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Yes the ADA tanks rely on the substrate, but then they don't do much in the way of adding macros to the water column.

It's another option, another way of doing things.

Water column dosing and inert substrate works fine too. Too fine, I wish I could get a sword that stays under 2 foot tall, or a crypt that doesn't try to take over the tank. I spend as much time now pulling out the various runners that are popping up all over my inert sand substrate. I've got E.Uruquaysensis over 2 foot tall, Balansae close to 3 foot, Val.Nana everywhere, and a C.Spiralis 2 foot tall and a foot wide trying to take over - runners and new plants have popped up in every single part of the tank, some I can't get too because they've grown out the middle of Anubias bunches that are frirmly stuck to wood and rocks.Inert substrate, never so much as sniffed a root tab in their life. So much for the heavy root feeder theory ! Do I need to provide a pic ?

I'd love to try Aquasoil in a tank to compare but it just can't be found here. Maybe next time I go to Singapore I'll bring back a 9lt back to try in a small tank.

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Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

I understand both of you

But here is a question (that I indirectly raised above):

Does ADA soil, with its ph altering abilities, have any influence on the calculation of CO2 via a ph/KH chart? Meaning, when ADA soil lowers the ph to let's say 6, and the KH in the tank is 3, is the calculation of CO2 via chart with a result of 90ppm still correct?

In other words, assuming my neutral ph and me using ADA soil and assuming I would create a KH (with Baking Soda) of 3KH, would I achieve 90ppm of CO2 simply by letting the soil do its thing, while not injecting any CO2 in addition?

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

You know better than that LF. Otherwise nobody would have pressurized CO2 and just use peat to get the CO2 they need.

CO2 only alters the pH. Things like peat and whatnot will move both pH and KH either up or down, so that the CO2 levels stay the same.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

http://www.seachem.com/products/product_pages/Onyx%20Sand.html

Maybe you should try this stuff. I haven't actualy seen the stuff yet but it looks pretty cool. Here with high Ph and Kh it wouldn't be really ideal but where you are it might be.

I have also wondered about such things with messing with the normal water ph/kh and figuring your CO2 from it. My guess is you should find out how much your water changes and then go from there. If you drop your ph to around 4 you cant have ammoniai in your tank.

55G Planted tank thread
19G Container Pond
[IMG]http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y118/Wingsdlc/Ric

You know better than that LF

I guess I should, but after not having worried about these things in 8 months I tend to forget

Anyway, so this means the following:

- If you have a start ph of 7 and a KH of 3, you should have a CO2 of about 9ppm.
- If you use a substrate like the ADA soil that lowers the ph to, let's say, 6, and if the CO2 would remain at 9ppm, you would have lowered your KH to about 0.25

Isn't that outright dangerous? If you also had a low GH, you pretty much would have lost most of your buffer capabilities and a crash is just around the corner. Right?

Sorry to ask these general questions, just curious.

Ingo

EDIT: Wings, didn't see your entry while I posted, I will read up on it

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Those are interesting questions, LF, and it all sounds logical... but I think there's something more too it.

The KH of my tap water is around 2 or 3, something low like that. GH isn't very high either, I think around 4 or 5 last I checked several months ago.

Now I have that little 4 gallon going with the ADA substrate and a few japonicas in it and they're doing just fine, have been for weeks now. I only checked the ph once, and it was down around 6.5 or 6.4, no idea what the kh is but if ADA lowers it then I'd have to assume it's lower as well. But nothing is looking stressed out. The shrimp look good, shedding their shells pretty often, which shows growth and I would guess good health. The plants grow slowly but healthy looking, I'm sure growth would take off if I gave any CO2 gas.

I think sometimes we get caught up in the numbers game and prevent ourselves from doing things that we can do but refrain from doing because of assumptions etc. In other words, sometimes ignorance is bliss

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Back in the saddle!

I agree NowherMan6, but I like being caught up in the numbers game

I guess I am still not convinced that this whole tank thing cannot be simply calculated

I have a tab KH of maybe 1, and the same for GH. Assume a low tech tank with ADA soil in that setting (I don't add any buffers in my non-CO2 tanks). I would assume that this could get close to no buffering.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Moving a pH from 7 to 6 with a KH of 3 would be near impossible with the use of ADA soil alone. The pH might get knocked down to 6.7 or something like that though.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Well Matty,

Now you have to explain to me why this would be impossible

I have read more than once about ADA causing ph changes of 1 degree or more, and I know someone personally who went from about 8 to below 7.

Remember that the KH of 3 at a ph of 7 is not a "natural" occurance and is achieved via Baking Soda addition which I only do on high tech tanks, but - for example - not on this tank here. Normally, the tab KH is maybe up to 1.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Well the tap water around here has a pH of about 7.8, and the KH is around 4-5. GH is high too. Now I've never used any ADA stuff, but it would have to be hydrochloric acid to immediately burn through the buffers to pull the pH down that low. That's what buffers do - they are neutral parts and peices of acids and bases that react with other parts and peices of acids and bases to keep the pH(concentration of H+ in the water) at the same or similar level. I've only heard once that someone was able to keep his pH low around here through the use of peat and what not - but he doesn't do any water changes, which would replace the buffers.

