rock. Above all else they don't rearrange your tank like my hermits which insisted on throwing small rocks and my cluster of feather dusters out onto the sand where the dusters died. Hermits most definitely have their place and I wouldn't remove them from the tank despite their faults but before you rule out snails make sure to do your own research and read a variety of opinions. You'll find many more people who avoid hermits and worship snails than the other way around. Especially nano reefers looking to keep more sensitive inverts or corals that the hermits will destroy. Many that keep small tanks even without corals see hermits as more... "decorative" I suppose than a part of the cleanup crew. Mine aren't bad but I rarely see them doing anything useful. They eat a very tiny amount of algae and leftover food compared to my snails. you're more likely to see them pushing my fish and shrimp out of the way to get choice bits than keeping the tank clean of what noone else wants. You do also need to research your snails and what you want in your tank. There are many varieties of snails with different sizes, diets, and habits. Some you will never see because they'll live below the substrate and only pop up to grab some leftover food real quick. Some blend into the rock and some have brightly colored red, blue, red, and/or striped shells that you can pick out from across the room.

Shrimp are interesting but don't serve a huge purpose in most tanks. Peppermints and camel shrimp can eat pest anemone like aiptasia, cleaner shrimp will sometimes help clean fish and keep the level of parasites down, and all will help cleanup the sand and rocks a small amount.

In a 10g I would do 1 peppermint shrimp cause I like shrimp and pretty much no other reason, 10 nassarius snails, 5 nerite snails, and 3 hermits. Adding too many hermits will cause arguments over shells and is more likely to result in a hermit death no matter how many shells you provide. They always seem to want the shell their tankmate is currently wearing. I dislike cerith and astrea snails despite the fact they are usually the snails of choice. You can of course setup a cleanup crew completely on hermits if you really want but your crew will be lacking useful skills requiring more work and maintenance on your part.

I ordered pretty much everything online for my tank except the fish which I spent 6months waiting for a goby I liked to show up in the lfs. I have very few options for saltwater stores here so online was much cheaper even with shipping and I got what I wanted.

hmmm...well I guess im getting snails but they are the cheapest of them all so I shouldnt complain im still working out the fish thing though...... oh well, I might upgrade to a bigger tank later but that wouldnt be for a while...HEHE!
Thanks... I will have to go look at the LFS again...LOL cause I like the bumble bee snail..those are cool...hmmm
thanks
oh I know JUST how you feel...here in TN their is NOTHING UGGGG we have like one LFS that I actually trust (their is only 2 that I know of... the other is just crap....) but this one is TINY.. I mean like....... the size of...a wendy's maybe... LOL so they dont have a big selection... I mean they have the fresh water and salt water... they have a LOT of tanks (thats were I would get a BIG tank if I was ever to get one....) but their prices are so/so...although their yellow tailed damesel fish (I know I know to big for my tank ) are like $5.99 and so is the 3 sriped damsel and the domino damsel.... then the false percula (sp) clown is like $25... WAHH I am only 14 I dont make THAT kind of money.....
oh well...thanks for all the help! Im sure I will ask more questions! thanks Sham!

29gall-2 bolivian rams, 6 neon tetra, 4 lemon tetra, 2 lamp eye tetra, 6 black skirt tetra(which are rescues...long story, but finding good home soon), 4 zebra danio 10gall, pretty much nothing but plants....2gall-female betta
1gall-female betta

"...but before you rule out snails make sure to do your own research and read a variety of opinions."

I fully agree. I have a mild dislike for snails and a fondness for hermits and various other crabs. I decided to leave snails out of my aquarium for a number of reasons, and not just my personal feelings. For one, I don't rely on maintenance animals. I don't mind stirring sand during water changes or scraping off some of the glass. In fact, one of the reasons I didn't want snails is because I wanted to have enough algae to feed my fish indefinitely if needed. I have an angel which likes to browse the side and back walls of the tank, as well as the rocks. If he didn't take my foods he'd still have a supply of vegetable matter to feed on. At one point I had my heart set on a tang, which would have made the algae even more important. Many snails would have eaten it all themselves. Sure, a group of sand-stirring snails would help me out with the sand bed and do a better job than me, but I just don't have the inclination to go out and buy any. Most folks are more than happy to get themselves a bunch of snails. Some even go so far as to get too many (especially algae eaters), and the snails eventually eat all of their food and starve. Moderation is needed with any animal, even janitors.

I'll definitely admit that I'm partial to hermits even if you don't consider the cleaning tendencies of some species. I like the way they act, I enjoy watching them go about their business, and I like that they're more attractive than snails. Almost any nice snail shell (tiger turbos are the best I've seen, Trochus spp.) can be given to a hermit. The crabs themselves are pretty sharp looking too- ever seen electric leg hermits? I'm a big enough fan that I have five species of hermits in my aquarium.

