FishProfiles.com Message Forums

Adding baking soda to the canister won't affect the KH of the tank unless the water some how mixes. But then I think KH would be the least of your worries (i.e. Drunk fish )

My understanding is that the backing soda is to counteract some of the acidic by products of the yeast to prolong the culture's life. If your water already has a decent KH then you probably don't need it, as the alcohol will kill the yeast before anything acidic does.

Rick


Rick
See all my pictures at Google Web Albums

Thanks, I think that makes sense!

I have bubbles! Yea! I can't count them yet, 1 bp5 seconds right now but it's just getting going.

pH 7.3 (below 7.5 and above 7.0)
KH 180 ppm
GH 150 ppm

Now I'm going to watch the bubbles, I may have to move the computer so I can watch and type at the same time. This could keep my kids occupied better then the washing machine at Grandmas!

Question: Some of the bubbles have gotten stuck halfway up the ladder, is this ok? normal? should I try to dislodge them or leave them? they have glommed together into a super bubble and I'm worried.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

I am wondering if I should have it closer to the heater

Hmm, I am just getting started with this too, I have my 2 liter bottle wrapped in a towel, like I do with rising bread, and am getting about 5 bubbles per second, which is franky more than I need. I dont know if this really effects activity of the yeast though.

As for the bubles that are getting trapped Im not sure, though the goal of this is to get the bubbles contact with the water so at least they are not escaping. You may have seen that some people use a bell, which is just a way to hold one super large buble in constant contact with water. In both that case and the ladder's you are just trying to keep the co2 in contact with the water as long as possible.

Chaos

__________________________________
- - - Humorous Bit of Wisdom - - -

Thanks Chaos, I think I may try a towel, my house is poorly insulated and the temp is never above 20 C unless I crank it right up, it could be that it's not warm enough. The bubbles are still going very slowly but they are not as stuck as they were, at least they are staying on the ladder and not escaping it. I think the bell would cost more than I paid for my whole kit so I'm going to stick with the ladder for now. Any tips on increasing the yeast activity? I may need to for the next batch. I have it down now about activating the yeast before adding it and the water to the mixture, then I'll know before it goes in if the yeast is active or not. I could have gotten an old batch. I have some baking yeast here for the next time incase it is old. The kit came with a 3 month supply of activator and stabilizer.

Water changes, anything about them now that may change with the CO2, obviously I can't stop the flow, should I slow it down so I don't lose gas during WC or not worry about it and do them the way I have always done them?
I have little valves that I can patch into the line, they are made for O2 lines though so I'm not sure how that would go.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

I have a built in pH meter in my tank. As the pH drops the krib is getting more coloured up, she's a deep purple now and she's nipping at the barbs and SAE a bit. This seems to be her mating display, she does it every time I adjust the pH.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

Hmm,

I dont know about the yeast you have. Does it say what is in the 'stabelizer'? because I assume the activator is yeast and I am skeptical that the stabelizer is magical. Might be baking soda. The yeast i used was almost 3 years old from one of those packets you get at the grocrey store. It sounds like the yeast didnt begin immideatly but they will get going. the blanket is probably a good idea but I dont think anything else will help this batch.

As for shutting off the co2 for a WC I dont think you will loose much and besides why risk building up too much preasure? doing a water change is going to bring your CO2 down drasticly as it is so I wouldnt worry.

Sounds like a fun pH meter, for everyone but the sae. Mabey she will relax about the pH because it will cycle a bit daily with the CO2. You might be intersted, I am taking a class on atmospheric chemistry and I read that CO2 can change by very large ammounts even in an open system like a forest just because of photosynthesis. The co2 can drop by 25% in the middle of every day and then get restored to max during the night. I was impressed by the level of carbon use there. I know its random but intersting i think.

Chaos

__________________________________
- - - Humorous Bit of Wisdom - - -

I love random bits of knowledge like that, and it may be useful to someone somewhere.

Hopefully this thing happening with the krib will slow down as she ages and as she adjusts to the pH in the tank, the barbs are just not interested, it would be great if I was planning on breeding her though, instant priming through CO2.

The bubbles are traveling a bit more smothly and a little quicker, not optimal yet but it is picking up, I think up to 1 bubble/3 seconds now instead of five, and they are staying on the ladder very well, not stuck as badly either. I was thinking gas exchange would be more thourough the longer the bubble is in the water so it may be a good thing.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

Chaos,
The 'activator' IS baking soda, my earlier post in here states that.