If your KH is low to begin with, that's a different story - but you aren't going to get any CO2 out of ADA soil in any case.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Hard to see how the aquasoil would drop the pH by 1. But as matty said it will also bring down KH so the co2 content remains the same.

Previously there was a lot of talk of hard water and softwater plants. It would seem high GH doesn't bother plants at all. Low GH will due to the lack of Ca and Mg.

Recently there is a lot of talk about high pH and KH causeing problems for plants. Some believe that low KH and low pH really help with growth. Amano would seem to be one of these. Hence the use of substrates that help keep both these low.

It may also go some way to explaining Amano methods of using Co2. Hard to know what he does. Published data seems to show he uses relatively low amounts of Co2. Certainly if you look at his delivery methods and placement of Co2 equipment it would seem he's not worried about high levels of Co2. This may be due to his tanks having such low pH and KH.

There are a few that swear plants grow much better when the kh is close to zero.

Certainly there's enough people using aquasoil witthout killing fish to show that the pH swings aren't casuing problems.

Like anything you put in the substrate the realease to the water column and the resultant effect is going to be slow. That may be the key. The gradual change gives the lifestock plenty of time to adapt.

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Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

Well,

What better day to use to change a tank than the 4th of July, or even more percise the day Germany loses to Italy

As I mentioned before, I had no other choice than to strip down this tanks as it had to be moved from the office into the basement, aka Fish Room.

Here is a last look at the tank before the move started. The moss had been trimmed two weeks ago, this saved me some time today. Nevertheless, it took 7 hours, including the follow-up cleaning of buckets and what not.

Attached Image:

Before The Move

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Next, I followed the tradition that I started with the change of the 20G.

I stripped out all plants and added them to a big tub. That tub contained a heater and an air pump, as all adult anf teenage fish went into it as well.

Here is the tank at that stage:

Attached Image:

All Plants Gone

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Next, I fished out some Platy fry and placed them in a separate bucket, too small to be added to the adults as they for sure would have become lunch.

Then I fished out a layer of substrate to use as the base for the new setup.

This messed up the tank royaly, all the Laterite was set free:

Attached Image:

Looks Like Sunset

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

This step was followed by the daining of the tank, followed by the removal of all the gravel and such.

Next, I washed the tank by rinsing it out with water. I decided not to clean the glass on the inside as it may contain some valuable goodies (I don't think so, but it is worth a try).

The tank was then moved with the stand to the basement and set up:

Attached Image:

Tank Moved Downstairs

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Here is a look at the tub in which I contained most plants (not the tenellus, they were in the fry bucket) and all the older fish.

I had to rescue about 5 platies during the day as they decided to jump ship. The water was filled almost to the top:

Attached Image:

Fish and Plant Tub

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Now I fitted the tank with a new background, one that costs about $4 and is easily replaced with a similar one in another color.

Next,I filled in the base layer of used gravel:

Attached Image:

Tank With base layer

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

This layer was followed by 40lbs of Eco Complete

That stuff was then layed out to simulate a slope upwards on the right side. In the end, that was not how I maintained it though:

Attached Image:

Eco Goes In

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Next, I placed the driftwood with the moss back in and arranged some rocks around it.

I find that my tanks always look best at this stage of the setup, simple and clear. Somehow, I always manage to mess things up as soon as I add water.

Attached Image:

Hardscape In Place

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Then it was time to fill the tank a little, plant the tenellus, add more water, and keep on planting until all was in.

The plant that surprised me was the Anubias Nana. It had double in length during the few months that it was in this tank, generating a new growth on one side. Both sides are about to have flowers. I split the group and planted them in 2 spots.

Without further rambling, here is the tank now:

Attached Image:

Tank Now

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

And for completion purposes, here are 3 shots of the tank in relationship to the family of tanks in the same room.

Here you can see the 29G with the 125G to its left:

Attached Image:

Fishroom I

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

This shot was taken from behind the 40G. You can see 3 of the 4 tanks that are down here, the 40, 125, and the 29 to the right.

Sorry that the 40G is not in focus.

Attached Image:

Fishroom II

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

And in order to fit also the last tank into the picture, here is a shot of the back of the 40G leading the way to the recently redone 20G.

And that is it for now, let me know what you think about the new layout. I know, not too much has changed, except for the new substrate, no more Bacopa, a split Anubias, and a slightly different setup for the tall plants.

Thanks for looking through my log,

Ingo

Attached Image:

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Ingo,

I think the tank looks very good, especially having just moved it and set it back up.

I couple of weeks of growth and it will be back looking as good as new.

Jim

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Water, taken in moderation, cannot hurt anybody. -- Mark Twain

Thanks Jim

I hope you are right about growth within a couple of weeks. The tenellus started not doing so well in the old setup, before I added the plants (or some of it at least) back into the tank I had to untangle them from Xmass moss that was all over the place and I am sure suffocated the tenellus.

