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Hi everyone !

I plan on getting a new 29 G tank ( 24L x 18W x 15H ) and making it into my first planted tank .
One of my main concerns is that since there will be some fish in the tank and CO2 is required for
healthy plants , will the increase in acidity caused by the CO2 harm the fish ? Ill be putting in some
fancy guppies ,which from from what Ive read prefer slightly alkaline water so would it be ok for
them or should I ditch the CO2 ? Plus if I do add a teeny amount of salt in the tank would it harm most
plants ?

I think I could fit in about 15-20 fish in my tank but I plan on stocking only 8 - 10 of them so would
I still need a filter considering the tank will be pretty heavily planted ? Will a Sponge Filter do?

Could you guys suggest a good algae-eating fish or shrimp which is small in size and doesn't grow over
3-4 inches max and is compatible with guppies and doesn't ruin the plants. Also which are some good
foreground and mid ground plants with small leaves or grassy in appearance and some good carpet
plants/mosses other than Java moss that I can use (pls give common as well as scientific names
if possible).
Finally is 15 inches an Ok height for a planted tank or should I increase it to 18 inches.

Thanks in advance

Hi,
Welcome to FP!

As far as the CO2 is concerned, you rarely "need" to add
CO2. If you read through the various threads here, you will
find a couple that are "Non CO2 Tanks" and all of them are
lush green tanks. If you stick with low to medium lighting
and low to medium light demand plants, you should be fine
without the addition of CO2 and the possible resulting
shift in pH toward the acidic. Given the size of the fish
and the dimensions of the tank however, you will probably
need to provide some sort of fertilizer for the plants to
make up for what the fish cannot contribute. Probably you
will do regular dosing of one of the Flourish products or
something similar.

Like many live bearers, guppies would like a tad of salt in
their water. Note, these are not "brackish water" fish so
the amount added would be very very small and I doubt that
it would not affect the plants you are most likely to find
in your LFS. As you have read, some plants are sensitive
to salt, but as long as you are diligent in regulating
the amount of salt in the water, that you will have any
problems. In case you don't know, salt does NOT evaporate
along with the water. So, when you top off the tank for
evaporation do not add any salt. Only add salt when
you have drained water from the tank, and then add only
enough to mix with the quantity that you are replacing.

A filter does a variety of things including trapping solid
debris floating in the water and it is another "home" for
the bacteria that supports the Nitrogen Cycle. Next to the
gravel, it is the second largest reservoir of that
bacteria. Personally, I would never have a tank without a
filter, and I would also recommend what is called a HOB
filter (Hangs on the outside back) for the tank. Now, in
the filter you can use sponge material if you like. Just
remember to clean it with each water change, by taking the
sponge out of the plastic filter box and, in a bucket of
old tank water, squeeze it out a couple of times, and then
replace it back into the filter. Cleaning it under running
tap water will allow the chlorine and chloramines in the
the water to kill the bacteria, and the tank will "mini-
cycle" while the bacteria reestablishes the colonies.

Most plants that are considered foreground plants require
3+ watts per gallon of light and when you cross that
"threshold" from low to high lighting, you will need to
use injected CO2 to feed the plants that you are "driving"
with high quantities of light. That said, with a 15 inch
high tank, and 3-4 inches of gravel, you only have 11-12
inches of water between the light and the gravel surface.
You might get away with some of the less demanding small
plants and 2 watts per gallon of light.

One of the most frequently used fish to help control algae
is the Otocinclus Arnoldi. Kept in small groups, this little fish
can clean a tank easily. Certain snails are also a
possibility but they can rapidly take over a tank.

The 15 inch tank is perfectly fine for most plants you just
have to be careful in what you purchase. An amazon sword,
for instance, can start out looking great, but given the
right conditions, can take over a 200 gallon tank! Any stem
plants that you add will rapidly reach the surface and
start growing across it. That can be good as the plant will
provide a perfect hiding place for the baby guppies, and
also provide shade for the fish as well. You will need to
be diligent in pruning them however as they will soon
become plants that are feet in length instead of inches.
By increasing the tank to 18 inches you would be adding
around 3 inches of water between the light and the gravel
surface and could loose the possibility of the ground
cover that you want with the lighting you have. I think
I'd stick with the 15 inch tank.

Hope this helps...
Frank


-->>> The Confidence of Amateurs, is the Envy of Professionals <<<--

Wow ! Thanks for the amazing reply Frank !

I kind of see your point about the CO2 thing and I was thinking myself that I would only really use CO2 in the beginning and only if the plants aren't doing too well later on . Ill try not using CO2 at all and see how it goes.

Another question that came up today was : Sould the thickness off the aquarium glass be 6mm or 8mm ? the 8mm tank costs almost double so I was wondering if it was required cos the tank isnt that big plus thicker glass would mean more refraction.

The only 2 full spectrum fluorescent lights I can get are Hitachi and Azoo , both 2 feet and rated 18W . Would I need 2 or is 1 enough considering I get some indirect sunlight (unavoidable)? Again one costs twice as much as the other so any recs would be nice .

