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I have an issue with my stocking list.... I just noticed that almost all of the fish on my stock list are middle to bottom level fish.

I need some fish that are middle to upper level fish, otherwise the top half of my tank will be empty! What can you guys suggest that will fill up the top half of the tank!


Christina

Hatchetfish are perfect for filling the top layer of a tank.

Marbled hatchets are really pretty. If you can't find 'em at your LFS, you can probably get 'em from Aquabid.

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Cake or death?

Are Hatchetfish the only option? I was hoping you guys would be able to giv eme a list of fish to choose from for the tank instead of just one.

I am not a big fan of hatchetfish either...

Christina

We'll get you a few more.

______________
Cake or death?

Bump!

Sorry I don't want to lose this thread!

I can't wait to move so tha tI can set this tank up!!!

Christina

I have an empty 55 gallon tank. I was going to use it for a FOWLR tank, but I decided I want to go bigger. This means I have a 55 gallon tank with no plans of anything in it.

I am up for suggestions!!!

I have always wanted angels so I was thinking a pair of angels and....???

I currently have a bad snail problem in my 25 gallon tank and I am considering getting a loach of some type to rid me of this problem. When I get the 55 up and running I will move him over to the 55 and possibly get him a buddy.

That makes it 2 angels and 2 loaches.

What would go well in this tank with these 4 fish I have pretty much decided on? I like lots of active fish. MAybe somethign a little unusual to go with it?

I love color and want to add as much color as possible. I know I cannot have neons since they are angel food, so what are some other ideas on fish for this tank?
I am open to all kinds of suggestions

If this helps any I think I am going to go with a more natural setting with natural colored gravel and rocks and live plants. Unless I decide on black gravel... I jsut love the way that looks. I probably won't this time since I all ready have a tank with black gravel though

Sorry I am now rambling to myself on this jsut ignore the last part... unless of course you find it amusing then feel free to laugh at me.

This does not HAV Eto be a set idea though so if anyone has a better idea of what I could put in a 55 gallon please tell me

I am becoming a real nut I tell ya!
I am going to have a house full of fish before long lol


Christina

Re: the loaches - I personally love yo-yo loaches. Great snail eaters once they get a taste for it. Get two to clean out your 25, then get at least 3 more, maybe 4 more. They love to shoal and they're ALWAYS active. I think 5 or 6 would be fine in your 55, depending on how many other fish you want. However, if your main fish are going to be the angels and you're goign to surround them with something small like tetras, I think you'll be fine with 5-6 no matter what. They'll max out around 3-3.5 inches.

here's a pic of two of mine:




Good luck! [/font]

---

Back in the saddle!

I think a good community tank would be:

-2 angels
-6 yoyo loaches
-6 cories
-8 tetras(choose a species you like)
-2 dwarf cichlids
-1 pleco that stays under 8in


Maybe you could even add a few more fish depends on how planted your tank will be but thats just my basic stocking idea.

I think I like that list Ethan.

Sneaky- I am not too fond of the rummynose for some reason...

If I do the loaches, could I do like 3 Clowns and 3 YoYo Loaches? Could I count that as my 6, or would I need to have 6 of one kind? I never looked at loaches much. I have never had a tank big enough for them.

I love cories so I could easily put them in my tank.
I have been looking into plecos and I am looking for some smaller ones anyway, so that shouldn't be hard to decide.

The 2 other cichlids, could I do rams? I have been looking for bolivians but I can't find them anywhere! I like them better than the German Blues.

or

Instead of the cichlids of whatever type, could I do 2 schools of tetras?

What about the Congo Tetras? I do not know much about them. Would they be okay in the tank?

I am sure I will come up with more questions, but for now I will hush...

Christina

I am in the same situation you are in...except I have my 55g set up now. I have 8 head and tailight tetras. They are pretty but not really interesting. I also have 10 cories and 3 yoyo loaches. I love my cories. They are so fun to watch. My yoyo's hide during the day and only come out while the lights are off. So I don't see them much. I think it depends on their personalities though because some people's yoyo's come out alot. They are pretty good on snails. I put them in my 10g for a couple weeks to take care of snails in there and when I moved them, there were only a few very tiny snails left.
I also want angels. I am going to add another school of tetras before I get the angels though. I am thinking about rummynose (I see you don't like them) or cardinals. Cardinals are very pretty. I am now trying to get more plants before I add any more fish. Then I will most likely get a Bristlenose next. If I can find one.
I hope my suggestions helped a little. Good luck with your set up. It is taking me forever it seems to get my tank how I want it. I am a little impatient.