Luvmykrib,
Glad you like my siggie. Pass the wasabe ? Keep up the great work with the tank ! I have been wanting a 96w coralife light for quite awhile now but considering I went almost ALL crypt species I'm debating if it's even necessary to upgrade. It sure would look alot nicer then my 2 strip lights though

The Amazon Nut...

Thanks, damoss

I didnt read that far back. But I had a feeling that the packets you buy from the store arnt 'magical' and wanted to check

Chaos

__________________________________
- - - Humorous Bit of Wisdom - - -

Oops, you mean the 'activator' is yeast and the 'stabilizer' is baking soda right. Yeast came out of the activator pouch and the other which I haven't opened is baking soda. Very non-magical ingredients found in nearly every kitchen, even mine and I don't bake!

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

I got the 65 watt coralife, I need to get the bigger one, the store called while I was out so I may be able to get it today, I stll need the glass top and a rim, but I have a couple of ideas for that. I'm going shopping and it's a great day for it, -19 C out there! Yesterday was -21 C at it's warmest so I stayed home as much as possible.

The 25 is showing the early signs of ich. It has coressponded with the addition of the CO2 but I'm sure it's just a coincidence. Only two fish have one spot each, I'm slowly raising the temp to 80 F then I will treat the tank, if two fish have it I'm dosing the whole tank to be sure it's gone. Wish me luck, I don't want to kill off all the plants.

The bubbles are moving quicker this morning, last night I think I was wrong, it was more like 1 b/20 sec, now I'm closer to 1/3 and they seem to be moving gradually faster.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

luvmykrib,

Get the legs for the fixture, you will need them

That is if you don't have them already,

Ingo

---

Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Will do Ingo! I don't think I got them with the smaller fixture but I will be sure to get them when I get the bigger one.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

I've got 65 watts on my 25 gallon tank.

While I was at the store exchanging the 24" fixture for the 30" fixture (and the feet), I picked up the 36" sliding glass top from Hagen and was able to get a bottom rim from another tank for my glass support. It may not look great but it works. I will take pictures to post, cutting the glass was fun I can tell you, I recommend practicing on a different piece of glass before doing the real thing. We wound up making a space for the heater inadvertantly, I may eventually replace that piece of glass.

The fish were blinking like they needed sunglasses after I turned on the light, it's very bright in the tank and now the ugly red gravel is even more obvious. Any suggestions for new plants/placement will be appreciated.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

luvmykrib,



Sounds awesome, can't wait to see the picture

So you cut the glass yourself? Wow, I am impressed as I am way to chicken to ever try that. Please describe the process more detailed.

Ingo

---

Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Second try, I timed out the first time, so I'll keep this one short.

I exchanged the light I had gotten for the bigger one Ingo said to get, got the feet and a 36" sliding glass top as well. I asked about using a bottom rim from the tank as a top rim and trimming the vertical supports to hold the track. I was told this was an option and I was lucky enough that someone at the store was able to call Hagen and ask about this. They sold me a bottom rim off one of their tanks and Hagen is sending them a replacement piece. Yay!

To start I did the trimming of all the support pieces, they do not allow the track to sit on the rim when present. This actually was more time-consuming than anything and I was rather pleased with how it turned out. Next I had to trim the end pieces of the glass track, this was also easy to accomplish with a hacksaw. Leave the center piece intact until you are ready to place it in, as the tank bulges slightly with water in it, you need to fit it fairly exactly, mine fits nice and snug, it will not be falling in on the fishies.

Glass cutting is an art and I am no artist. Practice on a piece of glass you do not need before attempting this. It is not as easy as they show on TV! Our attempt is jagged and will work but as I said, I may still replace the two pieces we cut. Good thing there is a glass shop nearby!

Once I had the glass top in place and all the parts working it was time to start everything back up and fit the light on the tank. Why didn't you warn me about the legs Ingo?! We did the male thing and read the instructions after we had decided it wouldn't work, strange as it was myself and a girl friend doing this. Finally we got that figured out and placed on the tank. The legs fit between the rim and the track so they are secure and snug. All in all it took about two hours to do everything. Pics tonight of how it all looks.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

Why didn't you warn me about the legs Ingo?! We did the male thing and read the instructions after we had decided it wouldn't work

How could I know that you would act like me ?

Well, glad all is in place. Just one question: you say the legs fit between something. Why didn't you place them so they sit over the end of the new top rim? Not possible?

