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UPDATE:

As far as it looks this has stopped getting worse, at least to the eyes.

The tank temp is 2 degrees lower then it was before, sitting at 78. All the other fish in the main tank show NO signs of this so far.

Man my angel is sad and bored though.......she has never been alone EVER, so shes sulking a bit.


Well so far so good and still eating fine


Angel Eel

THanks

Done

trystianity, Do you want the QT tank results or the tank he came from??? My guess is the one he came from....


I hope you come back and try and help, not just come type a whole bunch of jargin and then never come back

Please extra help would be great.

Okay and the meds are going to be here at 4:00 o'clock,

I did do a salt dip, and I added just a touch of salt to the main tank as well to help things out a bit, and to tell you the truth it looks like shes is feeling a tad better and the rotting is staying down to a minimum.

As for her food she is still eating liquid fry food, for ease
and mashed up flake.....she is the smartest fish shes cornering her food to the glass so she gets some.

NOW here is a funny question, the white anchor worm looking stuff is dissapearing, I don't know if it from my African butterflyfish in her main tank, who I caught eating off all the worm looking things and hanging out with my angel......now that I get over the cute part Is that bad for the butterflyfish????? Will he now get this???


Its to bad I had to seperate them they were taking care of each other.



Well I'll start at 4:00 wish Bonnie luck......

Angel Eel

Last edited by angeleel at 03-Aug-2005 13:52

Last edited by angeleel at 03-Aug-2005 13:53

Main tank results....

PH - 6.7
high range ph - 7.4
ammonia- between 0 and 0.25
NitRITE- 0ppm
NitRATE- between 0 ppm and 5.0


Water change comes today before meds.

Angel Eel
thanks for waiting

I'm thinking ammonia played a role in stressing your fish out, bringing on disease. I'm guessing the fish had an open wound or something, and because of less than perfect tank condition, the wound became infected and started to rot. Columnaris does sound likely given the other info. I'm not sure if the worm-like thing actually was an anchor worm, it is really hard to say without seeing it. Salt dips will help to an extent because the bacteria causing infections like this are sensitive to it. However, now that you have antibiotics I would not continue treatment with it. Just leave what you have in the tank after dosing it yesterday, don't bother dosing more when you do the WC.

One thing I am wondering is if the edges of the wound look like they have any fuzzy white or greyish fungus-like growth on them? Usually with columnaris you will see a red line between the infected and healthy tissue followed by what looks like fungus. Did the stringy things you saw look like fungus?

Also what meds did you order?

Now that she has been moved into QT I would like water test results for that tank too.

For the main tank, you'll want to examine the cause of the ammonia reading in your tank so you can prevent it from happening again. 0.5 ppm ammonia doesn't seem like much but can really place a lot of stress on your fish. So to find out where that is coming from:

Have you changed anything recently?
Overfeeding?
Any dead bodies that might have been missed?
Maintenance lagging at all lately? - filters need cleaning, gravel needs a good deep vac, etc.
What is the tank stock/size?

In the meantime in order to reduce stress on the fish that are still in the main tank you'll want to do what you can to get the ammonia down. A water change is an excellent idea, make sure you check the tank for anything that might be rotting and producing ammonia (ie. uneaten food, excessive waste, dead bodies, rotting plant matter, etc.). Also give your filter media a good rinse in some tank water if it needs it.

EDIT: Fish are pretty smart, won't usually eat things that will obviously make them sick unless they have nothing else to eat and are starving. Your abf should be fine.

Last edited by trystianity at 03-Aug-2005 15:19

I was thinking the ammonia reading would be from the parts of her falling off and rotting..I did check the whole tank for other left over dead fish and came up short...SOrry I got a little confused should I stop the salt treatment or the meds??


The salt is done because she is in the qt tank now. I salted the main tank.


Yes the stuff looked very fungus like, today most of that is gone though. Thank god I think the salt got it. As well as the anchor worms LIKE things.


The meds are Furan and Furan2 OR Maracyn and Maracyn 2, the hubby is bringing the home after work. Whatever ones they have there I will inform you of that later.


The tank size is 29 Gallons.

As for the main tank water change already done.

I will do a test on the QT tank as soon as I get time again.

Ohhh..the ammonia is also a slight overfeeding to make sure she was eating at first

It does not look like the problem is going backwards but it FOR SURE slowed down.

ANgel EEl

I would stop salt treatment. Go ahead with the meds..... If you get Furan and Furan 2, just dose one of them. I would go with furan-2 because it contains Methylene Blue, will give a bit of extra help with the columnaris "fungus" and if those worm looking things were indeeed a parasite it would be helpful there as well.

If you get the maracyns, dose them BOTH at the same time. IME with them, they work a lot better when combined, doesn't really matter what I'm treating.

My suggestion for meds would be the furan 2 over all if you can get it, it will save you some money only buying one med and may be more effective. The maracyns can be pricey especially for us Canadians. If you can contact
the hubby before he picks them up, let him know that if he gets either Furan or Furan-2 he only needs to get one med.

You'll want to keep the QT tank very clean while the angel is in there. Columnaris is near impossible to treat IME in less than pristine water. I will sometimes even up water changes to 20-30% per day while treating it, every 3-5 days would be fine.

