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i decided im doing a 40G set up with bolivians, just curious on how many i could have in the 40G? i will be trying to breed them as well.It Will be heavily planted with eco complete as substrate. What would be the best level of ph be, if im correct they do like it in soft water as well, so how would one go abouts getting the prestine conditions needed? Any and all suggestions would be greatly appreciated. thanx in advance

If it's just the rams and the tank is a forty gallon breeder (long, wide and low), then I'll say maybe eight. As long as there's plenty of cover for them, you should be able to get away with that many. Bolivian rams do prefer a somewhat acidic pH (probably between 6.6 and 6.9) and soft water, but are greatly tolerant in regard to these parameters. I just don't think it's worth fiddling around with pH and all as long as the levels remain the same. Freshwater fish are usually very adaptable and can easily get used to a stable pH level, even one different than their favored one.

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Perfect water condiontions? Bag them up, get a ticket to south america, go to bolivia, and release them in the appropriate waterway.

Realisticly speaking though, driftwood helps to soften and bring the pH down to what they like. Other than that, like nick said, stable water conditions are more important than perfect.

Ok so dw will soften the water, what about peat moss? I dont want to get perfect conditions, im just expecting alot out of my self on this project, i wanna get the best possible for the fish( although everyone says that) just looking for any suggestions or IME from anyone

Peat is very easy to use. It keeps the water soft and acid, it is good for the fish and the plants in a tank.

I hang a filter bag full of the fluval granules in the water change bucket so the water going in is already peat filtered. I use an airstone to keep the water moving. I also use a filter bag half full of peat in the Aqua-clear 50 filter that filters my 25g tank as well as the mini on the 10g. I do pre treat the water with pH adjust down before it goes into the tank to reduce the pH, I have high pH hard water coming out of the tap. It takes a lot of peat to bring down the pH but using peat helps to keep it from spiking in the tank on it's own. Keep an eye on the colour of the water, peat does colour the water slightly but it doesn't bother the fish at all. Purigen will remove the colour without removing the humic acid. I'm not sure about carbon though. It removed the iron for the plants so I stopped using it.

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Thnx for the reply, so if i just put peat moss into a bag? i shouldnt occur any problems other than slightly stained water? Where would one purchase these "bags" from? would panty hose work for that?

I've had bolivians for a long time without adding peatmoss, alothough I do use co2 which lowers one's ph. My ph out of the tap is 7.0 and in the tank around 6.4. I also have eco complete and alot of driftwood in the tank. Bolivians are pretty hardy fish not like german/blue rams. Peat moss is fine, but it's just another thing to maintain that probably isn't necessary for bolivians.

Mine recently spawned as well and show very nice color so I guess they like the water.

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Most fish supply stores aka pet stores selling fish have replacement filter bags and that's what I use. Panty hose may work but they should be rinsed really well, maybe doubled up to prevent peat from getting out. Don't overstretch them. Do not try any kind of coton bags like reusable tea bags. They disintegrate in the water! What a mess.
I use the peat granules over the loose stuff because there is less mess and fuss with it. Also the finer the bag the less loose peat can get into the water column, although this isn't really a problem as it either settles in the gravel or is sucked up into the filter.

Tetratech, it must be nice to have the water come out of the tap at 7.0, mine is 7.8 and sometimes 8.0 when it comes out. It requires way too much buffering to get it settled, I tried but it just seemed the peat does a much better job. I have no problems with pH drops but the occasional pH spike really freaks me out. And I had a lot of those in the beginning. Since the fish I keep come from naturally peat filtered waters, that is what I try to give them. No-matter that they were kept differently at the fish store, they weren't there for very long anyway.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

I will be using eco-complete as well as substrate, planning a heavily planted tank with co2 as a possibility, in the meantime i will try the peat moss until i add the c02. If i want to breed should i keep it a species only tank? Im thinking something for cleanup maybe a pleco or some cories, but i dont want the eggs to get disturbed if there are any eggs, any suggestions?

Well if there are tetras, etc in there the fry will probably get eaten. I spotted at least 100 fry in my tank and after a week or so I don't see any. I did witness the cardinals and pencilfish eating them in spite of all the plants in my tank.

lumykrib good point about the ph out of the tap so the peat would get it down further, but with driftwood and co2 the ph could come down to 7.1, 7.2 even after coming out of the tap at 7.8, 7.9.


Last edited by tetratech at 06-Jan-2006 16:59

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