FishProfiles.com Message Forums

I'm giving away all the fish in my 20g...the cory school really should be added to but these are chain-store rescues that were sold as 'corys'



Attached Image:


~~~~~~~~~~~~
There is water at the bottom of the ocean

And one more...


Attached Image:


~~~~~~~~~~~~
There is water at the bottom of the ocean

These are tough to identify because some of the elegans-group species tend to run together. Many of them have highly variable patterns, which really create a problem. Though your fish appear to have rounded snouts like Corydoras elegans, my guess is that they are C. nanus. This species usually has more clearly defined flank stripes than some of the other related ones. The top fish is male, the second is female.

---

And when he gets to Heaven, to Saint Peter he will tell: "One more Marine reporting, Sir! I've served my time in Hell."

Are these the same fish? In any case, this fish is not c. nanus, which has four distinct lines on it's flanks and hails from an area of little commercial fishing for the aquarium trade.

I would say they are just San Juans (no scientific name but a pretty common species).

---

I'm not your neighbor, you Bakersfield trash.

"In any case, this fish is not c. nanus, which has four distinct lines on it's flanks and hails from an area of little commercial fishing for the aquarium trade."

They don't necessarily have to have the obvious stripes, this species is variable in its body pattern. As an example, corycats.com has a photo of a blurred-line C. nanus here. It's true that the species isn't imported much, but that doesn't mean it never is. Likely the fish above are some kind of variant, but C. nanus is the species that seems to me to be nearest in appearance.

"Are these the same fish?"

The dorsal finnage differs. This can be an indicator of gender, though not all males may have the slightly extended rays as shown above.

---

And when he gets to Heaven, to Saint Peter he will tell: "One more Marine reporting, Sir! I've served my time in Hell."

There are four obvious lines on the c. nanus in the picture, and the body shape of the fish is more elongated and thinner than the fish presented by the poster. I assure you, if any c. nanus make it out of Surinam, they sure aren't going to be labelled as "assorted corydoras".

I'm not convinced. First of all, I will say that the corycats.com fish and the first pictured cory here look pretty similar as far as clarity of the lines goes. I also find it hard to evaluate how robust a fish is by pictures like these, which do not show depth well. Body length can only be guessed at. The corycats.com photo does not even have gravel for comparison.

"I assure you, if any c. nanus make it out of Surinam, they sure aren't going to be labelled as 'assorted corydoras'."

Why not? Just because there may be only a few exporters working in Surinam (no idea what the actual count is) doesn't mean that they will be fully accurate when identifying fish. It's obvious that many of the elegans group species are confused with each other, so who's to say that exporters don't screw up? They can make mistakes labeling fish, or maybe somewhere down the line the cories could just be thrown into a pool of multiple species for later sale as "assorteds". Corydoras punctatus comes out of Surinam, and it is the subject of identification pandemonium. There are probably at least a half dozen other species which can be mislabeled as C. punctatus, and even when true punctatus are sold, it is not always by their own name. I don't see why other species such as C. nanus could not be mixed up as well.

---

And when he gets to Heaven, to Saint Peter he will tell: "One more Marine reporting, Sir! I've served my time in Hell."

"I'm not convinced. First of all, I will say that the corycats.com fish and the first pictured cory here look pretty similar as far as clarity of the lines goes."
I don't recall ever saying that the clarity of the lines were contestable. They certainly are clear and I can easily make out three distinct lateral lines.

"I also find it hard to evaluate how robust a fish is by pictures like these, which do not show depth well. Body length can only be guessed at. The corycats.com photo does not even have gravel for comparison."
The photo is fine. The fish shown is not even 45 degrees from parallel, and depth can easily be judged. Body length is somewhat estimatable by eye size. Similarly, the fish on Fuller's site has eyes larger in proportion and placed further on the head than the fish shown, and the dorsal fin is marked by parallel striping.