If you do want hermits, I'd go with more more than four. You'll be fine with either scarlets, blue legs, or red legs. All are decent scavengers, eat algae, and stay pretty small. Nassarius snails are good for cleaning out the sand bed, so you may want some of them. If you want an algae-eating species, avoid Turbo snails. They get kind of large, and I feel that they are too clumsy for a ten gallon. Maybe go with astreas.

I again agree with sham on the shrimp. They aren't what I'd consider as part of a "clean-up crew". Shrimp are decorative. For me however, there's no point in buying an animal unless you like it for it. I make a point of not purchasing something just because it does a job. I own catfish because I like them, and I own hermits for the same reason. Never regret a purchase.

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And when he gets to Heaven, to Saint Peter he will tell: "One more Marine reporting, Sir! I've served my time in Hell."

man you guy's put a lot more meaning to what I would have thought.. hmm well I only had a limited time at fins (the LFS) today...but I kinda did like the hermits.... and I like the shrimp... I like the way they move from rock to rock... they are SOO COOL!
Thanks everyone.. I have a close freind in which I JUST found out used to breed clowns and had a 150gall so she is going to give me some books to read....
thanks everyone! I will be back to ask questions!
ps. I hope im not like "annoying" im still in the learning stage and wont be getting it "set up" for quite some time now.... but I want to take my time to learn all I can

29gall-2 bolivian rams, 6 neon tetra, 4 lemon tetra, 2 lamp eye tetra, 6 black skirt tetra(which are rescues...long story, but finding good home soon), 4 zebra danio 10gall, pretty much nothing but plants....2gall-female betta
1gall-female betta

For nearby saltwater I'm limited to the 1 wall petland has. Otherwise I have to drive 45mins to have only a slightly larger selection. Rock was cheaper online anyway even with shipping cost. My saltwater tank was also 3years in the making and savings before I mixed my first gallon of saltwater. I planned out 4 tanks on various forums before actually putting any of it into practice.

There are a dozen ways you can stock any aspect of your tank provided you don't have conflicting tankmates. That's why I said to research it yourself and get more opinions before you get set on definitely having or not having something. I prefer to cut the maintenance and hands on work I have to do as much as possible. I've setup some tanks that were pretty close to self sufficient like my freshwater shrimp tank. Quite a challenge to apply that tendency to a marine nano so I looked for a cleanup crew based on usefulness and efficiency first. If you are more interested in watching them than actually having them work for you then it doesn't really matter what you get but you'll have to do their work yourself instead. In some cases it can add several hours a week to the time your tank maintenance takes.

Bumble bee snails are fine for a fowlr tank. Not the most useful of snails but I've got one in there somewhere cause it looked interesting. They mostly just stay on the rocks and rarely travel to the sand or glass. They don't really have any negative impact on a tank so long as you don't go overboard with them.

I dislike astreas because they have a tendency to get stuck upsidedown and die. In a nano a dead rotting astrea if you don't catch it can be enough to cause poor water quality and further deaths. That's why I go with nerites which also have pretty much every color of shell you can think of. However they do have their downsides too. When happy they will leave white dots on the glass from their eggs which won't hatch successfully but have to be scraped off manually. If your checking your tank frequently to flip the astreas over before they die then you might prefer them to scraping eggs off the glass every couple weeks.

I decided it best to avoid crabs(not the hermit type) even though they are interesting to watch. They are some of the most destructive and least predictable inverts you can attempt to stock. Some people love them and have no problems with them. Some end up spending all their time cursing at them and trying to get them back out of the tank. Especially when your supposed algae eater decides to eat your fish. I don't think they are worth the risk to my expensive little tank.

I understand... I have to drive 30 miles to get anywere so........
well I will be reading a LOT over the next few weeks.....
Thanks!

29gall-2 bolivian rams, 6 neon tetra, 4 lemon tetra, 2 lamp eye tetra, 6 black skirt tetra(which are rescues...long story, but finding good home soon), 4 zebra danio 10gall, pretty much nothing but plants....2gall-female betta
1gall-female betta

I tend to agree with Sirbooks. Usually it is recommended to go with 10 blue leg hermits for a ten gallon. They stay really small, and it is easy to get some larger aragonite that has shells big enough for them to move into which is nice. Ceriths are another good choice at 1pg they live in the sand and will really get after turning it over. I have turbos and they constantly knock my rocks containing corals over I hate them, however, my astraea's don't do that because there not big enough. Remember verity is the spice of life, and in our case ecosystems. In addition to the peppermint shrimp which usually hides during the day, I would get a small neon goby because they will eat waterborne and attached parasites in your tank, plus tank raised ones will clean your hand and play in your fingers if there personable like mine was(he jumped into my overflow and drown on air). In a tank that small you also may want to think about some macro's to absorb extra nutrients. I keep money plant which looks like a chain of coins there really nice and worth the look into. As for a place to get stuff and not get shafted look at reeftopia.com, my reef group just put in a 500dollar order and saved about 500 dollars just on there retail which is still a half to a third of local. So just a little food for thought.