FishProfiles.com Message Forums

Will Oscars fit suitably to a 55 gallon? Can i put tiger barbs in with them? And Will Anubias survive in here?

><> ~=!Vote Today!=~ <><
-----> View My Dragons <-----

while oscars may be kept in a 55 when young, a single adult oscar will need at least a 75, preferably a 120, of course bigger is always better.
oscars are notorious diggers, and anubias would not live due to being constantly dug up. tiger barbs could go in with oscars, but would probably be eaten as the Oscar grows.

if you want a suggestion for a more suitable fish for a 55, try a Jack Dempsey, they're beautiful, smallish, have great personality, and you could keep a pair in a 55, assuming you could find a pair. another thing about JD's, there is an aquarium bred strain available, the "electric blue Dempsey" which is in my opinion no improvement on the wild variety the only real diff. is that electric blues color up young. you could also try convicts, they're not as pretty, but very interesting breeding behavior.

I don't mean to disuade you from keeping oscars, they're wonderful fish with loads of personality, they just need very large quarters to live happily, and they grow very quickly!

proud father of a bunch of baby haps. http://picasaweb.google.com/Sktchy/BABIES

I concur with the above. Oscars are large, intelligent fishes that NEED a carefully planned and furnished 125 gallon as a baseline setup for long term maintenance. A fully grown Oscar will reach 14 inches, and at that size places heavy demands upon territory.

For a 55, I would choose something else, depending upon whether you want a fairly large but relatively mellow Cichlid (e.g., Jade Eye) or something smaller but feisty (in which case the demon Neetroplus nematopus will NEVER be boring, but you'll be stuck with the 55 as a species tank for a breeding pair because they'll ruthlessly exterminate all comers).

Given that a male Dempsey can reach 8 inches with ease, and may top out at 10 if it has space, and that Dempseys are well known for not taking prisoners if they decide that warfare is required, I'd hesitate to put them in a 55 unless you're going to dedicate the 55 as a species aquarium for a single breeding pair. If you choose that route, then be warned, when they breed, they are utterly fearless in defence of their eggs and fry, as you will find out when you put your hand in the tank to perform maintenance!


Panda Catfish fan and keeper/breeder since Christmas 2002

Really? The cichlids do bite you? Hmmm... Can I have advice on which cichlids to get? Lets see.....I want to have a south american cichlid that isnt too violent, or if possible, not at all, and has a nice personality that wont hide or bite. I also want to have a cichlid that wont dig up plants(if possible), and wont grow too large(4-8".
Can anyone post a suitable cichlid for me and my 55 gallon tank?

><> ~=!Vote Today!=~ <><
-----> View My Dragons <-----

PS- WIll blue Acaras be successful in here? I read that theyre not too agressive if kept in small numbers. If not, then maybe i want something else. I need to have a cichlid who looks the same, but behaives better!I need help!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

><> ~=!Vote Today!=~ <><
-----> View My Dragons <-----

Hahaha! I have a few new experiences with blue acaras.

They are more aggressive than a lot of people might think, mine are breeding at the moment and speaking of bites, I just got bitten today while doing a spot of gravel cleaning (unfortunately a new necessity since they tried to kill just about every scavenger species I had in the tank), and a 3 and a half inch fish just managed to break my skin, and it felt like I got nicked with a razorblade. It was funny watching the little swine attacking the gravel cleaner though. They are seriously brave little guys.If you have a pair and were thinking that youll get to enjoy some time while they arent breeding, forget it. They can breed every 2 weeks depending on if the fry made it or not or if they ate the eggs.I have over 200 fry and about another 600 eggs due to hatch in 24 hours. In fact my life is now a hell of constant fry feeding , incessant water changes, and segregating and tending to beaten up fish. The only reason I dont have more eggs is that the last two acaras that arent paired up dont like each other much, and ill have to seperate them if the fighting gets any worse.

