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Actually LM, to be totally honest and blunt, the wall/curtain of vals does nothing for me. It's too solid and too much of a straight line.IMO a straight line of any plant just doesn't do anything for an aquascape. The problem with the current look for me is that there is no middle ! You've got a really nice frame, tall at the back , tall at the sides , low at the front. Problem is it's not framing anything ! I think if you put in some things in the middle area that's a hight between the low plants and the tall plants would be a big improvement.

Still think the vals need to be reorganised , I think the wall distracts from everything.Another option would be to put some mid height plants (of varying heights) just in front of them, that way it doesn't look like a wall but will give an effect of rising and falling.

The Wallichi is a nice plant but I think it always looks better further back surrounded by green, brings out the color much better.

If you don't like rocks try to get hold of some fossilised wood. It looks and feels like a rock, but has a lot more character and color tones. I love using it, unfortunately mines become over grown so you can only see pieces of it.

For the middle area some mid sized plants would help, a thick stand of Bacopa would look nice and contrast well with the vals (if you keep them) in color and shape. Maybe a nice but slightly different sword would work a Rubin or Marble Queen ? Lobelia would work well in their also. Maybe some of the taller crypts like Balansae ?

I really like the front and lower plants towards the middle, looks beautiful, I just think some plants of intermediate height would make a profund difference to the aquascape.

BTW, If you are running strong light, the Lotus will be more inclined to stay low rather then reach for the surface. Personally I like it more when they stay low like that.

HTH

---

Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

It does grow.

-Molly
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hmm, my depth perception is a bit off, yes, the midground, too busy. And i did spot the stricts, but its a bit short for what iwas thinking...

For animals, the entire universe has been neatly divided into things to (a) mate with, (b) eat, (c) run away from, and (d) rocks. - Terry Pratchett

Well, again (I think everyone's skimming my replies - my fault for making them so long! ) this is a shot of the tank with a fresh trim. Most of the middleground is much higher after some growth time; only the crypts (for a few months, anyway) and the lily stay low; the stem plants all grow a good bit, which does provide said slope.

Last edited by LittleMousling at 04-Nov-2004 15:13

-Molly
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It's a lovely tank, better than any of my planted tanks. However, my only complaint is that ther's such a sudden change from foreground to background-- perhaps some bushier plants in the middleground, or as was mentioned before driftwood, would add a bit of a gentler slope Great tank!

Okay, everyone seemed to like the driftwood so much, and it was so cheap - I just bought some realistic fake driftwood. I'll see, but it could be quite nice - and it won't drop the pH.

-Molly
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Calla - there's only one plant in the foreground, the E. tenellus. At the far left a couple of Anubias are slightly into the foreground but I'm not sure that counts as being a mix. The middleground, however, certainly does have a mix - is that what you mean? It needs a little time to grow in, this shot was right after some pruning and rearranging.

Also, there already is stricta in there, H. corymbosa - it's next to the Alternanthera reinekii, which is the plant you're asking about, Lifenoodles.

Yes, it's a bit too bad about the wood, but I can't have it in there with the fish I'm planning (lowering pH, etc), and in any case this gives me a *lot* more room to work with the plants. I was very limited before with what I could do.

Here's how I see this layout - I'll probably move the swords over to off-center. The middleground will be allowed to grow in quite a bit more and I'll add a couple of other species (someone recommended Ambulia, right?). I'm still looking for an alternate foreground plant but I'm not sure glosso will work - it's a bit too short for a tall tank, IME. Other suggestions greatly appreciated, though! And I may try the Glosso.

-Molly
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i personally liked the rock/wood things, i hope they found a good home somewhere.

the fore is WAY too busy, too many species and all jumbled up.

i would have stayed with the original, taken out the chain swords and replaced it with glosso, and bunched a few more of the foreground plants and removed some species altogether to make it simpler.

you def need some midground and maybe some slightly different background, but in the mid area? bring the background around in a semicircle? stricta at a decent size perhaps? that is, unless you need to view it from the side.

Last edited by Callatya at 04-Nov-2004 00:41

For animals, the entire universe has been neatly divided into things to (a) mate with, (b) eat, (c) run away from, and (d) rocks. - Terry Pratchett

I think a bit of carpeting action with the anubius nana would be cool---or glosso . Clearing out the sagittaria on the mid left (the open area) and moving them to the front of the tank with the others would look really neat, too. I would also fill out the left with some leafy plants like L. repens or stricta. Btw, what is the maroon plant to the left of the lilly? I have something similar to that in my tank, and was just looking for a quick ID.

