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The salamanders are probably some kind of Mole Salamander (from the family Ambystomatidae). Check out the species native to the area where you collected them.

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I'm not your neighbor, you Bakersfield trash.

Well, they lost their gill thingies, and now they're fully developed They are definately Tiger Salamanders (their stripes are very prominent now). And I gave them away to a chick at the LFS because I needed the tank (setting up a real paludarium now).

Thanks for all of the help and info

Longhaired Git,
I am sorry to disagree with you here,
but Axolotls do not live wild is Wisconsin.
That is about 4000 km north of Mexico, so a long
long way from the Axolotls wild range.
These are indeed some type of wild American Salamander.
I suspect they are Tiger Salamander young myself.
Perhaps she will luck out and get the nice blue ones!


Any updates or new pictures of your friends Waffle?


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ps somebody said about the underside markings- well your axolotls are identical to mine give or take some normal variability- since mine have bred at the larval stage and tigers dont do that- i think its fairly conclusive that the identification of both mine and yours must be axolotls rather than tigers.

Care for either is much the same, and if you notice radical changes happening gradually or in a response to lower water levels then its likely that you have tigers since axolotls do not typically leave the neonate stage and turn into adults without injectable hormones. ( there are a couple of notable exceptions to this when axolotols were kept at the jardin de plantes near paris, they metamorphosed into the adult stage naturally and even bred,) Since axolotls typically do not live long after reaching the rare adult stage, attempting to encourage them to make the change is probably a bad idea.

If your axolotls by some chance do turn out to be tigers you will need to change the aquarium into a paludarium setup so that they can take to their more terrestrial existance without problem.

oh yes and you may have read that axolotols were food for mexicans- and indeed they were- but boiling them destroys the process of decomposition thus that makes them toxic in death, and in life they arent particularly toxic if eaten fresh. Cant imagine eating a live axolotl though.

Apparently boiled axolotls taste like chicken.

What a surprise.lol


for breeding you will need lots of space, ive never had them breed in less than a 40 gal, and funnily enough a substrate is unimportant for breeding, but axolotls are generally encouraged to breed on floating and midwater plants, often nothing more than a bug bunch of elodea is required, but they do appreciate secrecy and it can be worth coviring the front of the aquaria if you think they may be getting frisky.

As with many amphibians , male competition is important for breeding , so have the females outnumbered at least 2 to one by the males, and be prepared for some conflict, they can often get nippy around breedig events.

axolotls can be sexually mature at 6 months , so depending on condition, that means they can breed when they are 5-6 inches long, although second year breeders are typically more successful.



Last edited by Lindy at 25-Aug-2005 07:03

Theyre axolotls, theyre one of a few species along with the tiger salamanders that have that distictive lip formation on the upper jaw ( looks a bit like fangs lol. ) and that relative positioning of the nostrils and eyes. Tiger salamanders rarely exibit such profound markings along the body, and they certainly dont have gills quite that long. Oddly enough one of the links sent to you has a picture of a tiger salamander but states that it is an axolotl, so you can see how the confusion happens.Mudpuppies have much redder gills containing higher levels of haemaglobin, and there is a characteristic dark line running anterior to the eye, in addition the snout is longer, and the skull more angular, but your axolotl has quite long gills so i see how the misidentification occurred.

As to the feeding, they will often take bloodworm when young, but i raised one to over 11 inches long on nothing more than crickets and other insect fare thrown in that i keep for the reptiles, but they readily accept live fish small enough to swallow in one go, and they are particularly fond of earthworms (i recommend you culture them yourself to avoid parasite issues). Some people give them beef heart, but even that is too fatty for them really. Theyll accept most live fare intended for medium sized tropical fish tho, most larvae and most worms , so you have plenty of choice to choose from.If youre offering tubifex worms tho, chop them up to being no more than an inch long or so, as longer fine foods will go in the mouth, and pop out the sides of the gill openings and get caught in the gill filaments causing all sorts of problems.

And yes they like frogs too.