More suggestions: black neons (the ones I've seen are bigger than regular neons) and lemon tetras

edit: My tank will be atleast moderately planted when I add the 2nd school of tetras and later the angels. Like someone else suggested, you should have lots of plants if you are gonna go with 2 school of tetras.

Last edited by GirlieGirl8519 at 16-Nov-2005 18:43

*Kristin*

OK, first of all, clown loaches in the long run,
are going to grow way to big for that tank.
Personally, knowing how attached I get to fish,
I wouldnt recommend you get them as you would have
to remove them several years down the road when you
surely will be very attached to them.
I would stick to 6 of the same species. Not only will
it be better for the loaches, but it will allow you to
see their full potential as a large group.
So you dont like rummynoses, hmmm....
Heres a few more options that would be suited to your
setup:
Cardinal Tetras
Bloodfin Tetras
Glowlight Tetras (angels seem to show no interst in these fish for some reason- no blue?)
Buenos Aires Tetra- if you like a larger tetra,
with silver and red and black, with lots of personality, this could be the fish for you. I cannot speak more highly of any tetra. While slightly nippy as youngsters,
they do grow out of it quickly. They are a long lived, medium size tetra of about 2.5-3 inches, and look fabulous in my opinion, in a tank with angels.
Black Neons
Harlequin Rasbora (though may be food for angels, have never kept them so cant tell you for sure)
Scissortail Rasbora - a larger rasbora, very interesting looking
Lemon Tetra

There are many interesting types of fish suitable to keep with Angels. Just depends what you like!
What I usually do when thinking about a new fish is browse the profiles here, and the ones on aquazoo and badmans, and find fish i like, then ask here for info.


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My main concern right now is which tetras can I have that my angels will not eat? I think I am going to skip the cardinals. I had a VERY bad experience with them. I like the neons but I know the angels will eat them for sure so I cannot have them...
I do like the black neons... Would they be okay with angels?
I also like pencilfish as well.

If the harlequin rasboras won't get eaten then I would like to ahve some of those as well.

Maybe I should just keep the angels a wish for now and decide other fish for the tank before I decide definitely on the angels or not?

The lemons are pretty too.

Are congos out of the question?

I think I will take these suggestions to the LFS and jot down a list of fish that I really liek and really want and see what you guys think abotu the lists. I should be able to get back to you in a day or so.


Christina

My main concern right now is which tetras can I have that my angels will not eat

chrissy, there's no really good reason for this to be your main concern when starting up this tank . When you get the angels they'll be very small, as with the neons or harlies. By the time your angels grow large enough to be able to eat small neons, the neons etc. will already be grown up and too large for the angels to eat. The only problem would be adding a school of small neons to a tank with full grown angels already in it. I've heard neons are their natural prey in SA.

---

Back in the saddle!

Christina,
What Nowher said is very true. I had a school of cardinals and rummynoses with two small angels they were still together when the angels got to be full size and their was absolutely no problem. The angels never even chased the tetras. The one thing I will say about angels, if you get two for example and they aren't a mating pair the dominant one will bully the other relentlessly. They will not swim around your tank looking graceful. So if you do get them, I would get three or skip them altogether. I ended up trading mine in, because they simply looked to big in my 46gallon and it made my tank look tiny and you couldn't appreciate the aquaascaping.

Here's a pic of the Angel with some cardinals in my old 46G. Look how big he looks.





tetratech attached this image:


My Scapes

Pencilfish are awesome in planted tanks. I have nine Beckford's in my 55 and they're a lot of fun to watch, especially when the males get really bright colors and spar after water changes. They don't bother any of my other fish and they're big enough that I wouldn't worry about them with full-grown angels.

______________
Cake or death?

Ok, I have changed my mind some. Me! NO! but yes... Anyway!!!

I completely forgot abotu another of my favorite fish! Keyhole Cichlids. I am going to do them instead of Angels. They do nto get as big and they are more peaceful, atleast thats what I have been told.

This bring me to my next question. How many Keyhole cichlids can I have in a 55 gallon tank? Could I have a pair, or should I jsut do one? I want other fish, so this will not be my only fish.