Oh, and somehting else: is it possible to use sandpaper on the glass where you cut it? I would imagine it is really sharp there.

Can't wait for the pictures, add a close-up of the new top parts as well,

Ingo

---

Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

The new rim doesn't have anything for the legs to hold onto, it is slightly rounded, with it fit in between the track and the edge it seems to be very secure, I'll get a close-up of it so you see what I mean.

This is probably the only time I haven't read the instructions before trying to put something together! That's generally my Hubby's trick and then I get to fix things or make them work, luckily it was my friend who read the little diagram on the cardboard on the bag and figured it out, the paper from inside wasn't clear enough. Or else we were still shocky from cutting the glass.

I am actually too nervous to try anything with the glass, a router/grouter(circular grinding tool, so technical I know) is supposed to be able to grind the edges smooth but I don't want to have anything to do with it. I will replace it as soon as possible and fit the plastic piece onto the back glass.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

I am trying something new with the pictures here, so I hope this works. I haven't figured out how to link words on the page to the site my pics are at, maybe someone could explain then I could do that next time.

http://w25.photobucket.com/widgets/dynamicflash.php?featuretype=bucketstamp&featurename=NewTankSet-up&pa=/c56/luvmypetz/

This is the new hardware and the whole tank the way it looks now.



"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

And this is the before and after of the tank lighting from the inside.

http://w25.photobucket.com/widgets/dynamicflash.php?featuretype=bucketstamp&featurename=Beforeandafter&pa=/c56/luvmypetz/

Very interesting, you can see the whole album from these pictures, neat! Now I know not to post naughty pictures here!

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

Now I know not to post naughty pictures here

Darn, I was hoping you wouldn't notice that

luv, you did an awesome job getting this together. I admire your talents.

Your tank looks great in this spot, like it was made for it .

Can you see why you needed the 30" light rather than the 24" one (even if it has the same bulb)?

Ingo

---

Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Hey, luv

Is this the effect you wanted with the links? Link?

If so you you do the following, but with square brackets (these [ ]) not the curly ones.

{link= Text you want to display} Hyperlink {/link}

Also, imho its easier to navigate what you are linking to if you link to one picture specifically and not to a group.

chaos


__________________________________
- - - Humorous Bit of Wisdom - - -

Yes it all makes sense now, at first I thought you were loco, or your brains had froze, now I realize why the longer fixture. It was neat getting it all together and the light was shocking at first, made the tank seem really green, but some of my crypts are turning reddish, I think they were supposed to. The fish are getting used to it to.

I just did a water change and am letting the tank sit in darkness while the gunk settles, no need to ruin my GW free streak!

I will be testing as soon as the tank is clear, the pH before WC was between 7 and 7.5, still rather high I think, not enough CO2, the KH was also still high, between 80 and 120 ppm. I need to get a more accurate test for that soon. The GH was still between 150 and 300 ppm, I will not be using the peat for much longer in the buckets, I will be switching to just peat in the filter and blackwater extract from Kents, it has the trace minerals, iron and will help with that hardness, I'm not using any other pH adjusting buffers anymore either, except the CO2 and what little the peat does, which isn't a lot. The switch is because the peat needs to sit in the bucket for much longer than it is able with a weekly water change, the blackwater extract should be much easier to use, though my brother is finding it isn't softening the water as much as we'd like. Where do I find those softwater pillows? They may be what I need.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

Chaos, for the before and after pictures I wanted them side by side and I figured the hardware pics could also be seen together, I didn't realize it would also link the whole album! I haven't played around with the photobucket site too much, I just upload my photos and then link them in. I will go back to the regular links I think, it was a neat thing to try though, the bucket stamp thing is kinda cool.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

The CO2 bubbles are still getting stuck near the top of the ladder. Is this a problem at all? Anyone have an answer as to what's happening and if/how should I fix it?

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

The CO2 bubbles are still getting stuck near the top of the ladder.

The fact that the bubble made it thru the ladder to the top means it got smaller and has been diffused into the water. Make sure there isn't any obstruction in the ladder like a piece of plant leaf, or dirt, etc. that would be enough to stop the bubbles from moving smoothly. Sometimes playing around with the ladder alittle by moving it slightly helps. It does take about 2 weeks from what I remember to have the ladder "greased" so the bubbles run thru it smoothly.