By sponge filter I meant the one powered by the aerator , is it ok?
And for substrate I was thinking 1in of laterite + 2ins of golden sand , is that fine?

Hi,
The issue of CO2 vs non-CO2 is generally one of preference
and available money rather than need. IMO, once you up
your lighting to 3+ watts/gallon you really do need to add
Carbon, in some form. The light is the engine that drives
plant growth, and the Carbon is the fuel. Without light,
excess carbon goes into the reserves of the plants to a
point and then it simply is removed with water changes or
as gas into the atmosphere. High light, without carbon,
causes the plants to grow, and expend their stores of
carbon, and soon they will turn yellow and die off.

IMO, as long as you stay with low demand or most medium
demand plants, and 2-2.5(max)watts per gallon of light,
your plants will do fine. Part of that sentence requires
that you have a normal fish load, to provide enough waste
products to support the plants, and that you add regular
doses of a plant fertilizer, such as the Flourish series
of fertilizers.

From your comments about glass thickness, I gather that
you are either building this tank or having it built for
you. Personally, I'm kinda conservative when it comes to
building things, and generally speaking I over build for
longevity. Hence, I'd use the thicker glass. Probably
the smartest thing to do would be to go to a pet shop and
actually measure the thickness of the glass in their
factory made tanks.

Or, go to this web site:
http://saltaquarium.about.com/cs/aquariumdiy/l/blcustomtank.htm

Actually, unless you are purchasing a two bulb hood,
neither one of those is enough. To figure out what your
watt per gallon (wpg) rating is, you divide the total
wattage(s) of the lights by the capacity of the tank.
Two, 18 watt bulbs = 36 Watts divided by 20G = 1.2wpg.
This 1.2wpg would only allow you to grow SOME low light
plants. I don't know where you live, or your money
situation, but before I did anything, I would resolve the
lighting problem. I would suggest you look through the
drsfostersmith on-line catalog, in particular, at the
hoods that use either compact fluorescent bulbs or the
T-5 bulbs, and purchase one of them.
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/NavResults.cfm?N=2004+113345
OR
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Product/Prod_Display.cfm?pcatid=12772&N=2004+113175

In both cases the lights seem to come with bulbs you don't
need. I, personally, would stick with bulbs that were
around 6700K and no higher than 8800K in temperature. You
do not need anything that is actinic nor do you need
anything that is 10,000K! In that shallow a tank it could
be a disaster. I would talk with them by phone, an "800
number" and see if I could not talk them into swapping
bulbs for something more appropriate.

As far as the filter is concerned, honestly, I hate to have
a filter inside any show tank. They take up room and are
not particularly good for that purpose. That kind of filter
is ideal for tanks with baby fish, or hospital tanks.
Personally, I want room for the fish and plants and
aquascaping, between the heater and filter tubes, that is
enough to try and hide from view, much less an "ugly"
inside filter. I would use a HOB filter and put a
background of some sort between the glass and the filter.
Black construction paper is the least expensive resolution
to that problem and, it will eliminate that incidental
sunlight which could also cause a problem.

Frank


-->>> The Confidence of Amateurs, is the Envy of Professionals <<<--

Thanks for the advice Ive ordered my stuff . Now comes the hard part of waiting for everything to arrive

One more question , do I have to age the tank water before adding plants or can I just put them in after adding a dechlorinator ? Should I cycle the tank with the plants in or without the plants?

Hi,
When it comes to supplementing the tank with carbon, you
have two choices. You can inject the CO2 which can be
done with a DIY mix of Brewers Yeast, and sugar (can be a
real PIA), or a pressure bottle system (expensive outlay
but peanuts to maintain), or, you can purchase one of the
liquid fertilizers manufactured by companies such as the
SeaChem line of Flourish products.

You do not need to wait for a tank to cycle before adding
plants to the mix. As you mention, treat to remove
the chlorine, and chloramine, but after that you can add
the plants any time. The only caution I might mention is
that if your tank is heavily planted, especially with
fast growing stem plants, you may not see much of a
spike in ammonia or nitrite as the plants use the
stuff up just about as fast as it is produced.
In other words, your tank may cycle and you not
realize it.

Because this is a new tank, I would not consider letting
the water age before adding it to the tank. The plants
will not care, and with no fish, they won't either.
Some of our members do age their water before adding it
to a tank full of fish, while others (myself included)
use a Python brand siphon, mix the hot/cold at the tap,
add the dechlorinator, and mix while filling. IMO, it
would depend upon your source of water and what the city
does to the water to make if potable. Some, like Keith
for instance, get their water from a standing lake and
with the drought Down Under, the city has gone to some
extreme lengths to make the water safe. If you do decide
to age the water you will need a glass or plastic container
an air pump and air stone for circulation.
Also, the container should be opaque to help prevent the
formation of algae inside it.

Frank



-->>> The Confidence of Amateurs, is the Envy of Professionals <<<--