I spent £4 on 8 baby acaras that were probably gonna die like the rest in the shop do seem to be doing, and now im in fishkeeping hell! So much for charitable thoughts... lol

If you want an acara that is really sweet natured try sheepshead acaras (Laetacara curviceps) , they may not be the most beautiful,a lot of the available ones are a base brown colour, but there are prettier specimens in blue and green hues if you shop around. They are pretty calm and they have an intelligent and interactional personality, I loved keeping them. They will be aggressive at breeding time, pretty much like all cichlids, but they are the only really genuinely laid back smallish acara I can think of that would do well in a community 55. A pair would fit right in. Only downsides I can think of about them is that they do need good water quality, and a good varied diet, and they do seem to have a particular weakness as regards dying from columnaris infections.Aside from that, they are a great fish, and not too large. ps the size in the profiles is way off, I think they meant 4 inches, not 4 cm! My pair were at least 3 and a half inches long at maturity.

The measurements given for blue acaras really dont help you picture how bulky they eventually get, and as I said in a recent post I watched an adult female beat the hell out of a male severum and an uaru at the same time! Dont underestimate them!

Green terrors look much the same as blue acaras, but they can be trouble too.

thanks LHG, i will try to get the sheeps head acara and will get a pair ONLY. Will they accept tigerbarbs as tankmates? And will they rip up plants? pls help me.

><> ~=!Vote Today!=~ <><
-----> View My Dragons <-----

I think the tigerbarbs will learn to get out of the way of an acara pretty quickly. Fin nipping wont be tolerated, but in a 55 a tigerbarb will be able to keep its distance should a sheepshead lose its temper. Oddly enough I did keep my sheepsheads with tiger barbs, and while you couldnt say that they "got on", there were no major injuries and no fatalities, and only a few chases if one of the barbs got a bit cheeky the result being the odd loss of a scale, nothing serious.Thats pretty much as lenient as cichlids in this group get.

Just about all south american cichlids rip up plants, but usually only from a few areas in the tank they will like to keep clear for courting and breeding, they wont systematically destroy every plant.

You might have to accept that there will be a few locations the acaras will not allow you to put plants in, but thats fine, just plant them everywhere else! In fact most of my plant locations are "fish defined" but the effect is pretty natural, and sometimes even beautiful, so i'm not complaining. Its my cunning excuse for not having aquaria as beautifully arranged as ingo's lol .

I have one amazon swordplant that is prime breeding territory, and as such it actually benefits from being kept spotlessly clean by the acaras, who presumably in an effort to keep fungus away from the eggs, literally clean every speck of food or algae from the leaves.Usually youll find the acaras will just choose one end of your 55 and stay there apart from feeding times.

Thanks again LHG, the sheeps head is a definate MUST now for me. Im Addicted to CICHLIDS!OOHH! AHH!

Also will a keyhole acara be good too? How many acaras can i put in a 55? ALso what are good tropical fish for the tank?(besides TB's) Does that mean i shant put in 3" of gravel? Or should I?


><> ~=!Vote Today!=~ <><
-----> View My Dragons <-----

To be honest I wouldnt rush in with a plan to pack the tank with acaras, if your fairly new to cichlids you might want to give yourself time to see how they act about territory, and see how aggressive they can actually be. A lot of cichlids can also be surprisigly dirty fish, they are active and they do eat quite a bit, and many of them have excreta that makes the water a bit misty, so its better to understock. If they do breed they tend to do so in profusion, so its better to beunderstocked when that happens. A new batch of 300 or so fry can have an explosive effect on the bioload of the aquarium, particulary when youre having to drench the tank in liquifry every few hours.That in mind, if youre gonna have cichlids, dont get cheap on the filtration, the only reason I have been able to cope with the bioload changes of breeding in number is because I exclusively use eheim external filters, all fitted with prefilters (they dont tend to suck up the fry when fitted with the external prefilter ),and I buy them rated higher than I really need. Budget carefully.

