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Hey everyone,

I was wondering if someone can help me with my little tiger barbs?

I put my fish (5 tiger barbs from my 20 gallon) in there new 45 gallon tank yesterday so today I wanted to see how they looked and how they were acting. I saw every one relatively lively and what not, until about an hour ago. Three of my tigers stand out most in mind. 1 green and 2 albinos.

Green: The green one I noticed has this spot on the tip of its upper lip that is white. It doesn't look like its protruding off the lip but I really cant tell. On closer inspection I could see that it was outlined in black and made a somewhat U shape over the white mark. I have no idea if that's just how this one looks, if it took a beating from another tiger and bumped its lip? I have no clue. The spot is not or doesn't look fuzzy and doesn't look as if it is sitting oddly on the nose like I've seen in pictures with the disease.

Albino 1: This albino has a white off white edging to its dorsal fin. I don't know if its fin growth or just how the fin is or possible columnaris as well?

I know the description for columnaris says a white tuft and what not on the fin edges and lip.

Albino 2: This one seems a little off. Clamped fins in the corner of the tank not shoaling but is still eating and interested in food. I'm wondering if its in a different stage of the disease or if its just resting from the move. I did notice that the other 4 barbs were all over the place when I put them in last night exploring and playing around. This one was MIA for about 2 hours until I noticed it swimming on the very bottom wondering through the plants stems.

All the fish but Albino 2 are swimming and exploring. Have extremely bright coloration which they didn't have in the 20 and seem fine. I'm not sure if I'm making something out of nothing or if there really is something wrong.

Another tidbit of information is that 2 days ago I had to put my 6th tiger asleep. He was attacked by my rainbow shark and was missing alot of finage. I had him in a breeder net for about a week and he was making a great recovery eating well and everything. Until 3 days ago when I noticed he was no longer swimming and was just sitting on the bottom of the net with its fins clamped. I figured he/she was just tired until 2 days ago when he/she started to fall over on its side. I let him out the net only hoping he just felt a little claustrophobic in the net. He could hardly swim, it was like his body was locked up. He would sink to the bottom and my shark would go after him. I have no idea if his sickness had anything to do with my other tigers but I guess any info helps.

Tank: 45 gallon US
moderately planted
Temp:82*

Ammoina:0
Nitrite:0-0.05
Nitrate:10


Tank sat for a week for the plant to grow and absorb the ammonia and nitrites. I then added bio spria with the fish yesterday.

Well while waiting for my test results I have now noticed that another albino has gone MIA.The other three including the two with the white are very active.

hope you can help and thanks


tigermom

Its not entirely out of bounds that that it could be columnaris, but given the aggression and dodgy water quality going on at the moment I woudnt be surprised if this is regular fungus and finrot, saprolegnia etc taking an opportunity to take hold and do some damage. Periods of cycling issues are often the time common bacteria and fungi do their thing, and with nips, bites, and stress on top of this causing the immunosupression in the fish, making them more vulnerable than they would otherwise be. Under these conditions columnaris would carve a swathe through your fish collection faster than you might imagine.

This is one of the very few times you'll catch me recommending salt.Its only useful under certain circumstances. Nitrite, salt and oxygen are all linked in their effect on fish respiration, so to reduce immunosupression add a little salt, and give the fish as much oxygenation as you can, and in addition use a standard anti-fungus and finrot medication. Should turn the little guys around. I might avoid melafix and pimafix for this one as the need for oxygen is a factor and sometimes they bind the surface layer a bit.


Might be worth seperating the shark and the barbs too, they might be making each other hyperaggressive.


Hope this helps!

To me, it just sounds like a minor infection that has gotten a toe-hold due to the water chemistry being a bit dodgy. Don't stress too much, just keep that water clean and let it cycle. Do you have any more bio-spira?

Keep an eye on Albino 2, he sounds like he's a bit less strong than the others and is likely to pick up anything going around at the moment. Can you check him for visible parasites too, and have a look for redness around the lips or gills?