If you're worried about the angel getting food, you can spot-feed with a turkey baster. Just mix the powdered flake or fry food with a bit of tank water in a small bowl, suck it up with the turkey baster and release small amounts into the tank right near the angel's mouth. Do little bits at a time to make sure it is all consumed, you DON'T want any excess food in a QT tank because water quality is essential. It takes some time to feed in this way but it works. Hopefully the rot has not progressed too much and will heal eventually.

You will see some improvement with antibiotics in a few days. IME they will sometimes look WORSE for a few days before they start looking better. Increase aeration on the QT tank with an air stone and have some faith (most fish, especially the smarter ones, will sulk a bit when you start any treatment because it stresses them out a lot). I would turn the lights off in the QT tank, low light will help the fish feel more secure. Also try to avoid a lot of activity around the QT tank, treat it like you would a sick room for a person. Quiet, dim lights, clean, comfortable surroundings, etc. Room lights are OK.

When you're doing water changes make sure the temperature is an exact match.....

I think that covers everything, I'll post if I think of anything else

EDIT: Oh right, the main tank....watch carefully for any signs of illness in the rest of the fish, I would also continue to test daily or every 2 days until the ammonia is gone, after that check it every week or so for a while to make sure the problem has been resolved.

Also remember you will need to remove any carbon from the QT tank filter before you dose meds...

HTH

Last edited by trystianity at 03-Aug-2005 17:22

Pristine water...will do


I can't call hubby due to the type of job he does.

But I did say last night to get Furan 2 before anything because I have used it before.


Thanks for the help

Where do you live in Canada? Those Meds are quite cheap where I live.

I also will keep up changes in the main tank to get all the salt out this week.

When the hubby gets home I will post again.

Thanks
Angel Eel

More bad news...
Not the meds I wanted.....I got Jungle Fungus clear tank buddies.



Put them in already.....

Will update soon.
Angel EEl

Jungle Fungus Clear tank buddies are fine, great for treating columnaris. They should work well for you.

EDIT: I am about 1 hr west of Toronto. "Expensive" might be a relative term, unemployed on sick leave for a year and being a student leaves you with a very light wallet.

Last edited by trystianity at 03-Aug-2005 21:08

Fungus clear will be fine, it's got the same active ingredients that you're looking for

Jungle labs fungus clear tank buddies
Nitrofurazone, Fruazolidone, potassium dichromate.

Furan-2
Nitrofurazone, furazolidone, and methylene blue trihydrate
Good luck!

^_^[hr width='40%']] "It's just one of those days
Feelin' like a freight train
First one to complain
Leaves with a blood stain"]

I would say put your angel in the hospital tank anyway.
At this point I dont think it can get any worse,
and being able to successfully monitor and dose her
would be much much more effective in the hospital tank.


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Oh yea one thing, I don't know if she is pooping...

Keep an eye on that, sounds like treatment is going well.

Okay today is the day that I take out the first bit of meds, it says take out 25% water and if you need to add another dose.

I have two questions about it first

Do you medicate again with the same doseage?

How do I know if she needs more???

Her wound on her tail has turned a discolored brownish color, and her mouth is still a bit messed up but is clearing up a whole bunch. She is also eating just as good as she was when she was okay. She seems to be dealing with it quite fine.

Should I do another dose to be safe or will that end up being in someway fatal??


Any more help would be fantastic!!!!!

Thanks Alot

Angel Eel

OH and one more cory passed away, I wondering if its from the diease or the meds bugging him???


Thanks

Use the same doseage that you have been dosing. From what I remember reading in cases of rot or fungus you need to continue treatment until it's compleatly stopped otherwise it can easily get a handhold and come back.

Sorry about the cory , are you running an airstone? They generally help while a tank is being medicated.

^_^[hr width='40%']"Has someone taken your faith? It's real, the [link=pain]http://babelfish.qwertydigital.com/" style="COLOR: #EB4288[/link] you feel.
The life, the love, You die to heal.
The hope that starts, The broken hearts...
I’ve got another confession my friend, I’m no fool.
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Yup there is an airstone in both.

Okay I went ahead and did the full dose again and I am going to finish all the treatments too.



Thanks a whole bunch everyone,
Angel Eel

i dont know anything about what im talking about, but i just wanted to say sorry about your fish

does it matter if you have an airstone on an airtube, or can i just keep the tube open

You will get much more out of your air pump if you use a stone to cut the air flow into really tiny bubbles. The smaller the bubble the better as that means more surface area for the oxygen to be dissolved in the water. If you want REALLY tiny air bubbles (fine spray) and a lot of oxygen dissolved into the tank, wooden air "stones" are the best that I've ever found.

So, the easy answer is:

No, you don't need to use an air stone on the tubing really but you will get much more benefit (oxygen gas) out of it if you do. The reason air pumps are used in tanks is to increase dissolved oxygen in the water, so your pump will be much more efficient and give you a lot more dissolved oxygen if you use a stone.

Good question.

They likely have the same dose in each. Have a look @the package when you're in the store.
I've used the fungus clear tank buddies before for a fin rot problem, never had to deal with Columnaris though so I'm not entirely sure. I do suggest meds with the two different furans in them as they are +/- antibiotics which is what it looks like you need to tackle Columnaris.
Sorry I cant be of more help , good luck though!

^_^[hr width='40%']"Has someone taken your faith? It's real, the [link=pain]http://babelfish.qwertydigital.com/" style="COLOR: #EB4288[/link] you feel.
The life, the love, You die to heal.
The hope that starts, The broken hearts...
I’ve got another confession my friend, I’m no fool.
I’m getting tired of starting again, Somewhere new."