My Scapes

Since they are getting smaller and slowing down then getting stuck near the top I will not worry about it, hopefully it will clear itself up if what you said is true, I haven't had any escape the ladder except the first one, I didn't have the tube lined up quite right.
They are so hypnotic, make me forget abaout everything, even this little critter yelling 'Mommy!" at me.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

Tetra,

Do you know how the ladder gets 'greased'? I cant think of any reason that should happen. I assume your right but have no idea why.

Chaos

__________________________________
- - - Humorous Bit of Wisdom - - -

The bubbles are moving steadily again, I think they pick up any little bubbles that are there after the ladder is installed and then the ladder can be said to be greased, I don't think it's literally greased but the bubbles must make a path somehow to travel smoothly. It did have little bubbles on it when I first put it in and they are now all gone.

I will be picking up a second canister for the tank to make changing them easier, and after printing and reading that CO2 article from John Levasseur (See CO2 Recipe) I will be trying to find some vintners or brewers yeast, it prolongs the CO2 reaction and produces CO2 for a bit longer. I also now know what I did wrong when activating the yeast, the article goes into that in great depth, Chaos if you haven't checked it out, do so, I am talking about the first reply, follow that link.

My CO2 system also needs a check valve to prevent water being drawn in to the canister, can I use the ones that came with my air pump? Or would they break with the acidic conditions? They are a blue stone type I think, not really sure what they are made of, but my pump came with two, one for each air line (it is a double, I got it for the undergravel filter that I pulled out awhile ago).

So far everything is going nicely, I will be doing another water change, following the medicine directions, the spots seem to be clearing up but one of my otos has clamped fins, I think it's time to clean the filter and run the carbon. I will post the test readings then. Both before and after if I remember.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

luvmykrib,

I think you can try this check valve, even if it should break down it will take a while and that should give you enough time to get one that is made for CO2 (I am not an expert on that stuff).

About the Oto and medicine: I must have missed this all (or I don't remember). What medicine (I guess for Ich), for how long, what dosage? Thanks for the info

Ingo

---

Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Ah log maintenance, I should have put this in this log, I mentioned it in Chaos' log. Two of my tiger barbs (the new ones, I've had them about a month, maybe more) had 1 spot each, and the danios also looked they each had a spot or two, I suspected ich and rather than letting it spread to the other fish and treating it for weeks I decided to be aggressive and treat now. I used Jungle Labs Ich Guard Liquid and tried to raise the temp. This corresponded with our recent temperature change outside, it dropped to -29 C and the house had a hard time keeping up, the heaters in the tank also seemed to have a hard time with it. Then I installed the new light and had the heater disconnected for a while. The ich med says there is no need to rise the temp, so I didn't bring it all the way up to 80 F as is usually recommended but near the top of the ranger the fish are usually in. I've dosed twice, 1 tsp for every 10 gallons water with the 25% water change 24 hrs after the initial dose and each sequential dosing, it does not say how many times it can be repeated though, and I am approaching the time for a second water change. One of the spots is totally gone, the other is disappearing, I wanted to do one more dose to get any parasites that may be in the water. I am not sure what is causing the otos distress, but it could be the meds in the water, so I will be turning my attention to tank maintenance, a 30-40% water change, then filter cleaning and activated charcoal for two weeks. I have been feeding lightly as well, I usually try to underfeed as opposed to overfeeding.

The 10 gallon tank has been treated for fungus as well, I have lost 2 panda cories since treating the betta for tail and fin rot, one I found covered in cottony white fungus and decided to treat the tank and get as much as I could. That tank will be due for a WC tomorrow, I'll be doing a 50% like I did before treating the tank, then running AC in the filter to remove the fungus med, which was the Jungle Labs Fungus Eliminator. It is acrystal form and says to treat every four days after a 25% WC. In this tank I have water sprite that is showing signs of deficiency even after adding iron and potassium, the water sprite is coming out of both tanks. I have only WS floaters left in the 25.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

luvmykrib,

If it was Ich then the danger is not over just because you see less (even no) spots anymore. The medicine attachs the free floating stage which comes after a dot falls off and then multiplies. If your fish are strong then they may be able to fend off a new attack (attachment), so keep an eye open.

I don't evny your for your temperature problems. Just the opposite of what Robyn (TankWatcher) is fighting, she has about 30C in the tank because they have a major heat wave (Australia).

