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Hi,

I've decided to try my luck at my very first all planted tank. I've already bought a 10 gallon tank, black gravel, black background, and a nice piece of drift wood. I've rinsed out the tank and gravel and set it up, with the background. I've also tried a few different positions for my driftwood and have taken pictures for each position which will be included at the bottom of this post.

I've done some research on planting tanks (Little Fish's 56 page 125 gallon tank log ) and have come up with an idea of what type of plants I want. Basically, the 10 gallon hoods they have at my LFS have around 10 watt bulbs, so the wpg will be around 2, which means really low light level plants. Also, these plants have to be relatively hardy because this is my first tank and I wont be giving CO2 injections. So, here's my list of plants:

Java moss (on driftwood)
Dwarf Anubias
Giant Anubias
Dwarf Sagittaria
Dwarf Ambulia
Anacharis
Amazon Swords (I have 2 already)
Red Ozelot Sword

I'm also looking for some sort of plants that carpet the gravel like glosso, but I havent found one that is suitable for such low light levels. Maybe someone can suggest one?

As for fish, I've been thinking about having a small school of Neon Tetras (6 or 7), 1 Dwarf Gourami, and a few Ottos.

Also, I just bought an Aquaclear 20 (formerly Mini) and I am looking to purchase a submersible heater (preferably black) sometime soon.

At this moment, my driftwood is soaking in a bucket and I'm planning to call my LFS on availability of plants. Also, I will likely be getting a hood tomorrow.

Input on the tank layout and plants would be appreciated. I will try to attach the 4 different positions of the driftwood below.

#1
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a157/kent_19_92/tankpictures1001.jpg

#2
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a157/kent_19_92/tankpictures1002.jpg

#3
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a157/kent_19_92/tankpictures1003.jpg

#4
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a157/kent_19_92/tankpictures1004.jpg

P.S. How can I directly attach an image?

Hi congrats on taking the plunge!
Last question, you need to have a premium membership to post pictures directly, there's a sticky about how to get one.

Next, I like the driftwood in the first and third set-up, first being my preference, I like how it has a lot of texture and can see tucking plants ina and around it myself.

Next, I have a 10 gallon as well and your plant selections are not too bad, they should work for the most part except
you want to stick with mainly small leaved plants, no giant ones, they make the tank look small, smaller plants make the tank look bigger, anacharis may be sensitive to Excel (CO2 substitute), but if you go with CO2 it should be fine, not sure though. Swords get big, mine is out-growing it's tanks, I have one in each of my tanks, 10g and 25g. With CO2 this would happen rather quickly. Have you considered java fern as well, it comes in a few varieties so you can mix it up a bit, vary leaf textures and sizes. Glosso no go from what I saw in Little_Fish's smaller tank with much better light, HC may be an option though.

Finally wattage is gallons/bulb watts, 10 gallons/10 watts is 1 wpg, look for a hood with more light, you may need to go with a different hood than the one you're looking at. LF may be able to point you in the right direction better than I can, he recently pointed me to a better bulb than what I was trying to find.

The fish sound good, I have a betta, 5 harlequin rasboras, 2 otos and 2 panda cories in my tank, I had 4 pandas but have recently lost 2, you're stocking sounds like it should be better, it is not overstocked and shouldn't cause problems, the gourami's get bigger than bettas though, so look for the smallest you can.


"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

Hi,
On the subject of lighting...
Most of the small tanks, 10G and less, come with an
incandescent light bulb. They are no good for plants.
If that is what you have, I would toss it and purchase
a screw-in fluorescent replacement bulb. Be sure the
replacement bulb says DAYLIGHT or SUNLIGHT on it and not
Warm(something). That bulb will give you plenty of light
in the right part of the spectrum to enjoy looking at the
fish, and at the new plants.

Frank

This is a sample of the style bulb I'm writing about:
http://www.homedepot.com/prel80/HDUS/EN_US/diy_main/pg_diy.jsp?CNTTYPE=PROD_meta&CNTKEY=storehome/pg_storehome.jsp&cm_ven=1hd.com2AOL&cm_cat=search&cm_pla=keywd&cm_ite=tbd


-->>> The Confidence of Amateurs, is the Envy of Professionals <<<--

Hey,

Nice wood, I like #1 and #4 most. Premium members are the ones who can imbed pictures in their posts. Its a small fee which I havent paid yet but probably will soon. I wasnt sure if would keep using this forum but everyone is great.

Im just getting my first really planted tank going (a 12 gallon) and I would say that its probably a good idea to begin easy to find plants and not stress over them for a while. (I made some mistakes while trying to find the perfect plants and might have been better off with standard stuff to start untill I know what I am doing) For the list you have just make sure you know the final sizes the swords and giant anubias may make your tank look small after very little time. Cant help on the carpeting plant other than by emphasizing the florescent lights frank did. You get much more light per watt so you can stil do 10 watts of power but the equivalent of 20watts of light. The bulbs might have a conversion written on them. The lights will also really look better.