How is your planting coming along?

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Ingo,

Very nice I like the new look 29g. Don't put anything tall on the right side. I have Fishroom envy more than ever

BTW - Why did you go with gravel under the Eco?

My Scapes

Ingo,

Well, I've had many delays with my projects, but I'm slowly trying to get some things going.

We just finished a major kitchen remodel/renovation in our home which kind of got in the way of other things as well as it being my really busy time of year for work.

However, I've been working on a couple of aquarium's a bit. The 38 gallon that was going to be my main planting project is now set up with the flourite, driftwood, top & lighting. I've still got to order the CO2 system, but hopefully will be able to get to that over the next couple of weeks. As soon as I get that in then I will get the plants ordered.

I'm a bit slow at times, but I'm persistant and eventually get it all accomplished

Jim

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Water, taken in moderation, cannot hurt anybody. -- Mark Twain

Really really nice job

I liked the old set up, I like this one better.

It's very clean,simple and uncluttered but still has a nice selection of shapes and textures.

Great room, I'd never leave the basement if I had something like that.

BTW - Why did you go with gravel under the Eco?

Maybe he listened to his uncle for a change ! A thin layer of old gravel works wonders for a tank. Gives a nice start of bacteria which provides oxygen to roots.

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Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

Wow, what a relaxing room that must be, except for water change/trimming/maintenence day. I agree, I'd never leave that room either. What a nice bunch of tanks. All look great.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

As Matt brought up water change and trimming times. How do you work that out?

55G Planted tank thread
19G Container Pond
[IMG]http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y118/Wingsdlc/Ric

Maybe he listened to his uncle for a change !

I guess I did

Although I did not listen to the uncle when he suggested that I should leave this tank alone

Thanks to all of you for the compliments on the tank and the fish room setup. I appreciate all feedback, but positive responses are always extra nice to receive.

About Water Changes and Trimmings:

- The 20 and the 29 are low tech tanks with rather slow growth, so trimming doesn't have to occur too often, and water changes will happen every other week at 50%. With a Python, no big deal, overall maybe one hour for both together.

- The 40 and the 125 take some more time to deal with, in particular when they are not completed (even the 125 should not survive in its current setup). Trimming and water changes should not take more than about 4 hours (at most) per week.

- That leaves me with about 4.5 hours weekly on tank related tasks (besides feeding and fert additions). Meaning - here is my Saturday morning all layed out for you

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Here is a series of 6 detail shots, mostly regarding two fish in the tank.

But first, this is taken through the right side panel. It shows the position of the main Anubias a little better. It is basically placed between the front and back legs of the driftwood. It wasn't quite easy to wedge it in there, given that I buried the roots (not the rhizome, of course). Also, note the incoming flower (tertatech - must be the good NJ water ).

Attached Image:

Center Anubias

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

This fish was already in the last shot, but he/she deserves a mentioning on his/her own. This Neon Tetra is the sole survivor of about 20 Neons that I purchased within the first 6 months of existance of this tank. Like for so many of us, a load died quickly and a few made it through a few months.

Attached Image:

The Neon I

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

He is alone in the tank now since at least 3 months, that was when his/her last companion, with whom he/she was fighting all the time, died. It seems as if the fish is rather ok in this setting, as it is not in hiding what-so-ever and claimes the open area above the tenellus as his/her territory.

Nice blue stripe, I may say:

Attached Image:

Last Neon

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Now here is a series of 3 shots of the current pride in this tank.

A Platy - I mentioned this fish already in one of Robyn's logs (she has at least as many logs than I do, so I cannot remember in which one that was).

Attached Image:

Young Platy I

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

What is so special about this fish is that it is a cross breed between my Sunset and my Twin Bar platies, and probably some other genetic input that has been carried within the parents and grandparents (at least the 3rd generation born in my tanks).

The base color is the same as the one for all my Twin Bars, but all fins are solid black. It seems as if this would be a female, but it is probably too early to tell.

Attached Image:

Young Platy II

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Last but not least, here is a head on shot with one of the juvenile Sunset platies. You can see that even the upper and lower lip have a black marking, really cute.

I am currently in posession of 2 additional fish with similar markings, but these are still very small and still small enough to serve as food for the larger ones.

Attached Image:

Young Platy III

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Little Fish - what kind of bulbs do you have in your 29 gallon? That tank is so bright and clear. I'm trying to get that look in my 29 gallon.

Brian,

If you look at the previous page, there is a picture series of the tank in positional relationship to my other tanks. The first shot in that series gives you a good look at the light fixture above the tank.

That is a Coralife Freshwater 65W Power Compact Unit (around $60, the bulb is 6,700K), elevated on legs (also from Coralife, $7) over a glass top. I would recommend that you have a glass top with a wider middle section, the one I have is made by All-Glass Aquarium and designed to hold their double flourescent fixter (is different middle width that the single one).

I hope that helps, keep on asking if you need more info,

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Ok,

Here is a new shot of the tank from yesterday, after a week that saw 48 hours of no power for lights and filter (see my 125G log for details and with regards to power supplement via generator):

Attached Image:

Full Tank

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

The tenellus seems to settle in nicely, I can see some nice light green new leaves sprouting from various plants, I guess I will soon have a nice tenellus garden again.

