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ok so i bought this adorable as hell raphael catfish fry for onli 2bucks each i remember there was somehting in the catfish world abt how to handle raphaels properly coz using a net on an adult is simply impossibel due to fins and body armor gettin caught in the net....anyone here have any ideas?

Not had to handle spiny Doradids in my aquarium, but a thought occurs to me. This is definitely experimental, and should be taken with a large pinch of salt, but may work.

Doradids like shelter. Caves. So, get a plastic jar, and make it opaque so it resembles a cave. Then, chase the Raphael into it. Then you can lift the Raphael out relatively safely if you need to. Also gives you a handy container for water acclimatisation if you have to transfer the Raphael to a quarantine aquarium for treatment anytime.

I suspect someone else has already alighted upon something like this. I deduced this from first principles, and suspect that someone else will come along and say "Yep, I've already done that" ...


Panda Catfish fan and keeper/breeder since Christmas 2002

Yes, raphael catfish are e to being tangled up in nets. The safest way to capture them is sort of what Cal already said. Grab a plastic container and set it at the bottom of the tank, as near to the catfish as you can get it. Then, use your hand (or a net, but there would be a risk of entangling the fish) to chase the catfish in the container. After you've accomplished this, put your hand over the top of the container to prevent the fish's escape, and remove it from the tank.

At work, I use this practice to catch particularly spiny catfish. I use the plastic catch buckets, and the technique seems to work pretty well. Raphael catfish aren't the quickest fish, so they don't make the ordeal particularly troublesome.

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And when he gets to Heaven, to Saint Peter he will tell: "One more Marine reporting, Sir! I've served my time in Hell."

oooh okok thanks guys - actually what i was recalling more from memory is something like "pinch the raphael along its caudal peduncle with one hand, then with the other, support the fish by placing ur palm under the fish..." or something like that....

Actually, that's EXACTLY how you catch them. Other methods involve either using a pastic bag with holes punctured down the sides, a silk net, orcornering the fish in question with your hands, and grasping either side of the pectoral fin, envoloping it with your fingers. Having employed many of these options in handling the numerous loricariids that I've kept, the easiest, by far, is by hand.

C_o_L, handling may be OK for Loricariids, but I'd be a bit wary of handling a Doradid the same way. Seen the spines on a big Megalodoras irwini??? Those things are like shark's teeth!

Mind you, in the case of Megalodoras irwini, this is a fish that grows big enough to need two people to lift it once it's adult ...

Even the smaller ones like Raphaels and Acanthodoras spinossimus are like sea urchins with fins. Those spines perform a VERY effective protective function, and the other problem with handling Doradids is that they have powerful pectoral fins. They use these to clamp the flesh of potential or actual attackers against special rows of spines that run along the body close to the pectoral fin. The fin itself is frequently edged with more spines (sometimes double or triple rows) along the hardened first ray, which is extremely stiff. Get your fingers caught between the body and the pectorals of a Doradid, and MUCH pain will ensue. Including some tearing of flesh as you try to extricate them. Think of a Doradid as a fish with its own built in razor wire protection and you won't go far wrong. Hence my recommending a jar for capture purposes!


Panda Catfish fan and keeper/breeder since Christmas 2002

I always catch Doradids with my hands. Just be careful though - their bodies and pectoral fins have large serrated spines on them, and if they pinch your fingers between their fins in their body when they tuck their fins in, it really hurts and can easily draw blood.

I usually just hold onto them by their tails in the water, and then when they tuck their pectoral fins in, that's when I grab them.

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I'm not your neighbor, you Bakersfield trash.

By the same token, you'll never find a container big enough to house the aforementioned fish.

No need to worry, Cass, I know my dorididae anatomy; I'm always catching talking cats at work, as they tend to be very popular amongst our customers (in fact I catch most net-phobic fishes; i.e. puffers, larger cories, and bichirs with my hands). The trick, as has been stated, is to grasp the tail and place your palm around the gill plate and covering the pectorals, clutching the belly firmly. These are the smooth parts of the fish. Also I recall the fish in question being a 2" raphael, not a Megalodoras irwini (never heard of it, but I'm pretty sure the giant raphael is in the same genus).

Last edited by Cup_of_Lifenoodles at 09-Mar-2005 18:29

lol yeh my raphael is only 2cm *SO CUTE* its like seeing mini gold-balls swimmin around hahhahahah but one more q'n: i can already see development of spikes on pectoral fins as aforementioned - so how do i push the fins towrads the body if there are spikes itself on the fins? Secondly, wouldn't the fish be swimmin like mad to see 2 giantic hands coming after it in the tank, so how then do u catch it by its tail? hahhahahaha coz i noe i'd swim like hell if i were hte raphael

so how do i push the fins towrads the body if there are spikes itself on the fins?

If you hold onto the fish's tail, they automatically tuck in their pectoral fins in as a defense mechanism. Be cautious though, sometimes they will twist their bodies while your holding on and get ahold of your fingers.

Secondly, wouldn't the fish be swimmin like mad to see 2 giantic hands coming after it in the tank, so how then do u catch it by its tail? hahhahahaha coz i noe i'd swim like hell if i were hte raphael

Doradids actually aren't that hard to catch. They are relatively slow swimmers, and they would rather try and wedge themselves into a hiding place or a tank corner than try and swim away from your hands.

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I'm not your neighbor, you Bakersfield trash.

hahahahah ok then - thanks for replies guys!~ will update u guys when i finally do catch him when he's a lil bigger

C_o_L, if by the Giant Raphael you mean Megalodoras uranoscopus as featured on Planet Catfish, then irwini is closely related. And potentially even bigger. My Kobayagawa book has juvenile & adult pics I could scan & mail to you if you want. Believe me, this is a beast. Handsome, but a beast. Even the juvenile looks like something yuo'd use as a weapon in mediaeval combat, and as for the adult, well, I didn't describe this in previous Doradid threads as the M1 Abrams of the aquarium for nothing! If you have the space for it, irwini is one of those fishes that has LOTS of presence!

Someday we'll have to meet. Then you can show me how picking up a spiny Doradid is done. Won't happen anytime soon though, unless I win the Lottery


Panda Catfish fan and keeper/breeder since Christmas 2002

I'll try and bring my powershot to work on friday, as we get restocked then. If I see a raphael, I'll try and snap some pics.

The side spines on large Doradids can open you up like a rasor....however, many of them, like pseudodoras niger, are very personable and interactive cats. With my smaller Dorads (I have about 40 of them now), I go with the terracotta pot method....let them swim in, and pick them up in it...less stressful on the cat, and much nicer on my fingers.

I suspected as much Toirtis, which is why I went for the capture container method also. On some larger Doradids, the spines even look like pieces of razor wire, which made me wonder about the safety aspect of taking hold of them in the hand.

Sadly, PlanetCatfish doesn't have Megalodoras irwini in its database. But it's featured in the Kobayagawa book. And the illustrations differ from those of Megalodoras uranoscopus from the PlanetCatfish database sufficiently to make me consider that it still remains a separate species.


Panda Catfish fan and keeper/breeder since Christmas 2002