2 Keyhole Cichlids
10 Pencilfish
10 Neons
4 YOYO Loaches
8 Cories
1 Clown Pleco (I think this is what kind I want I am not 100% sure on that yet.)

How does this sound?
Can I add something else? Maybe a few more cories? A few more of one of the others, or even a different fish all together?


Christina

That sounds like a pretty cool idea with the festivum. I only know of the keyhole cichlids being peaceful really. It is hard to find a nice cichlid, unless you really know what you are loking for.

Could I do 2 festivums, or should I stick with one?
If I do 10 cories, I will probably get 2 schools of 5 then. I have ALWAYS wanted orange cories, but I know they are not eazy to find. If I could have 2 festivul that would really rock!
Here is my list. I really have to keep my list updated for myself because I don't wan to forget anything.

2 Keyhole Cichlids
1-2 Festivums
6 YOYO Loaches
10 Pencilfish
10 Fire Neons or Glow Light Tetras. I forgot I am trying to do something different than Neons I all ready have a tank with them in it.
10 Cories (5 of one and 5 of another)
1 Pleco (Probably a clown)
Is there anytihng else I can add?


Christina

Christina,
Hi!
Keyholes are an awesome choice.
Yes more peaceful, and no they dont reach the sheer
proportions large adult angels reach.
I think you could probably do 4 keyholes,
and up the YOYO loaches to 6.
You could increase the cory school if you want to 10.
Your stocking looks good.
You could still do a single angel if you wanted I think,
with 2 keyholes, but its up to you after all its your tank!
OR
You could do 2 keyholes and a Festivum. They are awesomely
cool cichlids too and also very peaceful.
Would make a nice contrast to the keyhole circles on the keyhole cichlids and their rounded form, the nice flag shape body and black stripe of the festivum.


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Waddya mean by 'butterfly pleco'? You mean a hillstream loach?

Hillies are coldwater fish that need a LOT of uni-directional (one way...like a river/fast moving stream) current. They can't take temps over 70F for very long...

I've gone thru 3 hillies in the last couple years...something always goes wrong an' the tank gets too hot (fans die, etc)... arg...

I really reccomend that you forget the idea of hillstream loaches... they're really sensitive, an' really picky, an' rather expensive.

I'll upload a pic of a hillstream when I can find one

I think I have made a decision on my tank inhabitants

2 Keyhole Cichlids
2 Festivums
6 YOYO Loaches
10 Pencilfish
10 Black Neons This is the only thing I am not 100% sure about because I really like color and if I can find soemthing that has more color that works just as well I might use something else.
16 Cories (6-8 of each species... or more) pandas are becoming morea and more readily azailable around here i think so I might get a school of Pandas or Juliis and maybe a school of skunks. Unless I can find some Corydoras polystictus, then I might change my mind to a school of those and a school of skunks, which I have not really seen the skunks around here either.
1 Clown Pleco unless I find a Queen Arabesque, or even better a Butterfly Pleco, which I HIGHLY doubt I will find either of those.


Christina

Figure eight puffers are not freshwater and do not belong in a community tank. They require brackish water to survive long term. No puffer really belongs in a community tank anyway. Dwarf puffers are a possibility but usually end up at least destroying their tankmates fins one day if not killing several tankmates. They also aren't very fast and can be very difficult to feed in a community tank of fast schooling fish. Yoyo loaches will eat snails as well or better than a puffer without causing any of those problems.

if u get angles then get them when there babes so they wont eat tetras or small fish they were around oh and for the snail problem i would say.... puffers (for me a figure 8 puffer)

I think I'd leave out the congos considering the size of the other fish and the type of tank your thinking of going for. Lots of small schooling fish would look quite dwarfed and hidden when compared to congo tetras. Originally in my 55g I had 8 congos, a few emperor tetras, 4 panda cory, 4 yoyos, 1 pleco, and a blue gourami. It looked pretty good since emperors are not schooling and scattered around in the areas the congos didn't use. You definitely want at least 6 of each cory and loach species you choose but finding either pandas or yoyos here is near impossible so I'm still working on those schools. Now in the 90g I've added threadfin rainbows and several smaller plecos but I think in any smaller tank and without a huge school of threadfins you wouldn't notice them because of the size of the congos. 1 school of black neons might work as they are a bit bigger and more colorful as well as a very different and contrasting color to the congos. If you put in 1 very large school of black neons or similar sized and brightly colored fish and 1 school of congos that would probably be it for schooling fish and I definitely wouldn't add something as large as angels to that mix. If you want lots of activity and different schools as well as other mid swimming fish I would stick with the smaller schooling fish.