The one thing that I noticed after the power outage are some reddish brown areas in the Xmas Moss, I assume some form of hair algae that didn't like the no-light situation too much

Attached Image:

Moss

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

The tenellus seems to settle in nicely, I can see some nice light green new leaves sprouting from various plants, I guess I will soon have a nice tenellus garden again.

Yea

This has always been my favorite tank of yours LF. What is the plant behind the tenellus? Whatever it is it fits nicely. It's a good contrast of color/shape with the tenellus.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Thanks Matty,

Sometimes I wonder if I should convert all my tanks to medium light / low tech, it seems to be kinder to me

The taller plant behind the tenellus is Narrow Leaf Sagittaria Subulata. It is barely hanging in (since at least 4 to 6 months) in this tank, with the infrequent ferts, only 2.25wpg, and occasional shading by other plants, in my large tank it reached a height of about 20++ inches

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

I had some sag in my tank for a forground plant a while back. I let it get about 9-10 inches before I figured it had to go.

55G Planted tank thread
19G Container Pond
[IMG]http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y118/Wingsdlc/Ric

Ok,

3 pictures come right now, as the Anubias decided to bloom in this low tech / medium light tank. Sorry guys, they just bloom for me under all kinds of conditions

Here is the first one, on the Anubias that is pretty much in the middle of the tank, under the driftwood overhang

Attached Image:

Anubias Nana Flower I

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Here is the second one, this one on the plant on the left side of the tank, in front of the crypt and hygro. That plant is actually a cut off section of the other one, the seperation was performed a few weeks back when I moved the tank to the basement.

Attached Image:

Anubias Nana Flower II

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Last but not least, no flower but a fish.

I am very happy with the way this platy is growing up, he/she still has this beautiful black finnage with the yellow body. I have another 2 of them that are slightly younger and another one that is even younger than the 2.

Unfortunately, I doubt that the parents are still in the tank, as the move also included some culling to assure that the overpopulation is no longer an issue.

Ingo

Attached Image:

Platy Mix

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Some people have all the luck! I want more anubias flowers! I just might have to sneak into your basement and take them home for my wife!

Nice platy too by the way. I like the dark fins on the light body.

55G Planted tank thread
19G Container Pond
[IMG]http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y118/Wingsdlc/Ric

Yeah Wings,

Go ahead, but be warned - my diving attack cat is waiting for you

In anyway, even if you get 10 flowers, they make for a very small bouquet.

The Platy is very nice, his black face markings make him look like a mouse more that any Mickey Mouse platy ever could achieve

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Ahhh, I see what you mean. Very nice Ingo.

I missed this thread somehow.

EDIT: I've now had a chance to read through this thread from the beginning & seen the changing face of this tank. & was very interested in the conversation a few pages ago about ADA & C02 dosing. Those are the same questions I have & you express the same worry - but I can't help thinking that if Amano uses the soil & doses with C02, it must be ok to do so. I will no doubt get this name wrong, so I apologise, but I've heard you all mention Jeff Senke ??spelling?? & he too uses it, doesn't he? It definitely does drop pH & keep it down & that's the sole reason I bought it really. My apistos need low pH to breed & my tap water is around 8pH. They also like really soft water. This ADA keeps my pH at 6pH or lower & kH is 1. I don't need to worry about buffers to keep it where it should be. I think the ADA contributed to the rapid apisto egg laying. Plants grow very well in there too. I know I'm very late for this conversation, so I apologise for sidetracking here as I know you've moved on to Eco. I just found that conversation interesting.

This tank seems like a platy sanctuary. I love the pic of them all gathering in a lower corner, awaiting their food. Mine do that, but they have figured out the feeding corner & that's where they gather when they see me coming.

Cheers
TW

In anyway, even if you get 10 flowers, they make for a very small bouquet.

Very true my friend.

55G Planted tank thread
19G Container Pond
[IMG]http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y118/Wingsdlc/Ric

Robyn,

Thanks for the comments, always appreciated...
"Jeff Senke" - Very close, Jeff Senske is his name. He and his brother run Aquarium Design Group, the American representation of Amano's ADA, besides other things. Also, Jeff is Bensaf's favorite tank designer. And - that is where Rick got his soil from, he met Jeff while I only talked to him a few times over the phone . . And - my 40G driftwood is from him, imported from ADA.

Ingo

Wings -

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

So, you shop at ADA, you must be RICH, RICH, RICH

Cheers
TW

that's right Robyn,

We all are rich

Or is it that a little of Rich is in all of us ?

In either way, I fixed the link in my last entry so that you can look at Jeff Senske's website.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

A quick update on the tank, or the Xmas moss to be more percise. I may have done more damage than good when I decided to inject the weekly dosae of Excel directly into the moss (on 3 spots) because some threads of algae were spreading out more than I like.