Ingo

---

Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

I'm hoping cleaning up the water will help them resist, the med was supposed to clear it out, but the parasite is resistant to meds while attached to the fish, since it fell off I'm hoping the med in the water killed it before it had a chance to reproduce. The otos are looking perkier anyway.

I will wait to test the water, all these water changes so close together, the water needs a chance to stabilize. The bubbles are moving pretty good, but they are not going 1 bps. Do I need that? Is there any way to speed up the reaction? The next batch will be better I'm sure, I'm looking for better yeast, either brewer's or vintner's, they are supposed to be the best as they tolerate the alcohol build-up better and produce CO2 for a longer time.

Tonight I will have new pictures as the previous water change I moved some plants around. I took out the water sprite, the meds seemed to be killing it. And moved the hygro into it's place, then I rearranged my crypts a bit more. I like the new look, but I can hardly wait to get new plants.

I was tempted this weekend to get a male krib. I found a beauty of a boy at Petcetera while I was shopping for a check valve. He had two eye spots on his tail and great colour. But I decided not to get him as I am just clearing the meds out of the tank, I'd rather get fish when the tank is all clean and running smoothly.

The weather is really weird, last week -29C and no snow this week -1C and lots of snow, which is melting pretty fast! I have a new thermostat to install in the house, a digital, I am hoping this will keep the temp steadier. Now I can't tell what the actual temp is in the house, only what it is supposed to be. I'm glad the weather is warmer, I may get it installed this weekend. The next thing for the tank will be a submersible heater, I'm looking for suggestions for a good one. I've heard the stealth mentioned, recommendations?

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

Stealth is good, I by now prefer it over the regular Visi-Therm and the Ebo Jaeger heaters. They are fully submersible and blend into the background.

Ingo

---

Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Luv,

I had read that article before I began. I was most concerned with how to build the thing and not too woried about how to get yeast started (again i just used baking expirence for that). Other than boiling all the water first and kind of sanitizing the equipment I didnt do anything special. Was there something specific you wanted to point out?

Glad thing seem to be going better now with the fish health. Though I must say tetra's comments on the free swimmers make me anxious about the fact that the spot disappeared. I suppose that was hatching and they might be trying to reattach soon. Ill probably get some meds tomarrow after I do some reading.

Chaos

__________________________________
- - - Humorous Bit of Wisdom - - -

Chaos, Nah, just thought if you hadn't seen it to mention it so you could check it out. I found the different yeasts interesting, and it now seems so easy to build one, before I figured anything I tried would come out really bad and maybe blow my house up. Also I had no idea that more yeast is not a better thing, I was beginning to think I should add more yeast. I'll leave it for now. Next time I'll see what I can do for getting my yeast to perform better, I think it was that I didn't activate it and my water was less than 90 F, I thought that was too warm and was trying to get it to 40 F, now I realize it was 40 C or 90 F. The next batch will be better.

The tank is in lights out so no pics tonight. Soon though I promise.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

Time for new pictures, it has been a week since the CO2 went in. Today I pushed the ladder farther down the back wall of the tank, the bubbles reaching the top are now much smaller than they were before, so I'm going to guess that more CO2 is being dissolved into the water by the time they get to the top. Testing my KH and PH right away, as soon as I get these pictures linked.

Whole tank
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c56/luvmypetz/wholetankshot1weekafterCO2.jpg

Left side
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c56/luvmypetz/Leftside1wkafterCO2.jpg

Center
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c56/luvmypetz/Center1weekafterCO2.jpg

Right side
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c56/luvmypetz/Rightside1weekafterCO2.jpg

The plants look good to me, I had some holes, I have dosed iron and potassium, should I be adding anything else for that specifically? I have a trace formula that I can add as well as a macro formula. Since I just did a water change I will test nitrate and phosphorus as well.

I should note that one of the barbs is looking pretty bad, skinny and breathing fast, he was trying to eat and kept spitting it out, I suspect TB but there is no hope if that is correct. I am hesitating to write him off though, I have lost fish to it in the past, the healthy fish never seemed to get it, so I am hopeful the others are healthy enough to resist.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

Test results
pH 7.2
KH 120 ppm
GH between 150 and 300 ppm
NO3 10 mg/L
PO4 0.5 mg/L
Temp 28 C / 82 F
CO2 12.682

Today I noticed that tests left to sit now become more acidic, previously they would become more basic as time went by, not sure what this means but it is something I have noticed. I decided to keep a paper record of tests done in a binder that also holds the EI article from Tom Barr and the DIY CO2 article from John Levasseur, I will be adding other articles of interest as I find them.


