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Tetratech,

how come we never talked about UV Sterlizers to combat algae

Interesting question. How would it combat an alga that is not free floating? It would never reach the UV Sterilizer.

I don’t know much about this tool, but from what I understand it is more useful to “the dark side.” Downsides are clearly that it costs money and burns out. Upsides are that it destroys bacteria that otherwise could harm the fish (but also beneficial bacteria).

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Hey Tom,

The tank is a 46 gallon bowfront. Thanks again for the suggestion to contact Carib-sea as well as any dosing advice.

My Scapes

Well now you can rectify the past mistakes and start anew.
Now you can scape things the way you really wanted to.

Tell me how big the tank is also, I can tell you a simple a routine to maintain the NO3/PO4 in a good range for plant growth.

Test kits are a two edged sword, they can help if they are correct and send off on wild goose chases otherwise........

There are ways to calibrate the test kits to check them for accuracy, but many do not want to bother with it.

Regards,
Tom Barr

I took plantbrain's advice and called Carib-Sea about the EC and before I could even explain my situation, the guy stopped me and said "You got a bad batch. Limestone was mixed into the substrate."

GOOD NEWS
Carib-Sea is replacing all of my EC. - Big thanks to PLANTBRAIN. Now I owe you and Bensaf (I do have some giant hairgrass that really doesn't go with my aquascape).

BAD NEWS
My tank is looking good and it's all planted, but I do see some hairalgae growing on the difformis, but I feel it's going to get worse.

Can I sue for mental anquish and TESA (The Evil Slime Attack).

If I used a phosX pad in my cansister I guess it would remove any phosphate I dose before the plants get it.

Bensaf, thanks for answering po4 question.



Last edited by tetratech at 13-Sep-2005 11:47

Last edited by tetratech at 13-Sep-2005 11:55

My Scapes

If po4 is substantially high like 4 ppm, would that interfere with uptake of no3

Only in the sense that PO4 will drive and increase Nitrate uptake. So don't slack on the dosing. Don't let it bottom out = disaster.

Forget the N03 kit, they really are useless. Just keep dosing and you'll always have N03 in the tank. Don't worry about the N P ratio too much. Just keep No3 at 10-20ppm.This will be enough for the plants.

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Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

Plantbrain,

Thanks! I'm going to contact CaribSea and see if they will do that.

Problem with my no3 to po4 ratio is testing. The colors on my nitrate kit are so similiar that it's tough to tell whether you have 10ppm or 100ppm. If po4 is substantially high like 4 ppm, would that interfere with uptake of no3. Is there a threshold.






Last edited by tetratech at 13-Sep-2005 06:42

My Scapes

TT,

Call Caribsea up and have them replace the EC you have, they will take care of it.

They hit a bad vein of minerals it seems.

Calcium does not impact pH at all.
Calcium carbonate does.

CO3, HCO3: these will alter KH.
CO2 will not change KH.

Adding CaCl2 will add Calcium without doing anything the KH/pH.

Adding CaCO3, will change the KH.

Ca and Mg will change the GH, but not the KH(only Co3, HCO3 will-at least for our purposes).

Regards,
Tom Barr

www.BarrReport.com

Yeah, Sham 's reminded me . Calcium Carbonate (ie crushed coral argonite etc)will raise pH along with KH. But plain old calcium won't. I've added calcium before for plants, never budged pH.

Don't those strange dark side people use protein skimmers ? Most add Calcium for good coral growth.

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Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

O.K. I'm convinced the UV is not an option. What surprises me about my po4 levels are that the EC is about 18 months old.

Untitled,
What's up with P04

Last edited by tetratech at 12-Sep-2005 16:41

My Scapes

I was told UV sterilizers can alter the nutrients needed by plants making them unuseable. I don't know if that's someones unproven hypothesis or not but I heard it from someone and read it somewhere online.
I'm not sure the exact difference between straight calcium ions which raise gh and calcium carbonate which raises kh and ph but kent makes a liquid calcium supplement that definitely does not raise ph. Gh is a measure of calcium and magnesium ions so plain calcium should raise the hardness and doesn't buffer the water.
Caribsea has been working on improving their screening process for their substrates and eliminating the chances for bad batches of eco complete. Their advice if you do get a bad bag was to wait it out since the affects won't last or if you want to spend the money find some of the newer bags that have been through a higher quality control.