These spots have turned whitish and the moss seems to be dying. I will keep it like that (except if you have a good point why I shouldn't) and see if it comes back. If not then I will have a hard time removing the wood to strip off the infected areas as the Nana and the Crypts are planted really close to it.

Ingo

Attached Image:

Excel and Xmas Moss

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Is the moss doing any better now?

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Matty,

The moss actually got worse. Last weekend, during the water change, I removed about half of it from the top part of the wood. The white/brownish areas had expanded and clearly showed dead plant matter. I tried to take out as much as possible without ripping the entire moss cover off the wood. Last night it looked a little better, but still rather beaten up.

One thing is for sure, I will not inject Excel into Xmas Moss again, as I strongly believe this to have caused this problem.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Here is a new photo of the whole tank. The Hygro has not yet been trimmed since it had been added to the tank a few months ago (although it had been removed during the transport and new stems have been added). Everything in the tank is growing really slow when compared to the high tech / hight light tanks.

Attached Image:

Full Tank

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Looking closer at the moss one can still see where I damaged it with my Excel spot injection method, something I will for sure not repeat. I had to remove quite a bit of the moss in these areas as the bottoms died off. Even during this week's water change I removed some more. Nevertheless, it seems to gradually improve again. Time will tell.

Attached Image:

Moss Damage

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Green spot algae has also increased on a few Anubias leaves. These leaves are on the main center group and are getting the most flow of any plants in the tank as the inlet from the HOB is blowing water down on them. Such an increase in green spot had not happened when the tank was pretty much the same but had gravel as a substrate. I conclude that it is nutrient related (contained in Eco and leaching into water column).

That's it for now,

Ingo

Attached Image:

Green Spot

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Those anubias leaves are e to green spot if in full light, but while they are slow growing, at least they are very sturdyand aren't generally affected by it. I also wouldn't think that the flow has anything to do with it, but the nutrient thing might not be far off. After ignoring all your tanks for a while one would have to expect at least a little green spot. I'm sure after a couple of water changes and careful ferting it shouldn't be a problem. Those chain swords still look nice, but haven't quite reached the stature they once had in this tank. I don't think mine will get that tall either, unfortunately there's probably too much light.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

unfortunately there's probably too much light

Ah - I haven't thought of that option yet, thanks Matty

This tank has not really been neglected more than it had been in the past, mostly getting bi-weekly water changes and maybe ferts once a week. Another reason could be that the PC light is getting around one year old, time for a new one anyway.

Thanks,

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

This tank looks really good. From a scaping principle it's your best work as of now.



My Scapes

Thanks tetratech,

Although this sounds good, it is a little discouraging. A medium light - low tech - infrequent ferts - bi-weekly water change - most of the time overstocked tank is the best I have.

Maybe all I have to do with my other tanks is to neglect them a little more

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Very nice looking tank Ingo.

I have a little of the green spot algae on anubias in my 23.7, which I'm sure was caused by too much light. Currently treating that tank with excel.

Cheers
TW

Although this sounds good, it is a little discouraging. A medium light - low tech - infrequent ferts - bi-weekly water change - most of the time overstocked tank is the best I have.

Well, I understand what you saying, but I'm rating the tank on placement, textures, etc. If you put anything tall on the right , I'm coming to Jersey and pulling them out. So that scary hand will be in your tank soon.

My Scapes

Robyn,

I hope you are not treating the tank with Excel just for the green spot algae, as I believe this would not work. I usually end up with removing these leaves, the problem in this tank is that the infected leaves make the main group look complete and as such cannot go.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

The tank this week still looks the same (that is why I don't post another picture of it), except that the moss is getting a little worse. I assume that I soon will have to take the wood out and retie a few good pieces of moss to it while disposing of the bad parts.

Here is a shot of the sole Neon Tetra in this tank, the only survivor of about 20 that I overall tried to incorporate about one year ago:

Attached Image:

Neon Tetra

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All my tanks got a little treat this weekend, but this tank came a little short. Treats, btw, are new pieces of hardware that I bought last week.

This tank only got a new light bulb as I think the old one was about one year old already. At least it appears to me as if the tank is brighter now, but maybe it is just the knowledge that there is a new light on the tank.

Anyway, here it is before the new bulb:

Attached Image:

Before

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And here it is after. I guess a photo cannot really tell the difference as the light sensitivity of the camera should automatically adjust to the more light, right?

Here it is:

Attached Image:

After

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And here it is after. I guess a photo cannot really tell the difference as the light sensitivity of the camera should automatically adjust to the more light, right?

The best way to tell(since I assume you didn't adjust the white balance) is the color of the tank. The second picture looks much whiter, which is my preference. Light bulbs tend to lose some color, and a bit of intensity as they age. The camera will adjust to the amount of light, but it didn't seem to adjust for the color. I'm not a huge fan of yellow lights. In fact, I'm pretty unimpressed with the (oops got distracted by my featherfin rainbows flashing at each other, so cool when they do that) 6700K coralife bulb. I'm probably going to switch it out for the 10000K bulb in the future.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Thanks Matty for the info on the brightness of plants to identify light intensity. There is one problem though. It greatly depends on the focus point of the camera within the tank on how bright certain areas of the tank appear on the pictures. I usually take about 10 shots per tank where I change the focal point just lightly to lighter and darker areas, then I pick the best shot to show you guys.