Some people have had limited success in offering dried foods, but it isnt usual for them to be accepted


Axolotls can take fairly acidic water but in captivity typically fail to tolerate low oxygenation, although you may have better luck than most as gill size varies and yours are large, and gill size directly affects the efficiency of oxygen absorbtion.

Another couple of things to watch concerning water toxicity .

1) Ammonia poisoning, primarily because most axolotls excrete irregularly and sometimes in big loads all at once, so make sure you overfilter, and spot check for the faeces, which comes in little slimy packets , and handily if you net them before the slime ruptures not much pollution is released into the water.Axolotls are ironically very susceptible to gill damage, which is often fatal , caused by ammonia poisoning, generally far more so than fish, although they are largely unconcerned by nitrate or tannin levels.

2) Sick or dying axolotols , actually realise cyanide compounds in the water even prior to death as their tissues start to break down, so quarantining very sick animals is essential, and is considered good practice anyway. Dead animals release massive amounts of these compounds , and should you come across one remove it immediately, and go straight into substrate change and emergency water change mode. Axolotls will take less damage from straight tapwater even if the temperate is wrong than than polluted water produced by a fallen comrade.

The cyanide levels are not enough to harm a human, but will kill most fish, other amphibians and even damages plants within a few hours so get straight onto fixing it.

Lastly as regards behaviour, some axolotls reserve the right to be aggressive for any number of reasons, and they dont feel they need an excuse to inflict fatal wounds on a tankmate, so dont leave aggression unchecked. Seperate aggressive animals quickly.

And yes, before you ask ,their famed healing abilities count for nothing in a sustained attack, and often minor wound can become fatal, as stressed axolotls unlike most salamanders and frogs are very susceptible to fungal infections, and it only takes one to infest a whole tank in days.

Recovery rates for axolotls with fungus are lousy , so treat fungal infections seriously.

ps in case you were worried about the conflicting info thing - im a herpetologist theyre aquarists
seriously ive worked with over 2000 species of herps, have written papers used as reference by colleges in the uk, and have worked with reptile rescues , zoos, and so forth for over 20 years.I also have a substantial herp collection including lizards ( including at least one representative group of all lizards types on earth except for one.) snakes, frogs toads, salamanders, amphiumas and others.

Oh, and i currently keep axolotls


(ps axolotls are severely endangered in nature and the only reason they are bred so widely is because they are used them for scientific research into cellular regrowth, they are not as a rule extensively bred in the hobby because successful large scale breeding is usually done in huge aquaria. Most specimens are supplied as surplus from scientific research to wholesalers, not from fish breeders. Should this research stop or slow down, they will become much less commonly available, so treasure your axolotls and try to breed them if you can.)

hope all this trivia helps in some way, lol.
best of luck- Dom.

tiger salamander larva garenteed
i got thirteen from a bait shop in northern wisconsin and grew them.
they are definatly just plain tigers.
you can tell from the banding on the underside. they are the largest salamander in north america, they get up to about 8 inches in larvel satge then up to 12 when they come out of the water. the frogs looked to be green grass frog froglets wood frogs are heavy brown and leave the pond almost immediatly after turning into frogs to go live in a deansly wooded area, whereas the green grass frog is very common in the north and lives in ponds its entire life.

ya i like herps

Last edited by snake09j at 11-Aug-2005 00:36

If I had to sport a guess just by range, I'd say some subspecies of tiger salamander, though the eyes are lying a bit low on the head.

Last edited by Cup_of_Lifenoodles at 01-Aug-2005 13:37

How big is it? I thought it looked a bit large to be a larva.

It doesn't look like a mudpuppy to me... The shape of the head and gills is completely different.

I still say it's a Mole Salamander larva.

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I'm not your neighbor, you Bakersfield trash.

i think djtj is right- they look like water dogs/mud puppies. feeding is easy- they eat anything. i never kept any, but i think a ten gallon is a bit too small, and they do not need air exposed rock ledges to rest on.

good luck.

Dude, they're mud puppies!!!