Without saying anything about the PO4 and what I think you should do, UV sterilisers only kill suspended algae and nothing else. It actually might make things worse as the nutrients which would otherwise be consumed by the suspended algae would be available for the other type of algae you have.

Good point, but isn't something in the water column before we see it on glass, wood, plants, etc.



My Scapes

I've been having high po4 readings on my newly setup tank.

Since I have very few fish, barely feeding and many plants that are growing, I'm pretty sure it's the EC.

Then I also found this response from PLANTBRAIN when I asked about EC

"While many have used it with good success, some batches have been corrupted and many have increased hardness of the water over time as well as very high PO4, neither of which is bad, but it will throw some folks off"

Dosing wise, do I ignore the po4 reading and dose 10 to 1, no3 to po4. This PO4 is obviously in the water column and my concern of course is ALGAE.

My Scapes

Well since this thread has become sort of a general interest discussion, how come we never talked about UV Sterlizers to combat algae. From what I undertstand they do not harm the benefical bacteria.

I can add more co2 and no3 to my tank, but I am limited by what the fish can handle. If my po4 is going to stay at 4 or 5 because of the EC I feel I'm going to have problems down the road. Unless I start swapping out some of EC and mix with something else, maybe moon sand, etc.

My Scapes

Bensaf,

There is always a good time to learn something new .

Calcium does raise the ph as well (and GH).

For example, calcium is found in Limestone (made of calcareous material) which is known to raise the ph.

Here is the Full Source of this statement.

In addition, I think “the dark side” uses Calcium skimmers and has to do some tricks to maintain the ph. But I am no expert in that field and reading websites about it made me dizzy.

Last but not least, it’s the answer to one of our practice tests for the quiz . I guess I can say that here as everyone can take these tests without consequences.

Convince me otherwise (then I learned something new)

Ingo

Last edited by LITTLE_FISH at 12-Sep-2005 10:37

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Tetratech,

Yeah, I got the Ebo-Jaeger heaters (150W in the 29, 50W in the 20).

Both generate around 80F of water temperature when set to 75F (and even to 74F doesn't change anything). I tested with multiple thermometers to rule out false readings.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Oops! my ph is 6.7 not 7, so I think I'm good.

Yeah, still using ladder. I never saw it looking this good. Look daddy bubbles, bubbles everywhere... Kids like it. I might go to home depot and get the parts to build an inline one.

So far the thank is looking good I'll post pic soon.


Last edited by tetratech at 12-Sep-2005 09:12

Littlefish,

You have an EBO-J heater right. When I first got this heater the water was always a few degrees warmer than the setting (which I heard is common), now I have dropped the setting down to 76f and my water temp is 81f. Room temp is around 76f. I've tested the temp with 2 different thermoters.

Last edited by tetratech at 12-Sep-2005 09:20

Last edited by tetratech at 12-Sep-2005 09:27

My Scapes

I don't think Calcium raises pH. GH yes, pH would be a new one to me.

The Co2 is still low, crank it up further. Aim for about 6.6- 6.7. Are you still using the ladder, might explain the low diffusion .

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Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

Posted before I got your responses.

My ph out of tap is around 7.2, which is what my tank is without co2. With co2 at 2 bps my ph is 7 and for the first time my kh is now 4. It had always been 3.



My Scapes

Thanks Littlefish,

He definitely recommends increasing no3, because as long as there is no3 the plants will consume the po4. That shouldn't be a problem since I'm adding no3 three times/weekly, but the po4 remains in the water column at around 4 ppm. It's hard believe the EC is leaching that much po4 after 18 months of use.

My Scapes