For animals, the entire universe has been neatly divided into things to (a) mate with, (b) eat, (c) run away from, and (d) rocks. - Terry Pratchett

Thanks you two for the quick responses. Well after I wrote my post I feed them a few flakes to see if I could coax the others to come out. The two greens ate, and one albino ate. The other two came out for 1.2 seconds and went back into hiding. I just find it so bizarre that something like this can totally change how a fish acts.

Okay so after I read the posts I went to check the fish. I didn't see any visual parasites on the albino 2 but I did notice that the gills on this one and the other albino seemed red. I do have some bio spria left. Should I just empty the rest of the packet in? It was the one for up to 90 gallons and I used a little more that half yesterday. I will go out first thing tomorrow and get some salt and med's. But do you think the salt will kill the plants?

Oh yeah and I do have the shark and barbs separate. His aggression has completely picked up since he has gotten older Not something I'm to thrilled about.

Thanks again for the help I really hope I can get this before it gets worse.

tigermom

I'd chuck about 1/4 of the rest of the bio-spira in today, and pop the rest in about 2 days later. I can't get that type over here, but that'd be what I'd try to do with any of the other starters if I was having difficulty.

If the salt is enough to kill the plants, it'll be enough to kill the fish You'll be right, both are generally pretty hardy. You don't have too many snazzy plants in there, do you? nothing too delicate?

Watch what finrot medication you choose though, those can damage even common plants.





For animals, the entire universe has been neatly divided into things to (a) mate with, (b) eat, (c) run away from, and (d) rocks. - Terry Pratchett

I did see a small pick up of activity during the lunar light hour. They all came out for a brief time and had a few blood worms. This was something I was very excited to see considering how they were acting earlier.

on another note I put about 1/4 of the bio spira in and will put the rest in, in 2 days.

As far as plants go I'm pretty sure they will do okay. The wisteria, hornwort and tiger lotus I'm not to worried about, but I wonder about the red/bronze crypts, dwarf sag and myrio. It wouldn't bother me to much if those didn't respond well though because I was having second thought about them anyway ( their merely surviving but not thriving )

I went online and looked up the medications I could acquire tomorrow and the best I could find were Mardel Maracyn and Mardel Maracyn-Two. I'm thinking the Mardel Maracyn would be best though because it talks about columnaris and fin rot being two of the things it treats for un like Maracyn-two.

So its fine to use Mardel Maracyn and salt together at the same time or one then the other? And how much salt would you suggest for a 45 gallon tank I read 1 teaspoon per 5 gallons is what works? Should I just use the two together for however long the Maracyn should run then do a 50% water change?

thanks you so much, you have no idea how much I appreciate this!

tigermom

Maracyn is pretty hefty antibiotics, the issue that you are going to have is that it'll end up compounding the problem by wiping out your brand new biofilter.

By the sounds of the infection, it is pretty slow and low-grade, I'd probably try something less aggressive and more bio-filter friendly. Instead of antibiotics, I'd be looking at antiseptics or 'ye ole style' chemicals even. To be honest I would have gone with Pimafix or Indian Almond extract and just altered the filter slightly to provide greater surface agitation (More times than not I find the melafix and pimafix totally destroy the surface tension and don't cause issue unless there is some serious carnage in the tank, but I deal with small aquaria so it may be different). Maybe even just the increase in salinity might make enough of a difference to the infection to allow the fish to clear themselves up.

For animals, the entire universe has been neatly divided into things to (a) mate with, (b) eat, (c) run away from, and (d) rocks. - Terry Pratchett

Well boy am I glad I poped on here before I went to the store. I would of kicked myself if I destroyed the bio filter when I just got going. I will get the pimafix and salt and increase the suface agitation with the filters and air stone. Ill just have to really watch their behaiour to see if it has any negative affects on breathing and what not. Ill will try increasing the salinity first then see what happens. If it looks like things are getting better then I may not use the Pimafix to avoid the stress. But i will keep it just in case...

Thanks alot for they help ill keep you updated

tigermom