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Hi All,

Well, I'm back. The Koi have been taken on my the LFS and are now on their way to a new home. I managed to get £25 out of the LFS, not much for the fish I agree but it paid for a new heater....

I decided that a community tank was what I wanted, quite a few different fish that can all live together. I did however make one mistake, when I bought the fish I forgot to write down what they where I was in too much of a hurry to get them home I think... However a trip back to the LFS and what I think I have is

3 x Cynotilapia Afra
2 x Pseudotropheus Saulosi
And I decided to keep my Common Pleco for the time being, if he starts to get too large for the tank then I will trade him in.

http://www.ratemydealer.net/images/fish.jpg

The question is what to get next ?? The tank seems a bit empty now, I would like to get some more Afra's.

Is there anything I should keep an eye out for? I had the water tested and all params where normal. The water round here is hard which apparently should suit a Malawi community.

The LFS said that goldfish flake food will ok for them, but I forgot to ask how many times a day they should be fed, the tin says 2-3 ??

Thanks again,

Jon.

Wow, you brought home cichlids!

These are not typical community fish, however, it looks like you're on your way to setting up an African (Malawi?) Cichlid community of sorts. One thing to keep in mind is that these fish can be territorial and aggressive, especially if you have established pairs that start breeding.
More rockwork with caves and hollows will help provide territories for them. You'll probably only want to add two or three more fish of this type, max.
Take a look in the Profies section under Cichlids and you'll find more information on these fish and similar species.

Hoping that there must be a word for everything I mean...

Hi there,

Your tank is about 30 uk gallons I think, so,
Lets see what we got here,
Afras - 3.9 inches, that seems alright to me.
They are very territorial. Not sure how many
you can keep together. Heres the link to the profile
on them:
http://www.fishprofiles.com/files/profiles/542.htm

Salousi, 3.5 inches, territorial and aggressive.

http://www.fishprofiles.com/files/profiles/179.htm


I dont know much about how much space these fish need
personally, I am sure a malawi cichlid specialist will come around.
However, based on the size and territoriality of these
fish, you would want to limit how many you have.
Im pretty sure most people would say a 55g or larger is
best for these fish, so I would stick with the 5 you have for now until someone who knows more can come along and comment.
It would probably be very helpful for you to
post the tank dimensions again, and maybe someone can
double check size for you. By my measurements before it was about 30 UK gallons, but Im not fully sure because
it is a hex.
I thought we had a hex measurement calculator on this site
but i cant find it.


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The tank dimensions are approx:
Width (point to point): 65cm (25in)
Width (flat to flat): 55cm (22in)
Height: 39cm (15 1/2in)

I had read both on this site and another that these fish can be quite aggressive, however I have not yet witnessed any more than quick chase round the tank since they where released from their transport bags. In the bags one of the the two Saulosi was quite aggressive to the other.

On the subject of caves etc. would bits of slate and other rock arranged to create a cave type environment be suitable ? They do appear to like the hidyholes that are there already. One of the Afra's has taken possession of boat you can see in the picture, and has done a great job of clearing it out... (time for a gravel vac)

Ideally I would like to add another 2-3 fish that are fairly active swimmers during the day..

I've been watching your thread since you first posted cause I knew it would prove interesting. By the way................welcome to FP!

I can't believe someone else hasn't been back on to talk to you. Maybe this post will bring it back to the latest posts section & someone will see it & tell you what you want to know, cause I'm not too experienced in cichlids.

But I do know that what you bought are probably juvenile fish. Will till they get older & used to their territories.......... & you will see their famed aggression.

"On the subject of caves etc. would bits of slate and other rock arranged to create a cave type environment be suitable ?"
I think that's a good idea as long as it's all very stable. Some cichlids dig themselves little holes in their caves, so be sure they can't bring the whole thing down upon themselves.

I would not add anymore fish till someone on here advises what you could have & what you could not have. You have already set yourself up for a bit of a rough ride getting cichlids. (for a beginner anyway) You were already disappointed with having to get rid of the other fish............. it would be too bad if you had to go through that again.

