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Hi guys,

I'm going off on a 3.5-week vacation next month and I need advice on what to do with my 3 planted tanks (42g, 23g, 15g). In previous life I've left a non-planted tank for both a 3-week and a monthlong vacation without any feeding whatsoever and suffered no fish loss (just hungry fish and diatom outbreak on my return). Obviously planted tanks are different. The current plan is to have my cousin drop by the house once a week to feed both fish and plants.

Background: All tanks are low-light, no CO2 addition except for Excel daily on the 23g and 15g. All tanks will have been running 5-9 months.

Here are my checklists for each tank (fish & plant stocking in my profile). Please comment whether or not they make sense, or if you forsee any problems. Thanks a lot in advance!

42g
Current: 0.8 wpg, 11 hrs/day; fully stocked fish-wise; no CO2/Excel, weekly dose of Flourish liquid (3mL) or Equilibrium (1/2 tsp); WC every 1-2 months
Checklist for each weekly visit:
- Add one tablet of Sera O-nip. This is quite a lot of food as normally I would only feed 1/2 a tablet daily to this tank. But of course this needs to last them a week. Do you think it's enough? I may also add one Hikari Algae Wafer.
- Add 1/4 tsp KNO3 (5ppm NO3), 5 mL Flourish Phosphorus (0.14ppm PO4), & 3 mL Flourish (recommended weekly amount). Normally with daily feeding I don't need to add any NO3 or PO4 (enough produced by the fish & food). But I figure with the significantly reduced feeding this addition might be necessary.
- Possibly reduce lighting period to 10hrs? But may not be necessary since it's low light anyway?

23g
Current: 1.7 wpg, 11 hrs/day; understocked; daily Excel, weekly dose of KNO3 (1/8 tsp), Flourish Phosphorus (2.5mL), Flourish (1.75mL); biweekly dose of Equilibrium (1/4 tsp), WC every 2 weeks
Checklist for each weekly visit:
- One tablet of Sera O-nip & one Hikari Algae Wafer
- Add 1/8 tsp KNO3 (5ppm NO3), 2.5 mL Flourish Phosphorus & 1.75 mL Flourish (recommended weekly amounts). Pretty much the normal weekly routine since the plant biomass is quite heavy here and not enough fish to provide required nutrients.
- Reduce lighting to 9 hrs/day. Do you think this too short?

15g
Current: 1.5 wpg, 12 hrs/day; fully stocked; daily Excel, weekly dose of Flourish Potassium (2mL = 2ppm K), Flourish (1mL), Flourish Phosphorus (1.5mL); WC every week
Checklist for each weekly visit:
- One tablet of Sera Viformo & one Hikari Sinking Wafer
- Add 1 mL Flourish & 2mL Flourish Potassium. I hesitate to add NO3 & PO4 here because it is a small tank and even with weekly 50% water change, the NO3 stays around 10ppm & PO4 1ppm.
- Reduce lighting to 10 hrs/day (or 9?)

One last question: should I have Excel added to the tank weekly as well?

BTW, I'll be visiting Indonesia (home), Singapore, Taiwan, & Hong Kong during the vacation and I'm hoping to check out the tropical fish & planted tank scene in each location (even though I won't be able to bring any live things back). In particular, this place.

Thanks again!

Last edited by upikabu at 28-Nov-2005 01:52

-P

upikabu,

I envy you for all the nice places that you are going to visit .

I don’t envy you for all the tank decisions you have to make upfront. This is about the only time that I am glad I only have 10 days vacation per year.

I can only comment on the light reduction and fert routine. If your fish have survived previous stints like this then they should be able to survive on little food now as well.

Well – here is what I think about the light:

The purpose of the reduction is to keep the fish less active and as such having their metabolism slow down and needing less food. The long light is to keep the plants growing. I would say that you should reduce the lights to the point where your plants can still maintain their health, growth during your absence is not important. If your plants are healthy now and show good growth then a reduction by a few hour per day should be appropriate.

Some ferts are better than no ferts, at least that is my opinion. I would avoid putting heavy doses in the tank on a weekly base to avoid pushing the nitrates and phosphorus over the edge (you mention adding a rather high rate of phosphorus to the first tank).

Overall, I think it comes down to what is more important (and more expensive) to you – plants or fish. Let’s say it would be fish then I would say to make your light period shorter. If it’s plants than keep it a little longer. Or, if equally important, try to find the golden middle .

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Thanks a lot, Ingo. We can always rely on you to give your opinion (which is a good thing!). I realized that my post is overly long and too detailed that most people would probably just hit the Back button quickly once they see all the numbers.