"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

Question: What is 10 mg/L in ppm? And the same for the PO4, what is 0.5 mg/L in ppm? Does it convert straight across?
According to what I just read at the Aquabotanic site in the Substrate and Fertilization Introduction article in the library, my PO4 is in the right range, the NO3 may be at the low end of the scale though. Should I dose N,P,K or leave the fish to do their work? I do not have separate N as yet.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

Hi,
To convert degrees to ppm, multiply the degrees by 17.9.
To go the other way, divide ppm by 17.9.

Frank


-->>> The Confidence of Amateurs, is the Envy of Professionals <<<--

Thanks Frank, does that apply for KH and GH as well or is there a different calculation for them?

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

luvmykrib,

does that apply for KH and GH as well or is there a different calculation for them?

That does, as far as tanks go, only apply to GH and KH. It is a conversion into German Degrees that you will need in order to read most of the charts that list how much CO2 your water is currently holding. So, for example, approx. 36ppm of KH is equal to 2dH. Look at This Page for a sample chart.

What is 10 mg/L in ppm?

That one has been made easy for us as the term ppm and the term mg/l mean pretty much the same. There are small differences because we are not looking at pure water, but they are so minor that we, for our tank purposes, can neglect them. So, for example, 10 mg/l are the same than 10ppm.

Hope this helps,

Ingo

---

Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

So if my calculations are correct, my tank is getting 12.682 ppm CO2, the KH is 6.7 dKH, and the pH is 7.2, is it enough CO2? Are the readings accurate? I haven't added any acid buffer in over a week, the tank has had 3 water changes since the last time I tried to adjust the pH. I do still have the peat in the filter and for the time being in the water buckets, this is due to the very high GH and KH from the tap, it is at the top of the scale, lowering it even a little bit seems to be helping.

I discovered that I have lost an oto, and one of the danios has a bent back. Should I start culling sick fish now or wait it out and do another water change? Realize that the buckets have not had a chance to steep and the water going in will be different than the water already in the tank. This may actually make things worse rather than better. So far it is one barb and one danio that are showing symptoms, in the past I have waited as long as possible until I could no longer stand to see the fish suffering, laboring with each breath and so skinny as to be almost see-through. I feel like I should instead act quickly to protect the other fish, they seemed to have been dining on the oto a bit, though I do not know why it died, it may have been stress from the medication and the temp being up and down, then up again.

Any advice or comments on my recent tank update are welcome!

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

See my thread [link=Here]http://www.fishprofiles.com/forums/thread.aspx?id=27221&rp=2 [/link] for info on the recent loss and my suspicions.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

luvmykrib,

Sorry to hear about all these fish problems, I don't really know what caused it or how to help you on this one. The only thing I can say is that:

a) A loss of maybe even 50% of an initial Oto population is happening rather often (without illness)
b) I has a danio with a bent back (for good) and he lived for quite a while, he actually was pretty bossy.

About your tank: right now, with all this medicine, filter changes, and what not going on, it may be better to wait to actually perform major changes (or additions). A few things I would say that can be done at some point:

1) Given that your lovely castle is about to dissapear behind the plants anyway, why not remove it and place some taller stems in that area, like Rotala Indica, Narrow Leaf Ludwigia, or even Bacopa.
2) How about adding some branchy driftwood that pokes out? Or maybe two of them, a smaller on the left and a larger one on the right. If you like the idea then go and get some now as you should soak in a bucket for a while (1 to 2 weeks at least).
3) It seems like your Amazon Sword has come a long way since you started this thread. It actually may be too big very soon. Do you have a plan there?
4) I would assume that your filter can be moved left or right, right? If so then why not try to place it somewhere less visible? Or maybe I should be more accurate as the filter is not the problem, but the Ladder (and its position is defined by the filters, right? ).
5) The background - that is algae, right? If it is clean, would this be a plain dark blue background?

Well, enough for now,

Ingo

---

Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

I think I figured out what happened, the filter got all bunked up, by dying water sprite I think, and the moss that gets sucked up the intake tube. I got it all cleared out and the tank cleaned up a bit more. Only the barb passed away, the danio seems to be fine, his back wasn't permanently bent, it was occasionally bent, so I suspected water quality as the cause.

Hi Ingo, thanks for all your ideas.
Yes the castle is going, I like the idea of rotala indica, I would like some red in the tank, aside from the crypts in behind the driftwood that are turning red.