Good luck and welcome


Chaos

__________________________________
- - - Humorous Bit of Wisdom - - -

My advice...no swords. At all. They get entirely too big for a 10g. If you put swords (amazon, ozelot) they will make your tank look like a 1g.

In smaller tanks, it is better to go with small leaved plants, because it makes the tank look bigger, which is what most people want.

Using dwarf sag for the foreground is a good idea. I have that in my 10g and it grows great. I have 2wpg though...so can grow a little more than the low light plants.

Anubias Nana (petite version) would be great. I haven't found that yet, so I don't have any in my 10g.
Crypts are good. I have 2 crypt wendtii reds in my 10g and they are pretty small now. They can get pretty tall though. I had a major water parameter problem recently and both crypts melted, but they came back .
The crypt wendtiis in my 55g have about 7 inch long leaves. There are a couple types that stay smaller though.
I have wisteria in my 10g, but it grows extremely fast and will soon take over the tank.

A 10 watt hood will only give you 1 wpg, by the way. And that is low light. If you can get a hood with 20w, then you would have 2 wpg and can grow medium light plants.

I also have rotala rotundifolia (indica) and it grows great under 2wpg...the top half of the stems are pinkish.

I suggest getting some type of moss and attaching it to your DW. That would look good.

Plant suggestions:
Dwarf Sag
Crypts
Anubias Nana Petite
Rotala rotundifolia (if you can get 2wpg)
Wisteria (does better under 2wpg)

I'm sure there are more. I would just avoid swords and most stem plants. Most grow too fast and would need trimming way too often in a 10g. Good luck!

*Kristin*

Your driftwood is great

However the swords can grow very large and overtake the tank. Your other choices look like they will work great. Anubias can also be grown on the driftwood.

I'll do graffiti,
If you sing to me in French.

As others have said, no swords. Too big for 10g. Same thing with the "giant" anubias (barteri). With low light, I would also look at java fern, especially the narrow leaf and windelov/crested variety. Smaller crypts will do fine as well.

-P

First of all, thanks for all the replies.

After visiting my local aquarium club, I replaced my Aquaclear Mini with a Biowheel mini and picked up a heater. I've set up the hardware in my tank and have taken a few pictures that are posted at the bottom. Also, I started soaking my driftwood 2 days ago, but the water is still brown so I'll continue waiting. Is there anything else I should do to sanitize the DW, keeping in mind that I got it from the pet store and not from a lake?

So, today I will be visiting my LFS to check on the availability of plants and perhaps buying a hood (I checked and the wattage of the fluorescent bulb is 15. I asked about upgrading the bulb and they told me that there is no bulb higher than 15 W).

One last question, do you think if I got some moss today, would I be able to attach the moss to the driftwood with elastic bands until it attaches itself? Also, could I put it in the bucket with the DW, keeping in mind there is no heating or sufficient light? Or should I wait to buy the moss when I have my whole tank set up?

Pics:
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a157/kent_19_92/IMG_0160.jpg
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a157/kent_19_92/IMG_0158.jpg
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a157/kent_19_92/IMG_0159.jpg

P.S. What plant do you think can go in the corner and cover up my hardware?

do you think if I got some moss today, would I be able to attach the moss to the driftwood with elastic bands until it attaches itself

You could tie some thread or fishing line (nylon string) around the moss to attach it. The fishing line wouldn't show, since its clear, and the thread would eventually break off, giving the moss time to attach. Whatever works for you.

Your DW looks a little like Malaysian DW. I would check the pH of your tap water and then check the pH in the bucket after a few days because I had some in my 10g and the pH dropped from about 7.2 to 6.6. (pretty drastic if you ask me). I didn't lose any fish...but with that significant of a drop, I don't see how I didn't. Just check it to make sure.

If you are doing the smart thing and adding the wood before the fish (something I didn't do), then I wouldn't worry about the pH difference, unless you take the wood out at some point.

If you can find a hood that has two smaller bulbs, you can replace them with Compact Fluorescent ones. That is what I did. I bought 2 10w CF bulbs at Walmart and put them in my hood.
If you can't find one, then you could buy a plain glass top and then buy a compact fluorescent fixture.

*Kristin*

Well, yesterday I visited my LFS and picked up some Kent Freshwater Pro Plant which I plan to use to fertilize my plants (once I get them). Yes, the DW is Malaysian and I will be putting it in before the fish. One problem is that the LFS doesnt sell java moss in clumps, but on rocks for $25. Unless I can find java moss at another store (which is unlikely), I will probably have to attach a Anubias Nana to the DW instead. This store also sells 10 gallon incandescent fixtures with double bulb outlets, so I'll probably try the compact fluorescent idea .