Last edited by Cup_of_Lifenoodles at 03-Nov-2004 22:37

I admit I have no plans to lose the Vals - I feel with a strong middleground (still lacking but getting there) they won't be a strange vertical background with a fairly flat foreground but a normal continuation of a diaonal line from the bottom front to the top back.
The driftwood's not going back in but I'll see what I can do focal-point-wise. Hmmm.


Foreground plant suggestions?

Last edited by LittleMousling at 03-Nov-2004 12:49

-Molly
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Hi Littlemousling,

I'm afraid I'm with Bensaf on the Vallisneria aspect, although I don't have anything particular against it as a plant, and I think it can look really good in a small group. As a background plant through the entire tank it is just a bit too much for my liking.

With your new setup I like how you have worked with the colors in the front and mid section, but I miss a focus point. In this setup the attention is always draw to the big swords on the right side of the tank. The best location for your focus point in any tank can be calculated easily, using the number Phi: 1.618 (also known as the divine proportion). Take the length of your tank, divide that by 1.618 and you will get the distance from the side of the tank where your focus point will look best. It sounds a bit silly, but it really is true.

I think in your case I would either move the swords to that location, or maybe even take one out completely and use one of the pieces of driftwood as focus point. I would probably also take out a lot of the vallisneria in the back and keep them maybe only in the corners of the tank. Instead I would use some stem plants to build up the back.

Please remember that this is just how I would do it, and if you love the way the vallisneria looks then keep it that way, in the end it is your tank and you must keep it in the way you like it

Hi, that's a lovely tank. I think you should break up the wall of plants at the back (i don't know any names). You could put some tall broad leaved plants (maybe amazon sword) just in front of it in places so you have more than one type of tall plant. Ambulia (i think that's what it is called) grows up tall and looks a bit softer and more floaty, maybe something like that would also help to break up that wall. I'm only a beginner so i'm not much help but good luck!

Here's the new layout, sans driftwood and therefore with a bit more room for middleground plants, which should help keep the vals from making the whole tank look like an L (flat stuff, then tall vals).

Commentary still appreciated, thanks. Oh, and if it looks fishless - it is. There are a fe cories still on the lam in there and two brevis but the community fish went to a store to make way for (what else?) Tanganyikans.



LittleMousling attached this image:


EDIT: PS, please excuse HORRIFIC photograph - am still working out kinks of borrowed camera, left own at the dorms.

Last edited by LittleMousling at 31-Oct-2004 18:57[/font]

-Molly
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My 125 is starting to come together the way I want it to but it still needs some improvement, so I'm looking for suggestions.
Here's the tank now (note - this was after a heavy prune, so assume an extra 2-6" on stem plants in the middleground - that Tropical Sunset hygro in pareticular I clipped quite a bit as it was leggy from being shaded by an overgrowth of the vals - it's normally high enough to match the plants around it, with a bit of a slope to match the driftwood):


My main thoughts so far:
I was a little too vicious clearing out vals in the right-hand corner - that will fill back in, no worries.

Behind the driftwood on the left I'm thinking about replacing the vals with my H. corymbosa (seen in the far right) and R. wallichi (foreground far left). I think these play off each other fairly well - agree, disagree?

The "test plant" section in the front lefthand side, where I plant things to see if they'll do well in the tank or if they'll get going well, is a MESS. Right now the anubias haven't filled it in, so I'm thinking of moving them to other tanks and filing that area with more crypts or a shorter midground plant like baby tears.

The foreground - I'm not a huge fan of the pygmy chain sword. However, my top choices to replace it (hairgrass and glosso) are probably too much like the back and too long for a big tank, respectively. Other options? Or keep the chain swords?

I may turn the righthand piece of driftwood so that I can place the alternanthera closer to it - at the moment there's a crypt shaded by that overhanging arm but it's invisible and not adding anything. Overhanging the lotus would probably help, as I'd like it to stretch for light a bit more and start being a darned middleground plant and not the lowlying thing it is now.

I could move one of the half-hidden swords from the right over to the aforementioned "test plant" area, a little over from where the R. wallichi is now; OTOH it might get more light and leave its perfect-size holding pattern.