My main concern with reduced lighting period (say 9 hrs instead of the usual 10-12 hrs) is giving algae a chance to gain a foothold at the expense of plant growth. I'm not sure if that's a valid concern or not. I remember Bensaf recommended reducing the light intensity (to less than 2wpg) so that the plants would be in sort of like a suspended animation state (cue 60s disco music ). But I wonder whether lighting duration is as important in terms of plant vs algae growth. Too bad he's not around anymore as he'd be the most experienced with leaving planted tanks on long vacations.

I don't mind if I get diatoms (usually what happens if you have low light environment) because I have otos in each tank and they would be well fed in that case. But not sure about other kinds of algae, whether or not they would thrive under the reduced light duration.

Thanks for mentioning the ferts dosage. Now that I think about it, since I would be doing a water change and adding the regular amounts of ferts into each tank right before I leave, I think it's probably better to add the ferts 2 weeks after I leave. That way my cousin only has to add ferts once, which should simplify things for him (and me) and lessen the chance of an overdose.

Thanks again! I'll take some pictures during the vacation and maybe even try to hunt Bensaf down in Jakarta (if he's still there).

-P

I think you must have a very trustworthy and reliable cousin.

First I would write a check list out for each tank, and get your cousin to go through it with you watching not to check to see if is being done correctly but a double check to see if all of your instructions are clear and accurate.

Also I would prefer twice a week.

When I go away I leave a complete "What to do list" with the wife (I also ring every night if possible) I also have over 50Lt of prepared water. She takes out two liters every morning and does a top up. In all my fishing trips I have never lost a fish. The pay off is usually a weekend away shoping spree for her.

I hope this helps you. Have a good safe holiday.

Have a look in [link=My Profile]http://
www.fishprofiles.com/interactive/forums/profile.asp?userid=6741" style="COLOR: #00FF00[/link] for my tank info

[link=Betta 11Gal Desktop & Placidity 5ft Community Tanks]http://photobucket.com/albums/b209/keithgh/Betta%20desktop%20tank/" style="COLOR: #00FF00[/link]

Keith

Near enough is not good enough, therefore good enough is not near enough, and only your best will do.
I VOTE DO YOU if not WHY NOT?
VOTE NOW VOTE NOW

Thanks, Keith!

I'm not so sure about "reliability" yet as he is only 21 and does not keep fish. That's the main reason I'm only going to have him use the tablet food (vs. flakes). I think adding one tablet to each tank would be much easier to remember than a teaspoon here, half a teaspoon there, etc. The ferts I will put in small containers already pre-measured. All he needs to do is dump the contents in.

I will also definitely write out a complete to-do list and stick it on each tank as you suggested. I thought about leaving a bucket of prepared water in case of emergency but I think it might be too much for him to handle.

-P

maybe even try to hunt Bensaf down in Jakarta (if he's still there).

Still here, no need to bring the hunting gear i'll give you my handphone no.

I'll drop you a PM tomorrow with the addresses you wanted too.

I should say I've managed to screw up every time I go on vacation.So I'll try to learn from my mistakes. The trick is to keep growing ok to keep the algae away, but not such good growth that it's overgrown halfway thru your vacation and blocking light hence stalling growth and allowing the algae.

Actually you're not too bad, moderate lit non co2 tanks have an advantage in that they are more stable.

The once a week dosing by your cousin (pre-measuring them is a great idea)should be just fine. A big heavy dose before you leave is NOT a good idea.

Lowering the duration will only help algae, intensity is more important. But your tank aren't too brightly lit so not much of an issue. I'd leave them on for about 10 hours. 1-2 WPG fine - don't go over that.You want to keep things ticking over but not growing too fast or worse stalled.

The biggest tip - give all the stem plants a real hard trim so they have plenty of growing room. Imagine wat your tank would look like if you didn't trim for 4 weeks, that think of that with no light getting through and a mess of algae - that's what you could come back to. Hopefully with a good trim they may not crowd out the surface and block the light.

I'm guessing like me you wouldn't trust anybody near your tank with a pair of scissors

---

Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

Bensaf,

So glad I won't have to hire anyone to track you down in Cikarang. Hopefully we can meet up in Jkt. I normally don't drink beer, but for you I'd make an exception.

Thanks a lot for your tips. The one good thing with my low-tech tanks is that even normally fast-growing stem plants like polysperma takes a good 2 weeks or more to reach the surface (and that's in the tanks with daily Excel addition). Nevertheless I'll make sure to trim them halfway before I leave as you suggested.

