FishProfiles.com Message Forums

I have 3 elephantnoses and one of my elephantnoses is injured. I think it is injured, Doesn't look like cotton to me. The skin look like it has been grazed. He was not looking like this yesterday, it all happened overnight and I couldn't believe my eyes when I saw him.

Please see the pictures.

http://www.amnet.net.au/~foolim/namu1.JPG
http://www.amnet.net.au/~foolim/namu2.JPG

I don't know what to do now. I did a 30% water change and I have dosed the tank with a little bit of melafix (half dose) But after the half dose Melafix, I noticed one of my elephantnoses (the previously ok one) was acting weird, i.e. unable to balance itself. I quickly do another 30% water change.

I don't think the tankmates are aggressive at all (Clown loach/Siamese Algae eater/otto & tetras) they have been living happyly for so many months. I cannot figure out what actually happened. Unless it is some sort of fungus, can anyone help?

What should I use to dose Elephant nose, they are very sensitive.
I thought Melafix is OK but obviously not.

Figures before water change.
Ammonia:0
Nitrite:0
Nitrate:20
pH : 7 (no adjuster used)
Temp:29.8c (Its Summer now, outdoor temperature up to 42c today)

Tank Size: 250 Litre
Water change schedule and % changed: Fortnightly, 30% Waterchange
The tank has been set up for 3 years now.

Please tell me what to do with my elephant nose. Thank you....

Oh dear, that is one very sick little mormyrid.That looks like skin slime disease caused by a protozoan infection, quite probably that eternal pain in the fishkeepers bum, hexamita.This is the same protozoan that causes hole in the head syndrome, but on a mormyrid the effect is very different. Hes underweight and showing signs of debilitation, I honestly doubt if he'll make it, but by all means try to save him, theres really nothing to lose at this point.

You really have to get him onto appropriate meds as soon as possible, and even that is going to be risky. Stop the melafix immediately, it will do no good against this infection.

You cant really use metronidazole because all the cures you can get without seeing a vet that contain metro have to be ingested, and frankly with a specialist live feeder with a tiny mouth, that is going to be difficult, and in any case I severely doubt he'll eat from now until he dies.Only a vet will have an injectable version, and judging by the pictures your fish may be a little small for that, and youd be lucky to get him to a vet alive anyway.

That means you have to administer a cure to the water and although mormyrids are notoriously sensitive to meds its really the only shot youve got. Jungle parasite clear would probably save his life if you can figure out a way of actually getting it into him. Protozin would probably work, easily administered, but the med itself will be very tough on your fish, and so his chances of survival are limited. If you can find esha exit, that too will clear most if not all of his symptoms, but again it will be very hard on the fish.

He is so ill that you really just need to get to the lfs and find anything good for treating costia and protozoans and try it.If you can find something that is mormyrid friendly then that would be fantastic, but I think you pretty much only have today to take your last shot, he does look only hours away from death.Hurry!

If death looks inevitable and theres truly nothing you can do, get some clove oil (available at any good chemists or pharmacy in the dental hygiene department)and put about 20 drops of it and about a gallon of his tankwater in a bucket or container and drop him in. He'll be off to lala land in no time, and he wont feel a thing . He'll either expire painlessly on his own , or be numbed if you need to bonk him on the head or freeze him for euthanasia. The dose I recommended is an overdose designed to cause total paralysis and it should kill the fish painlessly, but a mormyrids resistance to it is not well known, but I imagine in his condition he will die exposed to that much clove oil. Its a bit like giving someone about 20 bottles of whisky.

Do what you can as quickly as you can. You have my utmost sympathy and I wish you nothing but the best of luck.

longhairedgit

Thanks for the reply, but he has passed away.
I am worry about the other 2 momyrids in there. Normally, they are very active but today, I haven't seen them moving around. Should I dose the tank with Protozin still just in case? I noticed that the statement on Protozin says "Do not use when rays or momyrids are present." If I just use half a dose, will that be ok?

I would treat the tank, but not with protozin, that was emergency advice only for dire circumstances, and for a single fish situation where the risk is worth it.

I have been thinking of a way to get metronidazole into an elephantnose.

Find a source of metronidazole as quickly as possible, if you have enough money to involve a vet you can ask him to order a liquid form that can be added to the tank at the correct dosage (ask his advice on the correct dose for the concentration of fluid that he can procure)and that will clear the problem.

Failing that you will have to come up with something at home. A good chemist should be able to supply you with a liquid suspension known as (brandname)flagyl. This is a metronidazole treatment for protozoans in humans , but it is equally effective on fish, but unfortunately adding it to the tank wont be enough, as it has to be ingested, and the digestion process activates it. Whaty ou can try is soaking some thawed bloodworm in the liquid, and then offering it to the mormyrids. The dosage will be imprecise , but its a lot better than nothing.If your mormyrids are already accepting freeze dried tubifex it will be even easier as the dried tubifex should soak up the medication well.Fortunately metronidazole is an extremely safe drug with an overdose safety limit of about 200 times recommended dose, so its almost impossible to kill a fish with an overdose. Overdosing does come with a risk of causing infertility, but I suspect that youll be happy enough if the fish survive, and wont worry about the breeding aspect too much.

If you cant do that , its a question of tracking down a cure in a local fish shop. Youre options with this species and this ailment are unfortunately very limited. Im sorry I cant be more help than that.

Only try protozin as an absolute last resort, and I mean as an ABSOLUTE last resort. It will harm the fish, possibly even kill it.The only reason I suggested it before was because it was a last chance scenario with a deathly ill fish needing treatment immediately for any chance of survival.

BTW sorry for the loss of your elephant nose. They are a pleasant and special species and its always a shame when one shuffles off the mortal coil.



Good luck with the others.

In fact just found a med that for fish that have protozoan and parasite infections, and is safe for use with mormyrids, the only downside is that it will probably harm the filter bacteria. It is called Clout. see link.

http://www.aq-products.com/APpro/clouttablets.htm

a lot of people also recommend furan 2 for general bacterial problems with mormyrids, and its probably worth keeping some around.

Just remember never to use anything with copper in it, as the allergic affect on the elephantnose can be so bad that the skin may actually start falling off.

Hi longhairedgit,

You have been most helpful, thank you ver much. My other two momyrids are still hiding. Unfortunately , I havent had much luck for hunting down the right medication.

In the afternoon, I've been visiting and ringing up several LFS, unfortunately the medications that you recommended Jungle parasite clear, CLOUT Tablets have been taken off Australian Markets, as the chemical standards are different. Not quite sure what he meant by that. As for Furan 2, it is actually illegal. I researched on "flagyl", unfortunately that's not an over counter medications,doctor prescription is needed.

I was told by the LFS that Melafix should be able to help, but I dont trust my LFS anymore, they even recommended treatment that contained Melachite Green, which I'm pretty sure will kill the momyrids.

I have researched on the internet, hoping to ship these medications from overseas, unfortunately I couldnt locate any online stores that are willing to sell overseas.

My choice is very limited now, LFS advised that they cant think of any medications available for scaleless fish. I am now trying my luck and have just used half dose of Aqua Master,Multi Cure to dose the tank. I am hoping for the best now. Fingers cross.

That pretty much leaves you needing a vet then. You could try calling one for some (hopefully free)phone advice, and explain the situation to them. They are usually able, thanks to many licenses to procure substances that are illegal for the private person to acquire, and provide them for appropriate use. Obviously its a costly route to procure meds, but if its the only option left, what choice do you have?