Just get the two, and fill a few niche environments with a few tough but friendly scavengers and algae eaters. Pick yourself out a nice plecostomus or similar, maybe a bristlenose or similar, and see how the tank stability goes. You could feasably have a few rams, the acaras will find them inconsequential, and hopefully they will have enough sense to stay out of the acaras way. Like I said, try the pair and then see how it goes.

On the gravel front I like to have fine grain, and 3 inches deep is about right for your average selection of plants. Then you can keep smaller doradids or banjo cats. Theyll be ignored by the acaras and they should help ventilate the gravel and perform some scavenging duties for you. If you use fine grain , not only do the plant roots spread better and allow for better growth, but the burrowing scavengers will be comfortable too. Just a few ideas for you there. What did you have in mind?

I was just thinkin of Anubias, and some java fern. Maybe some moss. Any way, i will only get 2 Acaras at the max. The acaras get only up to 4" max. Bummer, i wanted to have a large fish in my tank. Any way, i will get other fish for them. Thats ok i guess. Any way, the canister filters are expensive, totally expensive. Am i ok going with 2 50 gallon HOB filters instead? Will that be enough? You never anwsered my question about the keyhole variety. Pls reply. 1 more thing, will i need to use large, flat slate rocks to make them breed? How do i sex the male/female? I cant wait for my 55 gallon!

><> ~=!Vote Today!=~ <><
-----> View My Dragons <-----

Just throwing in my .02 a severum is a nice-sized cichlid with a couple color variations available. IME they do eat plants though.

~~~~~~~~~~~~
There is water at the bottom of the ocean

Speaking of fish biting humans, I was playing with a ten inch GAR at the LFS, dipping my finger in the tank water and watching him chase it...All of a sudden he decided to give it a snap instead of chasing...and ooouch!.. my right index finger still hurts!

Sorry for going off topic...but i couldn't resist

The canister filters are expensive, Totally expensive!

I'd like to say that the filters arent too bad, and ive convinced my mom to get me one. Ill just use that and a gravel vac. Where do you get the fittings that dont suck up the fry? I'll need them. Also, can i mix Sheepshead Acara with the Blue Acara? I want the blue because of its color and size. I really dont mind if theyre agressive, but i want the sheeps head too because of its somewhat docile personality. If i can find them, ill get them! What bottom feeder/scavenger should i get? Maybe a rubberlip pleco? Or a BN? I wanted to have a large fish, not a giant one. THe jack dempsy is way too large, and the sverums are nice, but have barely any color. I also dont want to have too large of a bioload. I plan to put in a tiger barb and maybe somt otos too. Or a Flying Fox, or some cories? What do you guys think?

><> ~=!Vote Today!=~ <><
-----> View My Dragons <-----

I think a blue acara would probably slaughter a sheepshead, and I can definately confirm that they attack siamese flying foxes, presumably because they are defensive at breeding time, and a siamese flying fox would quite willingly eat the eggs, and they sense this.The acars will remove predaotory threats to the eggs well in advance of breeding, and that means the foxes could be attacked and killed at any time.

You include cories at your own risk, since although they may not get attacked, they have no defence if they do, and would be slaughtered.

I have ottos in with them now, and oddly enough they are not touched, but presumably this is because my ottos keep a low profile. Im considering removing them before the acaras get much bigger though, quite simply because one day they will simply be a mouth sized morsel. I know an otto is designed to jam in the throat of most fish, and that predators consider them difficult to swallow, but I think an acara has the bite power to bite them to pieces.


A smallish species of reclusive plecostomus like a clown or a BN might be a better choice. Tiger barbs will be maimed by blue acara.

Im not sure youre quite understanding this yet, I recommended sheepsheads instead of blue acaras because of the problems the blues can bring. If you want blues, your choice of fish is strictly limited to things they wont eat, wont attack, and arent stimulated to kill, or at the very least can fight them off.

All the other stocking ideas you mention havent quite grasped that. You need to change your stocking lists to include things that might not be killed! You might get away with a severum though, but even then its dicey.

Blue Acaras are midsized fish for midsize communities. If you keep trying to include fish from smaller non-cichlid communities , youll get deaths.

Try balancing it like this. If you want the blue acara, your "working "fish will have to be tough. Plecs , (preferably as spiny and hairy as you can find them )for the algae eating. Scavengers will need to be reclusive and tough, preferably armoured, maybe something like a talking catfish of 8 inches or so, they are perfect because generally they only come out at night when the acaras are sleeping, and during the day will wedge themselbes into bogwood and go largely unnoticed.You will need to provide them with plently of cover in this situation though.

For the other display fish larger characins will do ok, silver dollars and red hooks if already grown will be able to defend themselves. Ive seen blues kept with tinfoil barbs although a 55 wont really be big enough for them.

For species capable of defending themselves , although fights will break out, you want fish like green terrors, and other comparable species that have similar body types and temperaments. Large but passive predators may also get past the net. I have a polypterus , that while peaceful and not quite big enough to eat the acaras is obviously considered too big to be tangled with. Obviously it will outmatch an acara in a fight, and they instinctively know this and let it do its own thing undisturbed. Certain predatory catfish could work just as well, but again check into any species thoroughly before adding it to the tank.

Its a logic puzzle of defensive capability and predation, and any weak fish will be killed. Think of it from that standpoint , and work it out from there. If a fish doesnt have its own deterrent for violence built in, it doesnt go in.

Thank again LHG, i wanted the blues because they grow to my most favorable size, and because of their agressiveness. I know the sheeps head will be eradicated, but i just want a nice sized fish. Severums are way too big, and sheeps head are too small. Is there any other cichlids the same size as the Blue (I really dont want to change). Anyway, the blues have a nice color, and i guess i dont mind them nipping at me. Thanks!

><> ~=!Vote Today!=~ <><
-----> View My Dragons <-----

Severums are way too big

Not sure what you mean, too big for a 55g or to keep with a blue acara?

At one point I kept a sev, GT, blue acara and loaches together in my 75g. Problems only started when the GT & acara decided to spawn