Hi Christina,
I think your stock list there looks
great!
I would go with 2 festivum and 2 keyholes.
That way you can see how they interact with
another of their kind.
Congo Tetras- these are a very large tetra- think
about the same size as a large male pearl gourami if
youve seen one, or about 4 inches.
If you lessened the schools of pencils to 6 and the glowlights to 6, you could probably go with a small school of 6 Congos. They are gorgeous and of course suited to your tank, but do occupy a great deal of space.


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I think I liek that list, Poison.
Would I be okay if I had 2 festivum? I wasn't sure if I could have two.
I don't care so much about the cories schooling really I just like the different types of cories really.
The only thing I haven't decided on at theis point is what type of pleco. I loke the clown plecos but I was going to put onf of those in my 25 gallon tank. I am trying not to have any of the same fish in each of the different tanks. Would there be another pleco that would fit better in my 25 gallon? I really do not have room for a piece of driftwood in the tank.

2 Keyhole Cichlids
1-2 Festivums
6-8 YOYO Loaches
10 Pencilfish
10 Glolight or cardinals
12-16 Cories (6-8 of each species... or more)
1 Pleco (clown, BN, queen arabesque (sp?), etc... something small, but cute )
Of course I will have a cute pleco! I would NEVER have one that wasn't cute!!!

No one ever gave me an answer about congo tetras. I think they are pretty and thought abotu putting them in this tank, but no one ever gave me an answer on whether or no that was a good idea.
I just need to make my final decisions I guess.
Oh yea, I have a few minor things I still need to get. As soon as I move and have my stand built, Iwill get that stuff and Set it up. I will try to do a post on it when I set it up too. I am oging to need lots of help on the aquascaping.


Christina

Poison's right. Your plec -should- be cute.
My clown is downright adorable.
I've been looking at bulldog plecs (chaetosoma sp., if my little book is correct) for my next 'small fish' tank. They look pretty interesting too, but not quite so 'cute'. Farlowellas are pretty peaceful, and they're a real conversation-starter.
And they've got pretty eyes.

______________
Cake or death?

With multiple schools of cories, make sure that you've got atleast 6 of each species, otherwise they'll feel intimidated and school in one big group, and it completely defeats the purpose of mutliple schools...

I'd personally do 2 schools of 10 each (probably pandas and delphax or agasazzi), but 6-8 of each species would be just fine. The more you've got, the more seperate the schools will be, an' the happier the cories will be, an' the bigger the chance they'll breed

I USED to have a couple decent sized schools in my 29, but hydrogen sulfide wiped half of them out I'm getting more sometime, but not sure exactly when...

My ideas for a stock list -

2 Keyhole Cichlids
1-2 Festivums
6-8 YOYO Loaches
10 Pencilfish
10 Glolight or cardinal tetras
12-16 Cories (6-8 of each species... or more)
1 Pleco (clown, BN, queen arabesque (sp?), etc... something small, but cute )

I'd definately put some driftwood in, an' put in at least a few plants for the cories an' loaches to play/hide/breed in. Some of the lower light aponogetons would work, as would most crypts. Java moss, java fern, hornwort, anacharis, etc wouldn't be a problem in low light either.

Have fun

I think your much better off with the keyholes than the angels. Tank size and angels is a tricky think. If your tank isn't really going to be scaped with pieces of driftwood, rock and alot of plants than a 55 obviously is plenty big, up if your going to do all those things, within a year those angels are going to look really crowded and it will take away from anything you've done with the tank scaping-wise. I'm not that familiar with festivims, I usually don't see those put in the mix you have. Make sure they are soft water and not aggressive.

My Scapes

Anyone know a way I can find Bolivian Rams? I cannot find them ANYWHERE!


Help!

Christina

Well, I am still ahving trouble finding the Bolivian Rams, I guess I will ahve to request them from my LFS. I hope they can get them... I also have a feeling that I am going to have to do that with the Keyholes and possibly some other fish as well.