Today I'm going to visit another LFS and check out the plants there. I will probably fill up the tank today and begin planting sometime next week.

Sorry Kent it took me so long to find your thread

But given that you mentioned my Log I owe you an entry (or two or three ).

I will probably fill up the tank today and begin planting sometime next week.

I would suggest you do not set up the tank until all is in place. I think this would get you a better start as an empty tank with wood wouldn't do much.

About Moss - have you considered ordering it online? There should be quite a few sites that offer Java Moss (haven't checked though).

Ingo

---

Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Hey,

If there are other LFSs around you should look there for the moss. When I have seen it its usually a little ball of it for a dollar or two which you can rubberband to your wood.

Chaos

__________________________________
- - - Humorous Bit of Wisdom - - -

Well, I've decided to get an incandescent fixture, which has 2 light outlets. The problem is I can't use regular compact fluorescent bulbs because the light is too yellow. This means I have to buy the aquarium compact fluorescent bulbs which are sold for $15 each and give a light output of 15 watts. Since I have 2 light outlets, I need 2 bulbs which is 30 watts (3wpg)! Would my initial plant selection still function under very strong lighting conditions?

Hi,
If you have "yellow" light comming from the screw in
compact flourscent bulbs, then you have the wrong ones.
The DAYLIGHT or SUNLIGHT bulbs will give off a white light.
The warm white or reading bulbs are yellow appearing.
Frank


-->>> The Confidence of Amateurs, is the Envy of Professionals <<<--

Kent,

Would my initial plant selection still function under very strong lighting conditions?

Well, as already stated - your real intital plant selection wouldn't work anyway (plants too large). But, after correcting this, I wouldn't know why they would not work. Granted, this is way more light, but it is not what you think it would be. Smaller tanks, like your 10G, need way way more light to be considered high light. The 3wpg are a lot in a large tank (like 100G plus) but would not grow high light plants in your tank. So, given that people (like myself) strive for changes once all is settled, I would for sure say go for the 30W lights. It will give you more options in the future.

The one thing I don't know is regarding your light's ballast. Are you sure your incandescent light fixture ballast can handle 30W?

Ingo

---

Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Hi,
If you use screw-in fluorescent replacement bulbs for
incandescent bulbs, the ballast for the bulb is built
into the base of each bulb and thus you don't have
to worry about the ballast being large enough for
the bulbs.

Just get the right bulbs. You don't want anything that
is used for reading, they lack the harsh "glare" of
sunlight, which is what the plants need. As I mentioned
an earlier post, purchase DAYLIGHT or SUNLIGHT labeled
bulbs from any hardware store and save $$$ over those
sold at your LFS.

Frank


-->>> The Confidence of Amateurs, is the Envy of Professionals <<<--

Thanks alot for the replies.

Following your advice, I called Home Depot and they said they sell a Daylight compact fluorescent bulb (15 watts) for 1/3 the price of my LFS. So I will buy a 2 pack of these bulbs today and purchase my hood tomorrow. Tomorrow I will also be purchasing a few plants, probably a crypt. wendtii and some rosala.

Also, I have already ordered Christmas Moss of the interent which I should be recieving in about a week. My understanding is that this moss is very similar to Java Moss and can be kept under the same conditions? Please correct me if I am wrong, as the internet doesn't seem to have much information about this moss.

I guess I'll post some more pics tomorrow after I get my plants and hood .

kent,

Xmas Moss needs a little more light than normal Java moss, in particular if you would like it to grow dense and not stringy. Your 30W will do well for it, glad you decided on this light.

And I want to see some pictures, ok

Ingo

---

Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

In my 10g tank I have 2x25W Philips Daylight compact fluorescent bulbs (6500K). I got them from Home Depot too.

I just double check and actually the bulbs are 27W each

Hi guys,

Well I finally got my plants in after going to the LFS. I bought my hood and 3 plants (not all yet): Dwarf Anubias, Crypt. Wendtii (tropica), and the name of the other tall plant in my corner slips my mind (I want to say Bacopa, but I'm not sure). Anyways, I planted the tank and got everything set up, then took some pics (thats why you can probably see roots floating around). I also introduced my dwarf gourami to the tank and you will see him in some of the pics. Well, here the links:

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a157/kent_19_92/IMG_0166.jpg
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a157/kent_19_92/IMG_0165.jpg
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a157/kent_19_92/IMG_0164.jpg
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a157/kent_19_92/IMG_0163.jpg
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a157/kent_19_92/IMG_0162.jpg
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a157/kent_19_92/IMG_0161.jpg

As I said, I'm not done planting the tank, as my X mas moss will be coming soon, and I want to add 1 tall plant in the right corner to cover up the heater (maybe wisteria) and some thin, tall bladed plants behind my driftwood. Any suggestions would be really helpful (I currently have 3wpg).