But your in for an interesting fish keeping experience, to say the least!
Whatever happens.......... I wish you luck & lots of fun..........once you get past the rough spots!

Hi fish patty, thanks for the welcome

I'm starting to see some more of the standard behaviour from the fish now, I guess they are getting more used to their environment. One of the Afra's has claimed the boat as his home, the darker Saulosi has taken to trying to dig him out it's not going to work because the boat has a solid bottom and I can replace the gravel far quicker than he can move it. But it's making me laugh all the same.....

One bit of behaviour I am trying to work out is between the two Saulosi. The darker one (I assume the male) swims up to the orange one, rotates himself horizontally, extends his dorsal fin and appears to shiver slightly. I'm guessing this is either a bugger off type event (however it never gets followed up by anything) or possibly courtship behaviour...

I'm going to look into the cave building quite soon as I think the fish would like some more places to hide (without bugging my Pleco all the time )

You have already set yourself up for a bit of a rough ride getting cichlids

I never liked the quiet life

But your in for an interesting fish keeping experience, to say the least!
Whatever happens.......... I wish you luck & lots of fun..........once you get past the rough spots!

I hope it's going to be interesting, I just hope the fun of learning how to care for them will also result in many hours of watching them do what they do best....

Hi there,
I asked a cichlid master friend of mine about
your fish and tank, and here is what she said,
per verbatim,

"Well, unfortunately, if the tank is only about 35-50 US gal, it would be okay to add more fish, but the fact that its a hex tank means mbuna really aren't a good option for that tank. They really need a minimum of a 3' length, which is the most important measurement when it comes to mbuna. They really need the length to coexist happily and without killing each other, as it leaves more room for territories. A single male may easily take over a hex tank because of its shape - anywhere a fish might be able to go in that tank, is still too close to the given territory of the dominant male.

He might be able to get away with a small (5, absolute max) colony of just the afras or just the saulosi. Personally, I'd recommend the saulosi over the afras. They're not as aggressive typically as the afras, which obviously would be better for that tank setup. Also, saulosi obviously are much more colourful than the afras, which usually is at least part of what people look at when stocking mbuna. Whichever species he decides on, he should have 1 male and 3 or 4 females, that's it. That being said, his plan to have a pair of saulosi won't work. Mbuna aren't a pairing fish, they need a few females for every male. Otherwise, the male is likely to harrass the females to death. In terms of the saulosi, males turn blue and females stay yellow. If they're juveniles and both are still yellow, typically only males have eggspots, saulosi females don't. Again though, he really shouldn't keep a pair.

Lastly, feeding goldfish food for a while certainly won't kill them, but he should definitely find a more appropriate food asap. Especially for the saulosi, which are herbivores, something with more veggie matter is best."

So, hopefully that gives you more info.
This friend of mine keeps hundreds of african cichlids
amongsts dozens of tanks.
Mbuna/Malawi are her specialty.
Hope this helps!


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Hi Sneaky,

Once again thanks for your time and thanks to your friend for her time and advice, very usefull

I am going to try and keep the fish, I have not yet seen much aggression in the tank with the exception of the male Saulosi who has been marking his dominance on the territory. As mentioned in my previous post I am going to look into building a cave system of sorts to hopefully give the fish some hidyholes. This would also serve to increase the surface area of the tank hopefully giving enough space for the male to establish his territory...

I am going to hold off adding any new fish for the time being and see how these guys settle down when I have finished reshaping the tank bottom. When I do look at adding new fish I think female Saulosi appear to be the fish of choice from the advice.

I will look into the feed options when I next visit the LFS, thanks to your friend for the advice on food.

So, hopefully that gives you more info.
This friend of mine keeps hundreds of african cichlids amongsts dozens of tanks.

That, along with all other advice, is a fantastic amount of info thank you.... I would be interested in seeing a couple of photos of your friends tanks to see if I can learn anything from her setups.

ciantrius- If you go to "search" at the top of the page & type in Mbuna, there are some pictures of those kinds of tanks from members here. They are listed under photo booth. Also type in Malawi & you will see some pictures of those tanks. Have fun!