Why would you switch to a 10,000K light if the 6,700K unit is supposed to be better for plant growth? Yeah, it may look nicer to you, but shouldn't the main concern be the plants?

Ingo

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Well I just looked all over for the color rendering charts for the two bulbs to compare. As I remember they aren't all that different. I think the 10000k actually has less green and more blue, which would be better for the plants, since they will use blue and not green. I'm probably mistaken though, because I can't seem to find the charts anywhere on the web, and coralife's web site, esuweb, is down or something.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Ever since I entered the real of serious plant keeping (which is not all that long ago), it was said that around 6,700K to 6,500K would be the best K rating for plants. I would be very surprised to find out that 10,000K would actually be better. Maybe it is only a little worse, but on medium light tanks does not create a difference and as such can be used just as well.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Amano uses and sells 8000K lights. Check out the ADG shop page under lighting. I bet a lot of people haven't tried a lot of different colored bulbs since a few years ago somebody said that 6700K was the best out there, back then it probably was. 65(7)00K is still a great color for plant growth, but 8000K or 10000K could be just as good now, and more pleasing to some people that like a whiter appearance. PC bulbs have come a long way in a few years with more temperatures available and just better quality available. I really didn't mean to say it's better, but the colors might be more attuned to what plants use to grow(things other than green, mostly blue and red). That was just from memory though, and like I said it's probably wrong.

I do have my second light as a 10000K(from my SW tank) and when both are on, the color in the tank is great, and the plants pearl like crazy. Might be due to just an increase of light intensity, but they have to be using it. Maybe they'd use two 6700K better, I dunno.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Hi,
I use the 8800K CP bulbs in my tank, mainly, because they
stopped carrying the 6700K ones where I shop.
As you go up in the "K" rating, the light begins to take on
a bluer and bluer tinge. In its extreme it seems to wash
out some of the greens in some of the plants. I noticed it
in crypts for instance. This effect is why tanks that use
actinic blue, also have a second light that is in the day,
or sunlight, spectrum. As you go up in "K" rating, the
light will penetrate deeper into the water with less
scattering. That can be important in tanks 24 inches or
deeper. 10,000K is the minimum that should be used on a
salt water tank, especially one that houses corals and
other invertebrates. They use the intense light the sun
provides to manufacture chemicals that create their colors
and algae that they either live with or eat.

If you decide to "drive" your plants with more intense
lighting, (more watts/gallon, or higher "K" rating)
then you will need to supplement the tank with
nutrients necessary for their growth or they could become
stunted, weak, or die.

Frank


-->>> The Confidence of Amateurs, is the Envy of Professionals <<<--

I'm not sure it really matters all that much whether your bulbs are 6700k, 8000k or even 10000k. Coralife as mentioned has 6700k as standard for planted freshwater and AGA has 9325k standard. I think each of these bulbs will grow most plants just fine, it's all a matter of preference.

My Scapes

Well,

Thanks for the input on the ligh, folks

Anyway, here is a shot of the tank before this weeks water change. It may (or may not) be obvious, the wood and its attached moss have a serious thread algae issue. I removed a lot of it with tweezers two weeks ago, but it came right back.

Here is the tank:

Attached Image:

Tanks with Algae

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In case it didn't come out too clear, here is a close-up of the top part of the driftwood. As you can see, it is covered in threads, not to mention the snails on the right

Attached Image:

Threads

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

So, it was out with the whole piece of wood, rip off all the moss, and re-attach only a few good looking parts. This would have been needed anyway as the moss got too thick as it was anyway.

Oh, I wonder if I started this thread algae when I injected Excel right into the moss about two months back.

Have fun,

Ingo

Attached Image:

Fixed Up

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

O.K. so this tank has been up an running for over a year an now your getting thread algae. What's changed? It's lowlightish, etc.

BTW - This tank is dying for some shrimp to walk around and keep it clean, especially that java moss plateau.



My Scapes

Tetratech,

Are you still up or are you up again? This is early, man

Anyway, nothing much at all has changed in this tank ever since the complete makeover on July 4th.

BTW, this is Xmas Moss and not the cheap stuff

The moss occasionally showed problems throughout the duration of the tank, always when it reached a point where it required trimming. I remember that a couple of months back I had layers of BGA in it.

I simply think the moss got too thick and collected waist and uneaten food, as well as having a rotting layer close to the wood that didn't receive enough light anymore.

Ingo

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this is Xmas Moss and not the cheap stuff

Well, excuse me!

Yeah, I just woke up, been getting up early like 4:30 since I pulled those almost all-nighters.

Anyway like I said find yourself half dozen amanos/yamatos and everyday will be xmas for them in that moss.

Going for a quick bike ride, but I'll be back.

My Scapes

Well,

It is 4 weeks since my last entry and not too much has changes in this tank with regards to plants used and fish, except that all was going downhill a little.

