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I have to disagree on ph i think as long as it is stable any fish can do good in it. I keep my ram in 8.75 shows excelent color and vitality stable is always best. Irecomendyou never youse ph adjusting chemicals like trystianity said waste of money and can be really dangerous. Hope they all get better for you.

the betta tank, had just water, it dident have the fish any more, it had been sitting for a few days, maybe a week, i dont remember, but the tank strangly seems very stable now but, i wont add anything till the 2 weeks is over i dont want to take any more chances

like was said Co2 and bad water = A MESS

I would have guessed right from the start it was your strips, those suck so bad that if you even live where it is really humid they will not work worth a dam.


Liquid tests are better little bit more money but worth it.


Peat works for PH as was also said.


I don't want to start a fight but Corys breed with colder water...


If you ever get it where more then one tank is the same.....It's wrong lol

Even worse is if it is the same as a small betta tank =p


I think it is all just your water do some 30% changes every day, maybe add bottled water to your water. First test both alone then together....it mey be lower then what you have now.


Angel Eel

Another thing that is a bother is what thyrst said..your betta tank should not have nitrate in it that could be a mess up of the strips as well.

ok.....

well, i lost one eyed jack(the cherry) and now all i have from my corys is an aggazzie and a peppered:#( both r doing fine though, i did a water change last night, and i will do another in a bit

If you're having trouble with water chemistry, CO2 injection is a bad BAD BAD idea.

Check some of the posts in the Technical Tinkering section for DIY CO2, also the Plant section.. You can make your own CO2 unit very cheap, and make the mix yourself.

In about 2.5 weeks you will need to monitor the bubble count and get it refreshed before the bubbles stop, to avoid a ph swing..

CO2 will drop ph.

The Amazon Nut...

CO2 can effect ph? i dident know that, how much for one of those things?, r there any home made thing i can add, besids drift wood? im talking natural stuff, like putting somthing in the filter?

That all depends Gauntlet, where I lived last it had wellwater and 8.1ph, gh and kh were also extremely high. I had a hard time acclimating lots of different fish to my water.. Lost lots. The best thing I did was add CO2 which dropped ph to 7.8.. Your ram may survive in your water, but if it's wild caught, good luck breeding it.

And yes I'd have to totally agree also on what Tryst said regarding chemicals that play with ph.. To lower it I'd use peat in the filter.

The Amazon Nut...

i lost 1 cory:#( but the others seem much better this morning. after picking them from the plants, i set 2 sick ones up front, and shortly after i found the dead one, the peppered was fine, a little shaken, but i cant help thinking that because he stayed near the filter it helped him i added a bubbler to the 20 gallon and i have to tell ya somthing. before i was thinking the test strips, i added a small female common guppy, to see if maybe the ram got hurt, and died from getting hit by a rock or somthing, the gupp was and still is fine, even after i moved it back so i added a male cherry, 3 danios...fine, the female bettas...fine.oh, and this male is a omplete pussy cat (betta) he only looks at the girls, but never touchesor flairsbut, i have 3 males floating arounf in there and he goes nutsbut, yea, its wierd, i added a corys, and he was fine for about a half hour, ten he started doing the flippy thigsbut after a bit of cpr, swam off like nothing i have had a very sad and very confusing last 24 hours, i lost my first male ram:#( and my first agazzie:#(..and i still have to find the cherry

i had 2 rams in a 29 gallon, i moved them to a 10 gallon so they could pair up, they were doing great, so i had just finished planting up a 20 gallon for them, there is only a male betta in it , but i moved them into there, and about an hour or 2 later i come back to find my male ram dead and the female wasnt looking good, so i moved the female, and hoped maybe the male would come back, i moved them back to the 10, i turned off the filter, dumped in some meds, wrapped towels arounf it to keep the light out, and then i let them be..

my friend tries cpr on the male, and i donthink there is anything else i can do:#(..

more than 24 hours ago i added corect ph tabs, it dident alter the water at all (at lease the strip said it dident) i tested bother tanks right before i moved them, and they were identical! there was a 2 degree temp diffrence, and i never had a problem with that little diffrence. i hunted them down with 2 nets and when i let them go in the 20 gallon, they swam off into the plants, looking stressed (thought nothing of it, because i just chased them) the female is looking a little better now, what can i do!

Sorry to hear about your lost ram, and sick cory...

Simulating 'gentle rain' for breeding is 1 to 2 degrees warmer, not colder. Adding colder water can be a deadly shock to any tropical fish or induce problem/s disease to any fish with a weakened immune system (or totally healthy ones at that). Living in a ph suitable for african cichlids, they're immune system would have already been weak. I hope the ph test is incorrect..

Edit - get some liquid test kits instead of the strip tests, do you have a LFS near you to get a 2nd opinion on that ph ?









