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Those are under T5HO, and were under pc before that. But some like to argue about which has more light output(PAR) T5HOs or halides. They are pretty close watt for watt these days, especially with nice ballasts.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Unfortunately, my order got delayed I really am uneasy about this company that I ordered it from now. They really have terrible customer service from the little bit I've dealt with them thus far. Long story but my credit card got rejected because of a silly typo (didn't use my full name) and they didn't bother calling me to inform me it was rejected, they just figured that I would magically know. So they didn't send it out. So when I didn't get the shipment today, I called and then they told me.

But it'll be here on Tuesday and I can't wait. I am sure I'll have TONS of questions about corals since this is the first experience with them. How long should I have my lights on with corals (ball park figure of course)? Do I need to get Marine Snow to help fed them? Do I drip acclimate them like I would a fish?

I'll get pics as soon as I get them and they are settled!!

-Josh

One more question about the feather dusters...

In the post below you were discussing that certain types of feather dusters consume calcium

Incidentally, since Serpulid worms secrete calcareous tubes, they extract calcium from the surrounding seawater for the purpose, and so, you might need to consider topping up your calcium levels by some means if you wish them to continue growing nicely. That's of course if yours are Serpulids.

Are Sabellid feather dusters fit into that category? Sorry, I'm not too keen on my classifications (Genius, Species, etc..) Thanks! I am getting everything Tuesday and I really can't wait. It's been a tough weekend because I want everything NOW



But as we all know, having an aquarium means you must have a great deal of patience

-Josh

As stated above, Sabellids not only differ from Sepulids in the arrangement of the feeding tentacles (radially symmetrical crown resembling a palm tree in the case of Sabellids, helical and "Christmas tree" like in the case of Sepulids) but differ in tube construction too. While Serpulids construct calcareous tubes, Sabellids contruct parchment like tubes from proteins. If you get the chance to compare a typical Sabellid tube with a typical Serpulid tube (ideally because there's one of each in a dealer aquarium side by side) you'll notice that the Sabellid tube LOOKS as if it's papery in texture, is usually more free-standing in the water, and is more likely to be associated with a piece of porous rock as the anchor site than a Serpulid tube. A Serpulid tube will be partially buried in the anchor site, the anchor site will be much more likely to be a dead or live coral head (if it's a live coral head, the coral polyps will reduce the exposed extent of the tube with their own activity) and what part of the tube IS extended into the water will be visibly 'rocky' in appearance. In fact, it's entirely possible that a Serpulid tube will have some of the coralline algae of its host growing upon the exterior.


Panda Catfish fan and keeper/breeder since Christmas 2002

Thank you so very much

-Josh

I got all my stuff today. I am a little confused about the goby however. I thought I ordered an orange spotted goby, but by the size of the fish I received it has to be a Diamond Watchman Goby. I think that is going to get a little big for my tank (29 gal). He is probably 3.5"-4.0" long I'm afraid that he is so big that'll he'll not have enough to eat. Not only that but he'll rearrange my tank (LR), causing an avalance. I am going to put him in the sump right now (as I can at least catch him in there, if I need to). I might have to give him to a coworker with a bigger tank.

My stock with him would be as follows:

3 - Ocellaris Clownfish Amphiprion ocellaris
1 - Green Clown Goby Gobiodon atrangulatus
4 - Peppermint Shrimp Lysmata wurdemani
1 - Diamond Goby Valenciennea puellaris (I'm certain he is a Diamond Goby and not a Orange Spotted Goby)
Misc Snails and Hermit Crabs

Oh boy, Do you all think he's too big or would be be ok? My substrate is probably 2.5" deep...

I am doing my drip acclaimation right now. I'll put them in before I go to work and probably get some pictures tomorrow morning/afternoon.

-Josh

Orange spotted goby and diamond watchman goby are often both used to describe Valenciennea puellaris. Aka pretty prawn, orange diamond, orange dashed...http://www.reef-tank.org/nano/puellaris.html Then the name orange spotted goby is applied to several other species. Don't rely on common names especially when dealing with saltwater fish. Most have 5-6 common names. Several sites say it gets up to 6".

