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thanks for all your advice, babelfish.

the past few weeks have been pretty hard on my fish tank. first i started to lose a few of my fish - i thought it was pH fluctuations but then realized that, after careful observation, it was my biggest tiger barb who was running around nearly killing them, stressing them to death pretty much. then i noticed that lovely blueish green mat covering my aquarium. "meh, i'll just scrape it off and that'll be the end of it" i thought. Nooooo such luck. i go away this past weekend, come home, and it's literally on EVERYTHING. then i READ about it and find out what it is, and it's like, great what ELSE can go wrong... sorry im just venting.

but it really does teach you that the tank is an ecosystem, and you cant just isolate one thing inside of it, change it, and expect everything else to be the same. like, i thought i could just get rid of this stuff by scraping it off. but not so fast. to get rid of it, you need to treat the plants and get them to grow, to outcompete it... but be careful what you add for the plants, because too much of it - like CO2 - can harm the fish... and it goes on. i've said it once, i'll say it again

ahhh, the joys of fish keeping :88)

thanks again!

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Back in the saddle!

thanks babelfish, your counseling was indispensible

the way i understand it, the black out served as a Reset button. in other words, when i first planted my tank i wasnt careful in monitoring nutrients and light etc., thus the algae got an upper hand. the blackout pretty much allows one to start over again, and as you said, it's something you have to constantly keep up with, but at least now i have a fresh start.

i've learned an awful lot from this experience

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Back in the saddle!

Congrats so far !
It's something you really have to stick with and stay on top of though.....good that you increased the tank stock, just keep an eye on the nitrAtes and don't let the filter become too clogged >.<

^_^
*Proud member of the Committee for Sig Line Restoration*

just as an update:

i finished my blackout on friday, took the towels off the tank and 1.) no blue-green stuff 2.) plants were all still alive. whew!

did a large water change and started dosing with KNO3, brought nitrates up to between 10-20ppm. i even got a few yo-yo loaches to up the stocking in my tank and help out the nitrates a bit more. by today there's still no blue green algae, only a very natural looking green coating on the driftwood and on the back glass.

i also noticed that the dead algae is literally melting off of the plants! its coming off in these little grey clumps. actually the yo-yos have been doing a good job of removing the dead algae from the plants - not by eating it, just by swimming through it so fast it falls off then it gets sucked up by the filter - where i just pick it off by hand. everything looks better already, and i plan on getting some more vals in a few days, just to fill things in a bit more.

i know, i know, it's way too early to say all was a success, but so far so good!

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Back in the saddle!

don't laugh ...aparently it's sold as a food suppliment..., have read somewhere that some blue green algae (if it was cyno they were speaking of I'm not sure) are actually the one source of B vitamens outside animal sources.....*shrug*.....

*wanders back on topic*

^_^
*Proud member of the Committee for Sig Line Restoration*

*shrug* maybe some people actually like cyno...

mmm, i hear it tastes great on crackers...




okay sorry, that was gross. thanks for all the replies!

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Back in the saddle!

Seems like a good stock....possibly even increase the tiger barbs some.

Rosko_22, it sounds like you've never actually have had to deal with cyno.....if you have you know how difficult it can be to eliminate. Many planted tanks need regular dosing of nitrAtes to help combat it.....unfortunatly with as low tank stock as there is right now I can really only see KNO3 being a solution @this point...increasing stock will take weeks to help, KNO3 should work much sooner than that.
*shrug* maybe some people actually like cyno...

^_^
*Proud member of the Committee for Sig Line Restoration*

i'm pretty set on getting a bristlenose, would i also be able to add 4 yo-yo loaches? so the final population for the 46 would be 6 tiger barbs, 4 yo-yos and 1 BN (all this is eventual of course, not all at once...) is that too much? thanks

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Back in the saddle!

The first thing I'd do is definitely up your fish population, seems like a more "natural" way to up nitrates than dosing stump remover to me. Less of a hassle too. Your tank's almost empty as it is anyway. I agree that taking the hornwort out should help a great deal.
There have been quite a few suggestions so far, if you try them one by one, you should be able to beat the BGA.
Good luck.

ive been having my first bad blue-green algae outbreak

every couple of days i vaccum the stuff up and clean it off the glass, but it just keeps coming back. ive decided to use the black out method to try to get rid of it. did one 50% water change yesterday, cleaned the bottom and the glass then turned off the lights and covered the tank. i'll take everything off in another 2 days and see how things are. i expect that there will be some plant die off as well, but hopefully the bacteria will be gone.

my thoughts now are turning to cause and prevention, and i think my problem may be too much light and not enough nutrients. i have 60 watts over my 46 gallon tank, i know thats not a lot of light by any means, but i also have relatively new gravel and dont add any traces. ive measured my nitrates and they always come out at about 0. so once the black out is over, should I start dosing with KNO3 and/or flourish excel? i have a compact flourescent set up ready to go (110 watts) but ill wait until i get a decent CO2 unit before setting that up. what should i be adding to help my plants out compete the cyanobacteria?