~~~~~~~~~~~~
There is water at the bottom of the ocean

Theresa, The severums are way too big for the tank, and probably might be stunted I sure dont want to repeat what happened to the plecos BTW, what is the bioload measured in? I want to fit in as many compatible(Thanks to LHG ) fish i can. My mom is only going to let me get it if it is worth it(meaning it looks good, and water is clear.)

><> ~=!Vote Today!=~ <><
-----> View My Dragons <-----

Bioload is a complicated and inclusive equation based on a number of factors. This includes available oxygen, ammonia production from respiration and decomposition vs the aerobic bacterial efficiency of the filter in neutralising ammonia and nitrite, and finally the overall nitrate production versus the acceptable level of water changes without destabilising the chemical stability of the tank.

Calculating it is no easy matter, since variables in tank equipment, fish age , species,and metabolism, foods used, water conditioners and stabilisers used, water displaced via decorations, plants, lighting, and the cleaning regime all affect the average outcome and bioload estimate of any given tank.

This is not really a solid applicable mathematical calculation,although technically you could work it out if you were something of a biologist, physicist and a mathematician, but that is neither easy or practical for the average person. We use a rough equivalent of it, something calculated intuitively by experienced fishkeepers.

For beginners its actually far easier to give the tank dimensions and equipment details, and a list of your preffered stocking. Then the experienced keepers among us can help you come to a realistic decision based on our experiences, having done a lot of the mental calculations for you instinctively, based on our collective knowledge. Its an intuitive method, but usually still pretty accurate. Its one of the benefits of long term experience that you can eventually do such calculations instinctively without having to resort to a few days in a darkened room with a bunch of test kits, several volumes on caparative fish biology, and a scientific calculator.

We will usually throw in our knowledge of fish habits and territoriality for nothing! It helps give you a more complete estimate of how a theoretical setup will perform.

All part of the service .