3 occ clowns can be trouble. Just keep a pair, as the odd fish out will usually get beat up until dead.

Also, keeping that many peppermint shrimp can be hard on any zoanthids you might want to keep because it will be harder to keep them all fed happily so they don't go around nibbling on things that resemble aptasia(like zoas). If you are wanting to keep these as aptasia control, you won't need more than one. I keep only one in my 30g tank and one in the sump. They do the job very well and they aren't shy by any means, you will see them around all the time.

If you want other interesting inverts to replace the shrimp, maybe try porcelain crabs. These are very neat and colorful filter feeding crabs.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

According to my copy of Burgess' Mini-Atlas, Valenciennea puellaris is a 12 cm fish. fishbase, on the other hand, has this fish reaching a whopping 20 cm. That's definitely a trade in fish in a setup as small as yours.

I was going to suggest Amblyeleotris randalli as an alternative because my Mini-Atlas lists it as being just 3 cm. Fishbase, however, lists it as a 12 cm fish. Eeek.

It seems most of the Amblyeleotris Prawn Gobies are a similar size.

I was going to suggest Fusigobius neophytus as an alternative, but again, Burgess' Mini-Atlas is out of date - it lists that fish as 3cm, but Fishbase quotes 7.5 cm. Also, Fusigobius neophytus has listed among its food items assorted polychaete worms, which means it might try eating your tiny feather dusters - plus it allegedly requires copepods/amphipods from a refugium again. Argh.

Likewise, Signigobius biocellatus is quoted in the Mini-Atlas as a 5 cm fish, while Fishbase lists it as a 10 cm fish. This is getting ridiculous.

Ah, found one that the two sources agree on - Mahidolia mystacina, another symbiotic prawn goby, which reaches 8 cm max.

Gobiodon citrinus, the Saffron or Lemon Goby, might be a better bet. 6.6 cm. And easier to keep. Either that or see if you can get another atrangulus.

Personally, I wouldn't keep clownfishes at all in anything under a 40. For one thing, you're pushing your stocking seriously with three of them, plus there's the aggression issues cited above.

Fish options are seriously limited in a 29. I was going to dig up one of the smaller liopropoma Cave Basses as being a possible alternative, but your problme with that choice would be it would eat your Peppermint Shrimp.

I think you're in for an interesting time finding small and compatible fishes for your setup. A very interesting time. About the only thing I can suggest that would work in your setup would be - IF you can find one - a goby belonging to the Genus Bryaninops, because these fishes are tiny. Bryaninops natans, which as this photo illustrates is a beautiful tiny fish, only reaches 2.5 cm, and even in a small setup like yours you could have four of these living alongside each other. Feeding a tiny fish like this is going to be fun though.







Panda Catfish fan and keeper/breeder since Christmas 2002

I don't see why a 40g would be needed for Ocellaris clowns or really most of the clowns for that matter. They are a favorite nanotank fish and often get along in tanks as small as 15g so long as you don't keep too many for the size of tank or odd numbers. A pair is best unless you have something around a 4' tank.

See if you can trade in 1 clown, 1 peppermint, and the goby anywhere. Then I would get a small goby like neons(Elacatinus oceanops), red head goby(Elacatinus puncticulatus), or possibly a rainford's or hector goby which are both Amblygobius species. These are all common found in even small stores or petstores that only have a tiny saltwater section. The first 2 get around 2" and the last 2 close to 3". There is some debate on what the rainford's goby eats though and whether they can survive in a tank without a constant supply of algae. Others have kept them for years without problems. Might just be a problem with the small nanos, 10-20g, some people try to keep them in.

Thanks everyone for the replies...

The tank makeup has changed a little bit since yesterday. Some of my fine-finned creatures have taken a "vacation" to my coworkers tank. I gave him a couple of shrimp and the whale of a goby. He have a couple hundred gallon taken, so he's in better shape. The clowns are too tiny for his tank so I'll have to keep them for awhile until they are larger. They are playing, as ussual, still. I don't see any aggressive behaviors with any or them. If all else fails I'll have to put one in the sump until I find someone with a suitable aquarium. Unfortunately, the LFS won't take fish from customers, even without compensation.