I added quite a bit of duckweed to the tank a few weeks back. The purpose was to shade the tank a little so that maybe the tenellus grows taller (as I assume it is so short because of the rather strong light) and to eradicate the algae on the moss. Well, neither nor worked, but instead I created problems with my crypts:

The long and floating leaves of the hygro caused the duckweed to stay static on the left side and eventually covered the entire surface above the whole left half of the tank. This greatly limited the light to the crypts and not only did they change their color from brownish to greenish but they also started to melt.

Here is a look at that side of the tank:

Attached Image:

I Am Melting

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

On top of it, even the removal of the moss from the wood and the attempt to place only really healthy parts back onto it (a few weeks back as well) did not work out. Here is a closer look at the moss this weekend. Once can clearly see the stringy algae (staghorn, I assume) all over it. The same algae, but more bunched up, is now also in various spots anchored in the tenellus.

Also, you can see two of my platies that are a mix of the red and the yellow ones:

Attached Image:

Moss - Algae

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Luckily, I am redoing my 125 this weekend and I was able to replace the hygro with a new batch from that tank. I made sure that it is short enough not to break the surface and I also reduced the amount of duckweed.

I used tweezers to pull out as much of the algae on the moss as I can.

Have fun,

Ingo

Here is the result after the trimming and water change:

Attached Image:

This Weekend

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Well, it is official, something is out of whack in this tank, and I have no idea what it could be (except the lack of ferts, ).

This tank has maintained itself nicely until I replaced the gravel with the Eco. I assume Eco leaches some stuff, albeit minor, into the water column and that throws my pretty much non-existing fertilizer routine off.

Here is a shot of the Tenellus group:

Attached Image:

Tenellus Group

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

That doesn't look all that bad, but a closer look reveals the algae that is spreading in and between the individual plants. It seems to be mostly of the kind that also grows on the Xmas moss, but more dense (I assume this is related to the fact that it is further away from the light):

Attached Image:

Closer Look

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The moss in itself developed much more algae within the last week then it did in the two weeks before that.

Here is the whole "log" with moss and algae:

Attached Image:

Xmas Algae

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Last shot, a closer look at the most dense spot of algae in the Xmas moss.

I spent as much time as I could to manually pull out the algae strings from the moss. It is actually fun to do, but after a while my back started to hurt from the strangely bent position of looking closely from the side while pulling from the top.

Any ideas of why the tank would be so bad all of a sudden?

Ingo

Attached Image:

Darn Algae

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

That's what my 50g tank looks like. I'm attempting to make sure all my ferts are consistant, as that's the best I can do. My CO2 is up there above 30ppm so its gotta be something else. Maybe I bottomed out on nitrate or something. I'm going to try to test for stuff later today.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Sorry to hear that your new tank is as bad as this one. At least I can say for sure that this tank does not see ferts often and has no CO2, that together may explain the issues.

I hope the tenellus in the 125 is going to take off soon as I will use it to replant this tank and some of the 20.

Ingo

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So, instead of bugging you about the algae in the tank I will post 3 pictures about some of the fish in it.

Here is the sole Neon Tetra, he is alone for many months now and doing just dandy

Attached Image:

Neon Tetra

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And here is my pride, the oldest of my personal mix of Sunset and Twin Bar platies. Not that he is really all that great looking, but it is my first planned cross-breed. As you can see, he has a little red as well. Where the fully black fins come from is beyond me, but all of the fish of this breed have them. And they are of varying ages.

Attached Image:

Oldest Mix

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And here is another one of that mixed group, they make up 30% of the tank population by now.

Interestingly, none of them show distinct signes of sex and I have no clue if they are males or females or whatever.

That's it,

Ingo

Attached Image:

Another Morph

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

I'd guess that the twin bar platys come from the line of the "wag" platys that have fully black fins and tails. Whatever you xed it with must have that trait somewhere in its genetic code as well, otherwise it wouldn't show up.

and a note....these flowers are getting to me I may have to take a hiatus from the site if I don't get my danios back.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Whatever you xed it with must have that trait somewhere in its genetic code as well, otherwise it wouldn't show up.

And not only that, it seems to be a dominant gene as almost all new fry are yellowish with black fins (and sometines face). And almost all fry bearing platies in the tank are Sunsets.

these flowers are getting to me I may have to take a hiatus from the site if I don't get my danios back.

Yeah, the flowers in the background would never grow submersed.

Ingo

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Ok,

I don't have too much time, so I will cut to the chase. The hair algae was unbeatable and I had to remove all moss and all tenellus

Here is the tank after another almost major redo:

Attached Image:

Tank After Redo

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Here is a Matty-Angle look at it. As you can see, at least for the time being I have an open front.

The Tenellus is new in this tank as it has been moved from the 125G:

Attached Image:

Angle

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Here is a look from the right side of the tank, in the background you can see a little of the 125 shining through.

I hope that the tenellus will prosper as it used to when I first introduced it into this tank.

Attached Image:

Side View

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This is sooo nice. I really like this look a lot better, even though the other was nice too.