"It's obvious that many of the elegans group species are confused with each other, so who's to say that exporters don't screw up? They can make mistakes labeling fish, or maybe somewhere down the line the cories could just be thrown into a pool of multiple species for later sale as "assorteds". "
There are very few species of corydoras exported form that general region of the world, none of which are seen with any regularity, thus, price per fish is greater than would be "assorted corydoras"--and it is not in the best interest of the wholesaler, either. This gives the everyone involved more incentive to label them correctly. It's a difficult mistake to make, though not impossible.

"Corydoras punctatus comes out of Surinam, and it is the subject of identification pandemonium."
Correct. Labelling them as c. punctatus raises the resale value dramatically. I have yet to see a bona fide corydoras punctatus, mainly because it is not profitable or expidiant to obtain specimens from the Surinam area. The same goes for c. nanus.

"There are probably at least a half dozen other species which can be mislabeled as C. punctatus, and even when true punctatus are sold, it is not always by their own name."
That is a difficult judgement to make, seeing as how I have reason to doubt that you've seen a true specimen of c. punctatus.

"Labelling them as c. punctatus raises the resale value dramatically."

One would think so, but then again whenever I see false "punctatus" for sale here they cost about five dollars, the same as most other species in my area. Even a brief search of the Internet turned up a couple of sites claiming to have C. punctatus- The prices were between $3 and $5. Though these sites may not have the real deal, it doesn't seem that the nametag of these fish made them any more expensive.

Take the case of C. julii. Plenty of people sell C. trilineatus under this designation, probably more than sell it under its own name. I can buy "C. julii" for less than $3.50 nearby, and the highest I've seen charged for them in an area store is $4.99. It doesn't seem that the confusion knocked up the price any. It could be said that the sheer volume of these alleged C. julii drives prices down, but then one would expect shrewd individuals to start selling C. trilineatus as C. gomezi or something like that. If dishonest exporters/retailers/whoever were really that sharp and out for money, there would probably be even more problems with mislabeled fish. I just don't think this is the case. It's not that I don't believe people are unwilling to deceive to make money, it's that I don't think most folks are smart enough to work the system well. As such, I'm inclined to believe that purposeful misidentification of a cory for extra profit isn't too widespread.

Applying this to C. nanus, I don't see how it is unreasonable to think that random specimens make their way into "assorted" tanks. I know that at least one member of this forum has found C. panda and if I remember correctly, C. sterbai in such a tank. Each of those species would make a good deal more money being sold under its own name.

Anyway. It seems that we're at an impasse- you don't think that these are C. nanus, while I believe it is certainly possible. To me they look very close, so they could at least be a variant. I'm not going to push the issue any more, seeing as it is pointless. What do you think these fish are?

Any input, Theresa?

---

And when he gets to Heaven, to Saint Peter he will tell: "One more Marine reporting, Sir! I've served my time in Hell."

Any input, Theresa?

Ummm well.... I'll admit I'm way out of my league in this discussion. They are indeed two different fish but I believe them to be M/F of the same species.When first purchased I tried to ID them...various sites, books, etc but no luck. One picture would look just a bit different, enough to make me doubt a definite ID.

I don't see how it is unreasonable to think that random specimens make their way into "assorted" tanks.

I agree with this too, not only with cories but other species as well. A combo I've seen frequently is a tank marked 'plecos' that obviously contains BNs, clowns, rubbernoses and I'd wouldn't doubt some common plecs as well.

I know that at least one member of this forum has found C. panda and if I remember correctly, C. sterbai in such a tank.

Ok, well I'm a troublemaker-sometimes-so below is a pic that shows 3 of the fish I got from this 'cory' tank...



Attached Image:


~~~~~~~~~~~~
There is water at the bottom of the ocean

Would it be possible if we took the two pictures that you've taken over to PC, Theresa (sorry for the later response, I've been off for several days)?

Also, the other fish in question seem to be trilineatus, panda, and delphax.