FishProfiles.com Message Forums

That about sums it up. Once I have no fish with white spots in my tank, how long should I be treating with the Malachite Green/Formaline so I can be sure that the Ich is gone?

I have seen two thought on this since I have joined FP Yes and No.

Yes it can be totally removed after medications extended treatment and the tank is heated up for at least 1-2 months after you has seen the last WS. Making sure it is not imported at the water changes.

No it still exists in the substrate.

If no is the case why have not had any more since I first set up the Betta tank. Also I had it once about 15 years ago in the big tank, and never again.

Prevention is the best way to control it that is one of the reasons I store all my water for at least one week. If it is there it has no host to live off and just dies.
Well that is my theory and it works for me.

Have a look in [link=My Profile] http://www.fishprofiles.com/forums/member.aspx?id=1935[/link] for my tank info

Look here for my
Betta 11Gal Desktop & Placidity 5ft Community Tank Photos

Keith

Near enough is not good enough, therefore good enough is not near enough, and only your best will do.
I VOTE DO YOU if not WHY NOT?
VOTE NOW VOTE NOW

Aside from the obvious theres a few reasons why ich gets about and stays about.

First ich at the first stages of infection is often on the softer tissues inside the gills behind the gill cover, this often leads people into thinking they have either bought a fish free from infection or that the infection is gone when in fact a few ich trophonts are hanging in there.

UV sterilisers in shops may kill enough whitespot so that you cant see it, but the odd trophont or tomite might well be in the gravel in the tank or on the fish. Just cause it doesnt explode into a full infection in their tanks doesnt mean it wont in yours. It only takes one. UV keeps parasites at low level but doesnt really totally kill infections. It reduces the presence of them, but doesnt always exterminate them. After all not everything in a tank goes through the uv chamber does it?

People dont quarantine plants, they can have tomites on them.

People forget to steralise buckets, vacuums and nets, and often forget to clean evaporation trays after or during an outbreak.

Some meds are rubbish. Most meds that state they can kill ich in 3 days are hopelessly optimistic. Most treatments will need to be 6 days absolute minimum to catch the cycle of the parasite since the main parasites on the fish cannot be killed. We can only kill the reproductive stage unless dipping fish in potassium permanganate,and that is hard on the fish, a med like malachite green or methylene blue would have to be used simeultaniously.Theres no guarantee that you have caught the reproductive cycle perfectly as some adults may be partially protected by the skin slime of the fish, and the cysts will be protected if coated in bacterial slime and detritus etc. Its also possible some may be swallowed by the fish and protected in the fishs gut for several days before being expelled again. Ich reproduction may vary from 3 to 10 days depending on temperature, and day/night drops will mean different speeds of reproduction even in the same tank. Even then ich from different regions may mature at different rates depending on what a particular strain has acclimated to.

Treatment myths , especially temperature and salt myths. The temps required to guaranteed kill ich are higher than youd wish to maintain, it would kill the fish too. In the 80's f there are only some errors in reproduction, but some strains may not be killed reliably by higher temps until you hit the 90's. Salt too may only kill a percentage and not kill them all.

Some fish are more whitespot resistant than others, some that dont look badly affected may carry a few trophonts.

Basically given all this , as keith said , exceed three day treatments, probably by more than double, and maintain higher temps during and after the outbreak for the maximum chance of treating it successfully. Persistance wins the day. Treat it the same day you spot it, soon as possible, and keep on treating it. Don't fall victim to "miracle cure " claims. There are none.

It nearly always takes a week or more. 6 days minimum, unless you happen to be freakishly lucky. Different ich parasites will be on different rythms, 1 ich may be reproducing today, another tomorrow, and another 3 days from now, and a trophont in the water may be developing into an impervious adult, so overestimate treatment periods rather than underestimate them. Keep a nice clean tank during treatment, sometimes pockets of gravel may be air and water tight and holding parasites that can be released later, stir things up, and get them clean when using the meds.

Thanks for the input... I (until we spent the past week travelling) had been doing 3 day treatments followed by 25% WC, then 3 days again, and so on, on two different occasions once for about 6 days, once for about 9. I will continue to do this and also try a different Ich med. The one I have does say it cures Ich in 2 days lol not that I paid that much attention to that claim.

So, long story short, I am back home, down a few fish and back to treating for the Ich. I will be sure and stir my gravel a bit when I am doing the WC. Man, this has been a big time drag! I cannot wait to get this stuff taken care of!!

Update:

I think these guys are improving... one still has spots, but both of them are getting their color back and they were begging for their supper tonite when the last couple nites they didn't really eat much. And it looks like the one with white spots is getting fewer white spots.

Glad to see that things are on the improve just keep going for at least two more weeks yet just to make sure it has all gone.

Have a look in [link=My Profile] http://www.fishprofiles.com/forums/member.aspx?id=1935[/link] for my tank info

Look here for my
Betta 11Gal Desktop & Placidity 5ft Community Tank Photos

Keith

Near enough is not good enough, therefore good enough is not near enough, and only your best will do.
I VOTE DO YOU if not WHY NOT?
VOTE NOW VOTE NOW

I may just keep medicating until I have gone through two bottles of the stuff... lol just kidding, I plan to go probably two weeks after all the white spots are gone.

Well, at long last, the white spots finally disappeared. I noticed this on Saturday... I did a 25% WC on Sunday and will continue with the Ich meds for another couple weeks. I also resumed lighting the tank for 8 hrs a day and have back the temps off a bit.

I'm still seeing Nitrites at 2ppm, have been for approaching 3 weeks now. So, I thought the WC would be a good thing...

I won't restock until the nitrites are 0ppm and I've treated two more weeks for the Ich. Hopefully at that point I will be in good shape, finally, sheesh LOL