Cheers
TW

The fish for sure were not happy with my redo, as I made a mess in the tank as usual. Nevertheless, this gave me the change for a good vacuuming.

Here are the Neon and Platy saying "Are we done yet!"

Attached Image:

Fish

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Thanks Robyn,

It is nice, but rather bare.

Anyway, here is a shot of the surface from underneath. You can see the huge ripples that the HOB makes, wouldn't work for CO2 I guess.

Also, note the duckweed

Attached Image:

Surface

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Last shot is a closer look at the wood. I scrubbed it like mad in the hope to get rid of the algae. I also turned it around so I get to see the more "rooty" looking side of it that had been out of view so far.

Now I will read the kids their goodnight story and then I update the 40 and 125.

Have fun,

Ingo

Attached Image:

Wood

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It is nice, but rather bare

That's starting to be the look I like best. Height at the back & to one side, with more open space to the front or other side. Maybe more tenellus or blyxa - but as said, I like this look.

Cheers
TW

I agree this looks nice. All I want are a few little tenellus to creep up under that anubias in the front left corner and block the rhizome from sight.

Did any of the xmas moss get saved?

And please keep the ferts constant and don't kill any more tenellus

Good job/:'

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Did any of the xmas moss get saved?

That's what I tried the last time. And the result was even more algae.

I started with pulling individual strands of moss of the wood and tried to clean them from the algae. After a few branches I gave up, the moss simply has too many small branches in which the hairs get stuck

No saves.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Here is the tank after another almost major redo

Nice

A few tight groups around the DW focalpoint. Now you have a good hardscape backdrop if you decide to do a lawn in the foreground.

My Scapes

Excuse my ignorance, but what is that plant in the back right corner? How will it do in a bigger tank as a background plant? I'm looking for something to essentially act as a background and perhaps cover parts of the surface.

Nice layout, btw.

The plant in the back right is echinodorus tenellus, and will not grow tall. Any number of stem plants can be used as a background. Check out tropica and used the advanced search for background plants.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Thanks folks for the comments.

Yeah, that is tenellus, the same plant than all over the right hand side. Its growth is better than it will be in this tank as it has been raised in the high tech 125. It reached (long time ago) a height of about 8 inches in my 125, but that is rare.

Ingo

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Here is a shot of the tank from yesterday. I have to say that not even one plant in the tank seems to have grown, not even the smallest plantlngs of the tenellus.

I noticed some small holes in the hygo and believe it is a lack of potassium, so I corrected this with this weeks water change.

Here is the tank,

Have fun,

Ingo

Attached Image:

Last Night

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Looks nice, but no growth is not good. Something is amiss. Have you started up with a regular fert schedule again? If so what are you dosing/how much/how often?

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Yes, I have, Matty

I dose 1/4 tsp KNO3, 1 pinch of Phosphate, almost 1/4tsp Potassium, and the following day 8ml of micros (125 gets 30ml). All only once a week. But 3 times per week 10ml of Excel.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Hmm... that shouldn't be a problem. Maybe everything is just starting to settle in. Almost everything in there is new from another tank. Give 'em another week.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Yeah,

That's what I think I am going to do, wait a little longer to see if the growth kicks in sometime. As you may see, some of the tenellus (like way back on right side) is still having a few emersed leaves that the plant is about to shed (or melt).

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Isn't growth in a non C02 tank always very slow? Maybe too slow to even notice slight growth here & there?

You dose 8ml micros? Do I underdose my 43G then?. I add only 10ml for 43G (but I also add 4ml of iron).

Cheers
TW

"Isn't growth in a non C02 tank always very slow?" - Yes Robyn, it is.

"Maybe too slow to even notice slight growth here & there?" - Normally I would say yes, but if you have a small runner still attached to a parent tenellus and this runner has 2 1" leaves and buried small roots then I would have expected to see the change.

"Do I underdose my 43G then? I add only 10ml for 43G (but I also add 4ml of iron)." - Well, how often do you add 10ml? Once? If you would add them 3 times per week you should be fine. I add 30ml 3 times per week into the 125G, a tank about 3 times as large as yours. Also, it depends on the micro mix as not all have the same concentration.

Ingo

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A week has gone by and I still see no additional growth in the tenellus. Actually, when I compare the pictures from the last 3 weeks then it appears as if the leaves have flattened out, meaning they don't stand up as much as they used to.

On the other hand, you may notice that the central anubias is about to flower again

Ingo

Attached Image:

Tank Today

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Well, how often do you add 10ml? Once? If you would add them 3 times per week you should be fine.

Oh, I see what you mean I think maybe my 43.5 is fine, but my non C02's may be underdosed. I will ask in my logs next time about those 2 tanks.

I'm not knowledgeable enough to comment on why your tenellus seems flattened out - although to me the pic of your tank looks very nice. We will have to wait for the tenellus king, Matty, to enlighten.

Congratulations on the annubias flower (again) - but don't you feel robbed by these flowers teasing us. They are only there a day or so, then they pack up shop & go.


Cheers
TW