The amazon sword will be finding a home with my brother in his 55 gallon tank, hopefully it will transition well, he has less light than I used to. I think that may be a good place for a piece of branchy driftwood and maybe some bacopa or the narrow-leaved ludwigia.

Yes I can now move the filter to the left or to the right, the ladder is placed right under the filter to push the bubbles back down as they head for the surface. I am still in a bubble watching mode and may move the filter after the spring re-do of the tank, gravel etc. That's when I will finally cut and add the plastic pieces to the glass top, and by then I should have the new glass cut, the jagged ones have to go. They aren't a danger to the fish or myself but they are bothersome as they don't slide at all nicely. I think the filter will move to the left, behind some tall plants, whichever doesn't wind up elsewhere I guess, what would you put there?

Yes the background is a nice beautiful field of green spot algae, left there for my algae eaters to eat, I guess when I finally choose a nice dark blue background I will have to clean the glass eh? I think navy near the gravel, fading to purple and lighter blue near the top, I see sunrise/sunset in the tank, for me it's already there, I don't even see the algae or the horrible plastic background that's there now. Visualization works wonders, algae? what algae?


"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

luvmykrib,

I am glad that it seems like you found the source of your issues, now you can correct it . I hate it when there is a problem (like algae) and you don't know exactly what causes it.

About the future scape: I would first try to get my hands on some hardscape, like driftwood and rocks. Once you have these then you can think about where they would fit in your tank and after that you could identify which plants would look nicely with this hardscape and where they should go. And during the whole time keep us posted so we can mess with your mind .

Ingo

---

Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Mess with my MIND?! Well if you can find it I guess you can mess with it, it seems to have deserted me right now.

I will be on the look out for some nice branchy driftwood, don't expect me to get it from ebay though, I don't want to spend that much on it! As for rocks, I will also be looking for them. I will keep the ladder visible for now so I can keep an eye on the CO2, I need to change the bottle soon.

I have a question about a suitable DIY bottle I am thinking of doing, to make bottle changes easier I have purchased some whiskey spouts, for alchohol bottles, I am thinking I would like to put them in the bottle and have the silicone tube attach to the spout. I bought 3 black plastic ones from Ikea for about $1.50 CDN to try this. Now before I do, has anyone tried this, how did it go? Did it blow the spout out? Would a glass bottle by chance be better for this experiment, I am going to attempt it before hooking the line up to the tank, just so the mess is contained in the kitchen rather than the living room and the tank. Any ideas on making this work?



"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

Well I have added the boiling water to the sugar, and activated the yeast, now I am waiting for the bottle to cool before adding the yeast, then I will attach a line to no where first before attaching it to the tank, I have run into a small issue though, the spout is designed to let air escape so the whiskey will pour smoothly, I need to seal this hole for this to work, aquarium silicone is what I need for this. I guess I should have this stuff on hand in case of leaks right? Told you my mind had deserted me! If it works I will post a pic of my wine bottle CO2 canister, if it doesn't work I will report my failure and on Wednesday I will change the mixture in the Hagen canister and look for those nylon bulkhead fittings from that DIY CO2 article, I can't find them in any hobby shops around here.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

Luv,
When I was doing diy co2 I had gotton these hose barbs from home depot. I think it was WATTS brand A-85. I drilled a tiny hole in the top of a 1.9 litre juice bottle. The kind with the rigid orange screw top. After I drilled the hole I pushed the hose barb through - Done. No silicone, nothing just filled up the bottle with the cocktail and put the hose on the other end of the hose barb.



My Scapes

Thanks Tetra, I decided to use scotch tape for now to cover the hole, silicone later if it actually works, I'd hate to waste a good whiskey spout! I have added the yeast and am letting it sit, I'll do a test run in a few hours. I'm letting the mixture get started first, this way my CO2 production won't go down. So far the spout has stayed in the bottle, and the valve hasn't been blown out either. I have it open all the way so pressure doesn't build-up too much. I am hoping this will work as it will make changing bottles a snap. Now I will need to buy and consume another 1.5L of wine to get another bottle. Oh the hardships of fish keeping!

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

Ok there are bubbles happening inside the new canister, but none are making it to the ladder. I have sealed all the joins with pipe tape, and sealed the hole with two layers of it. Both valves are wide open, I don't know what else to do to make it work. How long before I should give up and switch back to the other canister? Any ideas? Anyone?