In all honesty, I don't know why I decided on all the shrimp. After thinking about it, it was a poor decision. It was a moment of laspe judgement.

The reason I was wanting the goby was to "stir up" the sand continuously. I was thinking about getting a bunch of Nassarius Snails, would that be a good alternative? Or am I worrying about something that really isn't a problem?

As I stated previously, I got a green star polyp yesterday. How long will it take to come out and show itself? I know it'll probably take a few days but I just can't wait to see it Thanks everyone!

-Josh

I was thinking about getting a bunch of Nassarius Snails, would that be a good alternative? Or am I worrying about something that really isn't a problem?

Sounds like a good idea to me, and sand sifting is a good thing usually. I have about 5 or 6 in my display. They do a good job of keeping the substrate clean.

About the gsp, they could take a few days to get used to your tank parameters, and overcome the stress of shipping. They are hardy, so I wouldn't worry about them too much.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Thanks Matt. Besides Nassarius Snails, are there any other good sand sifters for a tank this size?

-Josh

Ceriths are good for cleanup and sand stirring. I prefer the nass though and marginella snails. The nass are better at cleaning up the tank but the marginella just look cool. Mine are all bright white and despite their small size when I feed the tank you can stand many feet away and still see them pop up out of the sand. Even whiter than the sand. Snails would probably do a better job than the goby. Fish don't cover as much of the tank and tend to hang out mostly in their favorite areas. They also blow sand all up on your rocks while diggin which is starting to annoy me.

Cucumbers are the oceans' sand sifters. Make sure you get a small one that isn't a filter feeder. Those (ones that have tentacles arrayed out in a fan) don't seem to do well in captivity if you don't supplement the tank with phyto regularly. The regular old brown ones tend to work the best IMO. We've had one at work in the display for over a year. I also think the poisions they leach when they die is mostly fairy tales. They probably refer to the sea apples, which I'd try to stay away from.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Hmm, sea cucumbers have their disadvantages though.

The principal one I can think of at the moment being aesthetic - namely that the brown ones bear a truly disgusting resemblance to the kind of things that dogs leave on pavements.


Panda Catfish fan and keeper/breeder since Christmas 2002

Everything has its drawbacks Cali. I think that depends on the specimen though. While they are all shaped the same way, color and patterns differ. Non poo-looking cucumbers can be found.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

I'm not too keen on sea cucumbers. They personally resemble poo to much. lol. I agree with Cali..lol I think the Nassarius Snails are going to get the job. They stay small and that's obviously important for the tank size.

Matt- do you have anything sifting your sand?

-Josh

What about microstars? Often come on your liverock, sand, or macroalgae. Great little starfish smaller than a dime. You can order some online from a few sites if you didn't get any hitchhikers. Mine clean up the sand and rock far better than the snails and they look cool. I like starfish There's 2 hitchhiking serpent stars somewhere in my tank but they were extremely small when I saw them so I lose track of them all the time. Cucumbers looked interesting but for various reasons I decided they weren't as good of choice as some other options.

Yeah, I'd say the majority of my sifters are nass snails. I also have a very few hermits, a few of those tiny serpent stars that sham mentioned, 2 peanut worms that I know of, let's not forget the bristleworms and copepods, and I used to have a rainford's that was constantly picking through the top layers of sand. I miss that guy. I wouldn't mind having a cuc, but I just can't buy everything I would like to.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

I never thought about my copepods and amphipod cleaning up the sand. I can't believe how many of those little guys that are out when the lights are off. Some of them are now getting more daring and are coming out during the day to forage for food. I think I'll just get some more narr snails in a few weeks

-Josh

Should I be concerned that the green star polyp hasn't "came out" yet? He is in an isolation box at the top of the water line so nobody bothers it. He is small and I was going to give him a little chance to grow before I let him out. Should I try to give him some Marine Snow?

-Josh