Daka brought me 2 salamanders and 2 tree frogs back from his trip to some lake in minnesota! At the moment, I've got 'em in a hastily set up 10g paludarium on the floor They seem to be adjusting alright...

I've got some questions tho -
What species of salamander and frogs do I have? (refer to pics)
How big will they all get?
What should I feed 'em?
Can they be trained to take dead/pelleted foods?
Is a 10g fine to keep them in?
Do they secrete poison?
How much of their time do they spend in the water?
Could I keep them in a tank without land?
Would they fight with ACF's in a 10g?
Could I keep them in a 10g with 2 ACF's?
Would it be possible to breed them?

Pics are on my photobucket thing...click here

Any help would be greatly appreciated! Thanks

Last edited by PoisonWaffle at 25-Jul-2005 00:27

Yep...that's the froggies! Thanks for figgerin' that out for me! ...too bad they got eaten by the salamanders

Ah well, poor froggies

I'll have to give that place an email and see if they've got any ideas on what species of salamander they are. One thing's for sure, the things love to eat a LOT of live food (frogs, crickets, and minnow are on their eating list, for sure )

Thanks again

I found out what your froggies are though!
They are Wood Frog, Rana sylvatica
Heres the link to info:
http://www.npwrc.usgs.gov/narcam/idguide/wood1.htm

Last edited by Sneaky_Pete at 29-Jul-2005 17:25

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Poison as I said:
"B) A Juvenile form of an adult Salamander of some type."
Until it becomes adult, it is virtually impossible to
figure out what species it is, as most salamander juveniles look alike!
Perhaps you could try contacting a herpetologist in your area, they usually work for zoos, museums, etc,
and email them the pictures.
I did this for both an insect and a bird, and both these
people had answers for me within a week. Probably your best bet!
However, here is a checklist of all the salamander and frog species north of mexico in north american, perhaps you will be able to figure it out with some sleuthing!

[link=http://www.npwrc.usgs.gov/narcam/idguide/]http://www.npwrc.usgs.gov/narcam/idguide/" style="COLOR: #00FF00[/link]

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Then you must have an old/bad monitor...they show up fine on mine and on all of the other ones I've seen 'em on

BTW, I did have a 15w CF lamp w/metal reflectors pointed at 'im

...and it's NOT an axo, it's a coldwater salamander in it's larval stage...found way up in minnesota

the one is either A) An Axolotl, or B) A Juvenile form of an adult Salamander of some type.
Can I ask you for the salamanders pics,
Could you take some new ones with either flash, or
with a lamp placed nearby,
all I see is black nothing.


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Alright...to eliminate some confusion...the TOP 8 PICTURES ARE THE PICTURES WERE LOOKING AT! Most of the rest of 'em are from the National Aquarium in Baltimore, and various other places

It's definately not an axo...these were wild caught in a 50*F lake in minnesota. I've got the frogs and the salamanders are in a 10g with some rock piles and floating plants that they can sit on, so they're fine...The salamanders haven't showed any intrest in coming out of the water...

I was askin' 'bout the ACF's because I've got an ACF tank that I'd like to put the salamanders in there while I actually set up the paludarium decently

Any answers to the above questions?

Thanks

ok identified the salamander... i think

Mexican axolotl

http://worms.zoology.wisc.edu/frogs/amphol.html

http://www.photovault.com/Link/Animals/Amphibians/Salamanders/show.asp?tg=AASVolume01/AASV01P01_08.2564


EDIT: are all of the pictures in the album from your tanks?

Last edited by Ethan14 at 25-Jul-2005 02:35

ahhh i recognize that salamander.... cant think of the name. I'll get back to you one that. I don't know about the frogs.

the best thing to feed them would probably be crickets... but the salamanders might want feeder fish. I don't think they could be trained to take dead/pelleted foods. I'm not sure if a 10 gallon is good to keep them in. Usually it's alright for most amphibians but for those I don't know. How many and what do you have in there?

You need some land. The frogs need it. I think it might get pretty crowded in there with salamanders, frogs, and acfs so you might want to look into separating some of them or getting a larger tank. And I don't know about breeding.