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Approximately 2 months ago I set up my first livebearer tank and stocked it, after cycling, with 2 baloon mollies and 5 platy fry. A few weeks ago I took my 3 ADF's from their critter keeper and added those to the tank. Last week, I bought 2 additional baloon mollies. That's 5 platy fry, 2 male mollies, 2 female mollies and 3 ADF's. I have a water softener installed in my house as we have well water. My parameters are Ammonia 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate between 5 and 10 and PH 7.6. I do weekly water changes with a gravel vac and during the week I use my battery powered Eheim gravel cleaner as the frog food makes a lot of debris, along with their shedding. Now to the problem: I lost 2 fish in 2 days with no explanation. There were no visible signs. They hovered in a corner for a short time and within 24 hours they were gone. They were the older fish, not the newly purchased ones. I started dosing with Pimafix and Jungle Anti-parasite food. This is the 3rd day of medicating. So far the fish look, and act fine. #1 Can I add a small amount of salt to the tank or will a low dose harm the frogs? #2 Could the frogs have contaminated the tank, although they look healthy and are very active. #3 Is there anything else I should be doing? I forgot to add that I'm running a small Whisper filter and a small sponge filter in the tank, and the temperature is running at 75F. I'd hate to lose any more. One more thing, the platies are going to the LFS as soon as they are big enough for sale, and will be replaced with 3 female baloon mollies. That will leave me with 5 mollies and 3 ADF's in a 10 gal. tank.I have a 10 gal fry tank in the wings. Thanks in advance for any opinions or thoughts.

Hi Caviar

I'm sorry to hear of your losses and also sorry that I don't know enough to advise you on what went wrong. I have never kept ADF's and don't know how well they go together with fish, or if salt will effect them. I'm sure someone will be able to help you.

Sorry to ask you an off topic question, but I notice you have an eheim gravel cleaner. I was thinking of buying one, but haven't been able to get on reviews on the product. How do you find it works? Does it work well? Would you recommend them?

I hope that you have no more losses.

Cheers
TW

I bought 2 additional baloon mollies. That's 5 platy fry, 2 male mollies, 2 female mollies and 3 ADF's

Am I correct in thinking they are all in the one 10g tank?
Also when you say critter tank exactly what do you mean?
I personally think you have brought something in with the ADFs but that is just a guess.

You could be very close to being fully stocked or even over stocked or just purely over contaminated by the ADFs

Those filters might be no where sufficient for that tank.

You say it is a 10g tank BUT it could be far from it with all the substrate.

Water changes what percentages?
Do you clean all the filter material in the tank water you have just taken out?
Are you adding any Bio starter at each water change?

Have a look in [link=My Profile] http://www.fishprofiles.com/forums/member.aspx?id=1935[/link] for my tank info

Look here for my
Betta 11Gal Desktop & Placidity 5ft Community Tank Photos

Keith

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TankWatcher, I like the Eheim. Like I said I use it between water changes for the 10gal., and also sometimes if I'm in a hurry, I'll use it in my 40L and then just bail the water out with a gallon ice cream tub. It's a lot faster than using the regular siphon. The Eheim comes apart for easy cleaning. I wipe it down with bleach solution after rinsing everything out and rinse it very well afterward. Keithgh, Everything is looking good in the tank now. The meds are working. When the problem first arose, I changed 50% of the water and cleaned the filter media under the faucet. I normally change 20-30% weekly. There is only 1/4" of gravel on the bottom and a small log cave with flowers attached, along with the sponge filter that sits in the back corner. That's it for "decor". The 5 platies are only 1'2" long, the 2 mollies maybe 1 1/2". The frogs an inch, if that. My parameters are good. I don't use any bio-starter. I had a Penquin 150 on the tank but it wouldn't stay running so until my new parts come I'm making do with the 2 smaller filters. I don't think I'm over-stocked since the fish are all small at the moment. The platies will be going to the LFS in a week or two. I hope I've touched on everything you asked. Any comments from ADF owners as to a small amount of salt for the livebearers? Thanks for the help.

Thanks Caviar for the low down on the battery powered Eheim gravel cleaner. I couldn't find anyone who has tried it. I don/t know about where you come from, but around here you pay around AU$200 - which is a lot when you haven't had any feedback on the product.