Any other suggestions also appreciated! Thanks.[/font]

Last edited by LittleMousling at 24-Oct-2004 11:20

-Molly
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i like found rocks

none of that fish store baloney

i think you should go rock hunting and find a whole bunch of stuff and play around with it.

I am not nearly as much of an expert as you guys so i cant exactly give much advice, i just think its fun to find interesting rocks

C'mon, the stem plants are a mess - look at that one stem of L. peruensis in the middle of the vals on the left! There's no excuse for that. And the lilies are too low to be a good middleground plant, and the area around the anubias is a mess.

I certainly was not ego stroking I was telling you the hard facts and truth, nothing is perfect in nature that is what gives you tank that character.
Yes certainly go ahead and do a regular clean up in fact it would be very stupid not to.
I regually cut of the old leaves and stems off my anubias.
Hunting for bits and pieces is always helpful, picture it in your mind what shape of driftwood or rocks that would improve on the tank. If you find difficulty in doing that print that photo and cut out pieces of paper/card and place it where you think it would go best.

Also if you have a good Aqu supplier take several pieces home and try them out on the condition you can return them for a full refund.

Keith

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I admit my middleground is a little lacking but I'd just have more room to work with it if the driftwood were gone - right now with the physical driftwood, the shade of the driftwood, and the sections of middleground that are cordoned off into the fore or background by the placement of the driftwood, there's very little to work with! Removing it would help be create a real middleground, although I think the stupid too-low lilies have to go. There's a nice (somewhat invisible ATM) crypt lawn growing in to the left of the middle which should grow up within the next few months to be a nice middleground for that area.

-Molly
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Okay Rotala wallichi yeah that one scares me....dunno why but it reminds me of dust balls but then again not my tank right!...

If you do remove the driftwood what I see happening with the tank you have is that you've got the tall background plants then the low foreground plants.....and very little else . The way I'd use driftwood is to take the eye from the lower to upper levels....emm @the very least take them out one @a time maybe

Hmmm I know I had another though on this ....just don't know what happened to it...ah well it'll come back (probably @3am >.< )

^_^
*Proud member of the Committee for Sig Line Restoration*


Last edited by Babelfish at 26-Oct-2004 15:38

The plant on the left is Rotala wallichi - you don't like it? I think it needs a better spot in the tank, definitely, but I wasn't really planning on scrapping it. (Now I sound like one of those people who asks for advice and won't take it, don't I? )

The foreground is a total pigsty, absolutely - ironically, though, the presence of a single main foreground plant (it's E. tenellus, the Pygmy Chain Sword) was meant to dwar the tank together, but that backfired if you think it's an example of not-big-enough plant groups! Any thoughts on a better foreground? That's definitely a question I've been pondering at length and to no good conclusion.
Far right, eh - well, I certainly hate the far left, so it does make more sense to emulate that side.
I may just remove the driftwood altogether rather than replacing it with rocks - driftwood in small doses is just an aquascaping crutch anyway and I'll have more room to work with stems without it.

Thanks!

-Molly
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IMO rocks dont' "work" so well in planted tanks, but I do kinda think that the wood should be changed....were those just any old pieces or did you pick them out for their shape (can't tell from the pic but they look like "just wood"

Since I can't magically pull rock names from my ear, I'd say look for a striking piece of wood that could act as a focal point. Something that will bring movement to the tank. The wood also helps by giving hight to the scape, I don't think rocks would do the same in your tank...again because it's planted.

As for the plants....*not so good with names* is that a red bunch of fuzzy plant in the front left....that looks a bit spooky. And I know there's no "order" in nature, but to me a tank looks better if it's not all spread around, which is the impression I get from your tank (most likely since the pic is small, I know this is a big tank)...What I'd do is try to group similar plants together more, again I'm not good with names, but the short spiky ones in the front are what bug me the most I think....seems almost like they're weeds just filling in the gaps. I think if you restrained them to the central part of the tank not to go past the red (is it a lilly ) that's next to the crypts it might work for me.
I think my favorite part of the tank is the far right, near the red temple.

anyway, it's a lovely tank and all as it is so feel free to throw just about all my comments out....I stand firmly by the idea that rock just wouldnt' work the way wood does in that tank. *shrug*

^_^
*Proud member of the Committee for Sig Line Restoration*