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Back in the saddle!

yes shudder.....I'm not a pleco type of girl...although I did consider a BN last weekend for exactly the same reason you should get one...the cyno ...since they well, produce alot of waste they'll help by keeping the nitrAte levels up.

It's really a shame the site went down, I and a few others were dealing with this last spring and had a number of great threads...I can of course only remember bits and pieces...
I'd say make getting a BN in the tank (or increase the stock otherwise) one of your first priorities...the cyno won't go away over night and will continue to come back as long as the nitrAtes remain low.

Cyno's pretty evil I nearly died when I noticed it in my home tank...but I was somewhat well prepaired having beaten it twice before...I picked up 6 white clouds over the weekend and might still have to get a BN...they're not really all that bad (*hopes hers stays hidden* ) if the white clouds aren't enough....adding NO3 daily just wasn't my cup of tea...or coffee...

good luck.

^_^
*Proud member of the Committee for Sig Line Restoration*

right now my tank is completely covered in towels, so im covered (no pun intended... ) there.

i started out with 11 tiger barbs and one of them went berserk. he kept harassing the smallest one of the group so constantly that it would stop eating and die. then there would be a new smallest one...

he's alone in a 10 gallon for now, i dont know what to do with him but at least he's not killing the others.

and a "shudder BN"??? i like the look of them, i was planning on getting one after replanting my tank, but now i have to work on the cyanobacteria problem first, THEN replant. i might go for a few otos or true siamese algae eaters instead. but thats not for a little while...

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Back in the saddle!

Pretty much....and yes alot of people call it algae, but if you think of it like algae you'll go about treating it wrong.

Also...just the 6 tigers No wonder you've got cynobacteria!

Blackout (not just no lights, you need to cover the tank compleatly as well) to starve the cyno.....

NitrAtes to keep the cyno from getting the upper hand.

Remove the hornwort because it's such a fast consumer of nitrAte and right now your issue is too little.

Once you've got the nitrAtes around 20ppm you might want to consider increasing your tank stock....increase the barbs...or get a, dare I say it, BN (*shudders*).

^_^
*Proud member of the Committee for Sig Line Restoration*

so you're saying i should remove the hornwort first, then go ahead and start the regiment you described? and the dosing of KNO3 comes after the blackout?


as for the smell: my father came to visit the apartment i just moved into for the first time, and upon getting within 3 feet of the tank said "whew, i can smell that algae from here..." yeah, it stinks...

thanks for the replies!

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Back in the saddle!

Well your problem is actually too many fast growers!
You can tell that because your nitrAtes are zero...first thing might be to remove the hornwort to a bucket...it's sucking up all the nutrientes which allows the cynobacteria to form...remember BGA isn't an algae it's both algae and Bacteria....which is why many people try to kill it by adding anti-bacterial...I was close to doing it...but didnt' becasue cyno can become resistant to it.

~Kill the lights and cover the tank for 2 days
~Increase water circulation by using a submersible powerhead. A bubble wall can help, but once you add co2 you'll want to minimze surface agitation.
~Purchase some greenlight tree stump remover from Lows (home depot doesnt' carry the right kind)...get the powder form in a plastic jar, it's pure KNO3....
~mix it as 1 teaspoon to a gallon (use a milk jug) of water...test your solution with your nitrAte kit then begin dosing S-L-O-W-L-Y to increase your tank to 10-20 ppm.


You'll need to keep the water moving in the tank and keep it around 20ppm nitrAtes IME for a few days before you start to get the upper hand on the cynobacteria. Remove as much by hand beforehand as you can...and if you can find a way to not smell like the stuff for 12 hours after being in the tank ...even after a shower...let me know .

^_^
*Proud member of the Committee for Sig Line Restoration*

thanks babelfish

it's a 46 gallon tank with 6 tiger barbs. i have some hornwort, 4 anubias, 4 crypts, and a number of italian vals. i was thinking of adding some elodea as ive heard it's a fast grower and will use a lot of nutrients before algae do.

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Back in the saddle!

Blackouts will only help for a very very short time, it can also hurt the plants as much as the cyno. Water changes will often make it worse.
I've done the dosing of nitrAtes and IMO it is frustrating; if you miss a day you get a lovely BGA surprise...however it might help for the time being. I've started increasing the stocking of my tank, rather than relying on dosing the tank daily.
With the 110 wpg and no co2 then yes the cyno will just get all the extra...so yes wait till the co2 is there before adding the new lights.

What's your fish stock and what plants do you have in the tank

^_^
*Proud member of the Committee for Sig Line Restoration*

Last edited by Babelfish at 06-Oct-2004 10:06