I'm glad to hear that the meds are working for you. Sorry, I know nothing about ADF or whether it is ok to add salt for live bearers. I have platys, but I don't add ordinary table salt. I do add Epsom salt with every water change though - 1/4 tspn for a 43.5G tank.

Good luck.

Cheers
TW

Glad I could help. I paid $59.99 US for mine at www.bigalsonline.com

Salt kills amphibians... Don't add it to the tank.

---

I'm not your neighbor, you Bakersfield trash.

Do Not add Epsom salt to a tank with every water
change.
Epsom salts can actually cause the fish to be
robbed of fluids. This should only ever be used
in cases of constipation, and only in a dip.
You should never ever keep a constant amount of epsom
salts in your tank.

Aquarium salt will kill frogs.
5 mollies and 3 adfs in a 10g tank
is quite overstocked.
Lucky they are balloon mollies and are
deformed enough to grow to only 1.5-2 inches.
Most other mollies tip the scales at 4-6 inches.

Also, for the Frogs, 75F is a really low temp.
At low temps frogs are susceptible to red leg disease,
caused by pooling of blood in extremities.
ADFS should be kept at temps of at least 78F preferable
80.

How old were the mollies you lost?


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There are only 2 balloon mollies in the tank. I lost the 2 females. Got ya. No salt. When I take the platies to the LFS next week, there will be 2 male balloon mollies and the 3 ADF's left. I turned up the heater. Thanks to all of you.

Glad I could help. I paid $59.99 US for mine at www.bigalsonline.com

For some reason, everything fish related seems be more than twice price here, for no good reason.

Hi So_Very_Sneaky,

Do Not add Epsom salt to a tank with every water change

When I set up my tank, Bensaf & the planted tank gang told me to add Epsom Salt with every water change. I have heard what you say in regards to table salt. I will ask the planted tank gang for an update on the epsom salt issue. Thanks for bringing it up.

Cheers
TW

I changed 50% of the water and cleaned the filter media under the faucet

Thank you for all that info you suplied as you can see the replies came back fast as soon as more info was given.

Here are two of my major concerns.
Washing the filter media under a tap (Faucet) will wash out practically all of the bacteria, also there would not be much bacteria in 1/4ins of gravel.
Not adding any Bio Starter in your case cause more concerns.

It looks like your tank has gone through a cycle again and possibly each time you do a water change if you do it that method.

Wash all the filtrer media in the tank water you have just taken out. Get it back into the tank in about 15 min or less. I always add 10ml of Bio starter at every water change to keep the good bacteria in its origional state.
This might not have contributed to those deaths but certainly would not have helped if the fish are stresed out from your water change. Also dont feed until the next day after the water change. I have had this explained to me many years ago and it is to do with the fish adjusting to the water change and food at the same time.

Have a look in [link=My Profile] http://www.fishprofiles.com/forums/member.aspx?id=1935[/link] for my tank info

Look here for my
Betta 11Gal Desktop & Placidity 5ft Community Tank Photos

Keith

Near enough is not good enough, therefore good enough is not near enough, and only your best will do.
I VOTE DO YOU if not WHY NOT?
VOTE NOW VOTE NOW

Good morning, Keithgh, The reason I rinsed the media under the tap was to clean as much bacterial and parasitic crap as possible out of the tank. I don't do that as a matter of course. My routine normally is to change 20-30% of the water weekly, with a gravel vac. I do rinse the media in the tank water and only rinse the filter boxes monthly. I clean the decor bi-weekly. I wipe down the front and 2 sides of the glass and leave the back until it gets too unsightly. I haven't lost my bio-filter. The parameters I originally gave were after I cleaned the tank. I have exchanged the Whisper filter with a seeded Penguin 150 from my 40 long tank. (I had a Penguin 330 and the 150 running on the larger tank) So far so good with the meds. The inhabitants are doing fine now. I'll run the med course until Friday and do a water change, replace the charcoal filter and watch closely. Thank you so much. If I'm missing something, please let me know.

If you have to add salt make sure it is aquirium salt that is what it ment for it wont hurrt the fish if they can handel any salt. Table salt has other things not ment for our fish Epsom Salt it to is ment for us.First find out if your fish can handel it look up on your computer if you have a problem plz let me no I will try to help as much as i can I go threw google.I also have a gravel cleaner it is a python it is the best no battry just hook to the fuset and go lol wouldn't be with out it

edith

Hi Edith. I can't use any salt because of the African dwarf frogs in the tank. Thanks for your response though.