I went to Petsmart the other day and talked to a close friend of mine that has worked there for a few years now. I asked her if they still sold Keyhole Cichlids there and she had NO clue what I was talkign about. Keep in mind that she seems to think that she knows everything about fish just because she works in the fish department at some big chained pet store. *Rolls Eyes* I just had to laugh because that is not the first time I have asked her about a fish and she had no idea what I was talking about. That goes to show you that just because you have experience with something doesn't mean you know EVERYTHING about something... Now if I could just get her to realize that she doesn't know everything...


Christina

Common, but since you didnt specify I assumed. my bad, hey i migrated my tank today
not sure about the mortality of the babies yet.

What kind of pleco did you have though? Some of them are wors than that tan others. I have seen some tips on how to keep your plants in the substrate to keep them from uprooting them. Like I said I would love to have a scribble pleco and since they only get to be like 2.8 inches I doubt he will be able to do much damage to the plants, especially if I add him last after all of my plants have rooted themselves down into the gravel. I just love plecos so I must have one. I am of course still tryign to decide what I want for sure so who knows what I will end up with.


Christina

Chrissy,

If your tank is really heavily planted you don't much have to worry about the sand going anaerobic. Also getting small burrowing animals will help with that also. If you only use an inch of sand it wont go anaerobic so easily so I would get the plants started and then add sand as your plants start to fill in. The gravel vac will work well you will just need pick it up to let the sand filter out of the vac. You may end up having to put the siphoned sand that did make it thru the vac back into the tank.

I also suggest droping the pleco if you plan to have heavy plants mine at 4 inches was uprooting every plant it swam next to


Last edited by mrwizerd at 03-Dec-2005 10:58

Yes I am going to try to do a log on the set-up. Maybe I will get a digital camera for christmas like I asked for. I doubt it... when I told my mom that I wanted one she said too bad she all ready asked for one this year. I said that wasn't fair but she didn't seem to care... I am trying to decide what substrate to put in the tank. I talked to a friend of mine last night and she suggested sand... I will have live plants so that should work right? I can do either black or white sand or I could do both and mix it. The only problem with the white sand it that it might wash out the fish so either I could do all black or I could figure out some sort of mixture for both that won't wash out the fish. I know is SW tanks that there are certain fish snd such that stir up the sand on their own but I don't know of anything like that in FW Do you guys? What do you think of the sand?

Also, If I were to do sand, would I be able to use the gravel vac or would it suck up the sand when I am tryign to use it? I have never used sand as a substrate before. I do not know much about it honestly. I do know you have to stir it up because it can get pockets of chemicals and that can be bad for the fish.

Well, here is the latest stock list, I thought I had decided on the list but then as I was typing it out I changed my mind. lol I change my mind a lot. :%)

2 Keyhole Cichlids
2 Bolivians
10 Harlies
12 Danios (a few different kinds)
4-6 YoYo Loaches
16 Cories (2 Different Types) I am thinking about doing just one school of maybe 10 instead of 2 because I am also going to get the YoYo's for the bottom
1 Pleco
4 Ottos? This is a new thought because I know plecos can get lazy on the algae upkeep, but I know these guys love it.


Christina

Last edited by dvmchrissy at 21-Dec-2005 15:26

You -sound- really excited. Are you going to do a log of the tank setup?

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Cake or death?

AWESOME! That is exactly what I was wanting to do! I love watching them flit around the tank! They are lots of fun!

I will probably do like 3-4 of each because there are like 3 different kinds at the LFS that I go to so that is exciting!

That makes me so excited!


Christina

Christina,
all danios are the same species or very very closely
related subspecies. Zebras, Leopards, and albinos/long fin varieties of all these types with school together. Leopards are my fave. You could do a large mixed group of danios that would look nice.


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Christina,

I am not so sure as for the danio however the pristellas rummy's and neons i had in my 29 gal all swam together. As for top I still say killi

I am thinking Danios sound good because I was actually thinking about using them to cycle my tank anyway. I will have a planted tank and people have said do not do a fishless cycle because it is not good for the plants.

Anyway, would 2 different groups of 5 danios be okay? I really liek the ones with the longer fins and tails the spotted danios ( I think thats what they are called) and the Long Finned Zebra Danios are really pretty. If there is a 3rd kind what abotu 3 groups of 4? Will they swim together? I can't remember. They are very similar but yet a bit different too... What do ya think?


Christina