Last edited by DaFishMan at 10-Aug-2005 22:48

The Amazon Nut...

i just realized somthing]

the test strips r not working!!!i tested, the tap, the 29, the 20, and the 10, all the same! exactly!] and i tested a betta bowl, and the only diff was the alcalinity, wich sounds wierd, but is normal, and not high like mine, but not im realy mad! im gunna have to muster up another 15 bucks just to get more strips] this is BULL! and now theres somthing wrong with my corys:#( i just did a water change on their tank, ans now they r breathing fast, sitting on their backs:#( what else can go wrong!:#( but i think with the corys, it sounds like temp shoc, i added a little colder water to see if i can get them to breed, i cant find one cory though i found 1, and its doing much better now, and 2 r still critical, and the peppered stayed near the intake of the filter, and is normal, but 1 cory is still lost somwheres trying to breath:#( but i have to continue checking on them, night! home morning brings good news

the rams wernt moved like day after day after day it took place over a few weeks, and i have had the rams for a few months, and i told you, the parameters were EXACT, and i fishless cycled the 20 gallon with stress zyme, and ammonia, took about a week, but, maybe there is somthing wrong with my test strips i have had them sense christmas, and i may have left it open a few times im not sure

do you have the parameters from the tank they were moved from?

also, I would like to know how you have any nitrate showing up on your tests with just a betta in a 20 gallon tank......have you tested your tap water?

I would blame the proper pH product, they tend to work temorarily, lowers pH for a bit then your buffer drives it right back to where it was. Those products are a waste of money. 8.4 is a bit high for rams, what is your pH out of the tap?

If you're moving fish even between tanks you need to follow the proper acclimatization procedure unless you're absolutely sure the parameters are exactly the same. Rams are especially sensitive to changes in water chemistry, especially if they are already stressed.

I would like a few more things from you, water parameters from the tap and the other tanks the rams were in. Also why were you moving them around so much? It stresses them out a lot, I wouldn't doubt that the stress of frequent moving had a lot to do with it. Until you have a better understanding of water chemistry and fish care, I would highly suggest that you stay away from more sensitive fish.... like rams.

the parameters r..

nitrite-0
nitrate-less than 20, barley pink
ph-8.4
temp- 80
20 gallon reg
stock-1 betta, and there were the rams for a short time
filter- whisper power filter
already told about the ph adjuster
and i assumed the rapid breathing and sitting on the bottom, as stress from the move, and there were no other sympoms, and nothin on the body

more than 24 hours ago i added corect ph tabs,

It's my understanding that ajusting ph chemically will cause more trouble than good as the ph swings are very stressful on fish. If you dont have the right ph, I recomend selecting a different fish or having the ph stable via natural means prior to purchasing fish.

Once you post back with a bit more info we should be able to assist you.

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From the sticky at the top of the forum:

Help us to help you with your sick fish:

When making a post to the hospital forum, you will save valuable time by providing the following to us. Post what you can now then bring the rest back later if you are missing something. Copy and paste the info into your post as a guideline, then edit out what is not needed. based on symptoms, we may ask for more info later.

It is also important for us to know what country you are in so we can recommend medications that are actually available to you.

ENVIRONMENTAL DATA

Water Parameters
There are many things in a fish tank that can cause a fish to appear sick, when natural toxins or water chemistry are not just right.

Ammonia:
Nitrite (note the “I&#8221:
Nitrate (note the “A):
pH:
Temp:

If you do not have one or more of these, please take a bag of water to the fish store and ask them to test it for you. Most will do this for free. If not, try another store. Make sure you write them down so we can review the numbers with you.

Tank Information

Tank Size (gallons and dimensions if known (20 gal long versus regular 20 or 20 gal high):
Stock List (Quantity/Species):
Fish size for larger fish (a 5 inch angel or a 9 inch oscar has a different effect on water parameters than a half-dollar size angle or a 3 inch oscar).
Filtration (ex: Penguin 330, Whisper 40, Fluval 204, etc).

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Additives
Tell us what you add to your tank or replacement water like conditioners to remove chlorine/chloramine, fertilizers for plants, aquarium salt, pH adjusters, etc. Describe for us how often you use and how much.

INFORMATION ABOUT YOUR SICK FISH

Be as descriptive as you can and provide pics, if possible (see the post about how to add pictures at the top of the hospital forum).

We not only need detailed information about what you see ON the fish, we need to know about it’s behavior. This does not attempt to capture everything, but gives you some ideas on how to present what you are seeing. Don’t limit yourself to what is here.

Examples of some physical attributes
Pale, darker, grey fuzz/white fuzz/off-white fuzz, grey slimey film, blue haze, gold dusting, salt grains/spots, blood bordered white area, ulcer, pustule/boil, cloudy eyes, protruding eye, eroding fin, etc.

Examples of some behaviors
Lethargic, rapid breathing, sits on the bottom, hangs out at the top with head down (or head up), darting in a spiral fashion, swimming slowly without orientation, choking, flicking against objects in the tank or gravel