Someone in APC actually suggested reducing the photoperiod down to 6-7 hours(!) and maxing on nutrient levels before I leave (e.g. 20ppm NO3, 3ppm PO4, extra traces). But your suggestion of leaving the lights on for 10hrs and keeping the ferts steady actually make more sense to me though (no disrespect to him) given my lighting and the way my plants are growing.

I definitely do not trust anyone to stick his/her hand in my tank, let alone with a pair of scissors.

Cheers mate!

-P

I normally don't drink beer

Good God, man, why ever not ?

Es Teh all round then !

I tried the putting in a big dose before, doesn't work. I've done this vacation thing a few times. Always the biggest problem occurs when the plants hit the suface and spread blocking the light to below. That causes all the issues IME. The lack of light below causes bottom leaves to drop off and stems to rot. You come back to a lot of rotting vegetation and yellow water , and in one case an angelfish trapped in overgrown vegetation. Never had a serious algae problem though.

It's hard to leave a tank for 3-4 weeks and not have some issues when you return, but it can usually be fixed with a good clean up and getting the tank stable again. Even algae can be knocked out in week or two. It can be quite a confidence builder actually, when you see how easy it is to get a messed up tank back on track. Takes away a lot of the algae fear. You learn you can beat into submission.

---

Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

Have a good trip! Sounds like it will be a busy one! Wish I was going, that spot you posted looks really neat! Post lots of pics when you get back for those of us locked to our continents!
I went to my parents for a week and when I got home the filter had stopped running! Luckily nobody died, the plants kept oxygen in the tank. They seemed to do really well as well. And I didn't even have to buy a new filter, just gave it a real good scrub and it was as good as new!

"If you're afraid you'll make a mistake, you won't make anything."
-Family Circus

Good God, man, why ever not?

Dunno, never really acquired a taste for it I guess. Actually I didn't mind some of the pub beers that I had when I was living in Austria. You never see those in a bottle though. Still much prefer Es Teh anyday though.

Even algae can be knocked out in week or two. It can be quite a confidence builder actually, when you see how easy it is to get a messed up tank back on track.

Easy for you to say - I don't have that confidence, yet. Maybe in a year or two if I'm lucky.

-P

Thanks, luvmykrib! If your experience is not a walking ad for planted tanks, I don't know what is! That's awesome how nature took care of itself.

Last edited by upikabu at 29-Nov-2005 22:28

-P

Hi,
They actually have converted small motor driven pumps
to provide doses of nutrients to tanks automatically.
They are adapted from IV therapy pumps and modified for
the aquarium trade. You simply mix up a batch and have
the pump add a predetermined dose every so many hours
apart. Problem solved.

This is a picture of one model:
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/NavResults.cfm?N=2004+113592

Reef folks have been using pumps like this for years to
provide a continuous supply of Calcium to their reefs
as well as other additives.

Frank


Last edited by FRANK at 30-Nov-2005 00:28

-->>> The Confidence of Amateurs, is the Envy of Professionals <<<--

Hi Frank,

I've seen the Eheim brand liquid doser on sale here; they're quite expensive (around A$150) and I have to buy 3 of them (could get me a nice CO2 setup instead ). But I just have this hangup about using automatic feeders/dosers in general - too many things could go wrong with them. Then again I only keep small fishes so they don't need a lot of food to begin with. The other concern I have with a liquid doser is having to mix all the ferts in one container to start. I thought one shouldn't mix phosphate with iron containing fertilizer as the phosphate will cause the iron to precipitate out. Maybe it's not a problem if it's diluted enough.

Thanks for your input though! Interesting to hear what the Dark Side people do.

Last edited by upikabu at 30-Nov-2005 00:48

-P

upikabu,

I don&#8217;t know if it has been mentioned yet (I didn&#8217;t see it) and it is such a banal thing that it might not be necessary to mention at all, but I will do it anyways as I don&#8217;t want to hear &#8220;why didn&#8217;t you tell me that&#8221; when you come back:

Prepare a bucket of water for your cousin to top off the tanks.

I thought I mention it just in case .

Ingo

Last edited by LITTLE_FISH at 30-Nov-2005 04:20

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Hi Ingo,

Actually, that was briefly mentioned in my reply to Keith. But now that you mention it, I should really do it hey (how's that for obedience! ). Could be handy in case of emergency anyway.

Thanks!

-P

Ah, silly me,

I interpreted that "bucket of water entry" as emergency water only. Didn't occur to me that it could be used to fill up the tanks as well . I am so narrow minded .

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club