I bought two plants today, a bacopa and a red and green ludwigia, the ludwigia is by the ladder in it's new spot near the heater, and the bacopa is where the ladder used to be, pictures tonight.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

No pictures, I turned off the light before I remembered I was going to take them. I am pulling the plug on the whiskey spout CO2 canister, there has been no change at all, still no bubbles making it to the bottom of the ladder, there seems to be just enough pressure keeping the water from being siphoned up the tube, but not enough to push the gas down the tube. There has been no CO2 in the tank for 24 hrs and the water was getting a slightly cloudy look to it. It may be that I replaced the sponge and am trying a new peat, or it could be better light and no CO2. Thus I am going back to the original bottle as I can't seem to make this idea work. I was looking forward to my new wine too! So I'll have to make do with this one, where is everyone! I am taliking to myself here and I'm the only one answering me! Cheese anyone?

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

I did my DIY CO2 like tetratech. I don't know what a whiskey spout is(but I do know what whiskey is ). You may have a bad batch, I got those once in a while. Maybe just try making a new batch of CO2....remember to use warmish water and dechlor.

---

Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

I switched it out and the CO2 started to move down right away, it wasn't a problem with the batch, when I popped the cork it bubbled like champagne, without the loud POP and fizz! I think it could have been the connections, the tubing was probably way too long and I had 2 valves to hold it all together, so lots of places for leaks, plus my hubby isn't sure that the pipe tape is airtight or water proof!

A whiskey spout is the pouring device inserted into the bottle to make pouring go smoothly. That's the only name I could think of for it. The ikea name is SODA, but I don't read Swedish! Anyway, I guess I will have to do it the traditional way, which means I get to play with power tools, and now have most of a good batch of CO2 mixture going to waste, I wish I could feed it to keep it alive for the next change out. Maybe another experiment coming on! Nah, too tired. So what kind of alcohol is produced in this reaction anyway? Chaos said to toss it down the drain, so I guess it isn't drinkable? How's screech made? Any Newfies here who know?

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

If you've seen a mature yeast batch, I'd hope you wouldn't even think of drinking it. Nasty nasty. There's a reason why most people don't brew their own alcohol.

---

Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Just so you know I was kidding, my lips still burn from the siphoning I did to get some of the stuff (sugar and yeast) from the bottom of the large bottle into the smaller bottle. Yikes it was only 1 day old! Talk about strong, good thing none of it actually went into my mouth.
I'm not crazy about hard alcohol, it makes me hurt, I do like wine and beer, had some good porter the other day. I have thought about brewing my own beer, and making my own wine, but I have a small house and three inquisitive boys. I wouldn't want to catch them in my liquor brewing closet! Hope they don't get any funny ideas about my CO2 bottle! The rest of the wine bottle full is going down the drain, I don't think it could be kept viable for 14 days and not be at the same strength as the one needing to be replaced.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

This batch is much better than the first one, I must have got the activation right, plus I probably have my yeast stored better than in a paper packet in a cardboard box in a warehouse. It could have been an old box too. My yeast is kept in a tightly closed glass jar in the pantry, away from moisture and light and heat.
The bubbles are really moving, they do not slow and get stuck like the last batch did, they race through the ladder, barely lose any size, I will push the ladder as far down the glass as it will go. What size bubble is the best, these are monsters, do I want them to be smaller? Should I try a valve or just leave it for now?

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

Now that I have recovered from my bottle madness, everything looks better now. I have a plan for future bottle changes, I'll start the new batch the day before in a different bottle, then when I;m ready to switch, the downtime will be less, just as long as it takes to rinse out the bottle and add the new batch. I have the valves to prevent the tank from draining out while the line is unhooked.

Barbs gone mad! One barb may be preggers! She has a really fat tummy, no pinecone scales though. The males are chasing her all over the tank, it's like a wild fast dance. I am not worried though, by morning if there were any eggs they will be all gone and I won't see a thing. She looks tired though, and there doesn't seem to be anywhere she can hide that they won't find her.

The new plants are looking pretty good, Ingo, you'd be proud, I moved the filter over to the left, the uptake tube is now hidden by the amazon sword, and the bacopa will eventually complete the camoflage. I moved the ladder to the right and it is now hidden partially by the hygo and the new ludwigia. The castle is gone, well actually it is now on display elsewhere in the house, like the skeleton in a bucket I am not allowed to throw out.

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus