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So what is the next phase after you get the great stuff down? Do you need to put stuff on over it? It is safe for the criters?

55G Planted tank thread
19G Container Pond
[IMG]http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y118/Wingsdlc/Ric

matt;
definately use gloves... great stuff does not come off your hands. also, i know it's expanding foam, but its crazy just how much it does expand. don't underestimate it.

thumbnails are more difficult in that 1:their mouths are smaller. not a big deal since they can still eat ff's and pinheads. 2:they can squeeze through smaller spaces. if you build your viv carefully you shouldn't have any problems. 3: breeding presents more challenges than regular darts: i think this is why most frogs get an "advanced" label. but if tadpole rearing is only of secondary interest anyway than this shouldn't dissuade you.

Yep, the next phase will be to silicone the great stuff and put the coco fiber on top of that. It'll appear a more natural background and I'll have some nooks for plants and some ledges and things like that. The great stuff is safe for the frogs.

I ended up getting my driftwood and a bunch of rocks yesterday, so I'll be posting some pics with the wood in several locations, because I can't really decide how I like it.

Thanks Nate, I guess I need to go get some gloves now . Everyone always says to use gloves for the silicone, but that's cause it can be irritating. I never use gloves for that, but if the great stuff won't come off, that's a different story. And thanks for the thumbnail info, I'll maybe consider them now. I'm going to silicone the hood 3/4 of the way around, and make sure the the last quarter fits tightly. Oh, and I decided to use Lexan instead, and brace it so it won't warp.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Ok, I tried to move around the driftwood in about 4 different positions, and I have pics from the front and above. Lemme know what you think is best, and if you think there's an even better position for it. I'm a bit paranoid about this because it becomes more permanent than if I were to be putting it in a fish tank.

Position 1 front and from above:



Position 2:



Position 3:



Position 4:



I kinda like 1, 2, and 4 because they allow a place for the frog to get out of the water, and 3 because of the general look of it.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Well Matty,

If it is between 1,2, and 4, then I would say 1.

My favorite was actually 3, but that is only because it devides the tank in the nices, diagonal way.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

3 isn't ruled out, I'd just have to build up a couple other escapes with rocks or something, that's all. IMO I'd like to turn 3 around mirror image style. Have the low side on the left with the hill and the high side over with the waterfall.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

I kinda like 1, 2, and 4 because they allow a place for the frog to get out of the water

I guess that's kinda important to the frog. I think any of your views would do well. Out of choices 1, 2 & 4, then I would choose 1, I think.

Why don't you give us a shot of no. 3 turned around mirror image style? Do you have the rocks yet, that you could build the other water escapes for your froggy friends?

Cheers
TW

Yep I have a bunch of rocks, so don't worry about that. I shouldn't have said anything, just let everybody decide what they thought looked the best.

I found another configuration I kind of like, so I'll post that up too, but later tonight.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

I like 1 and 2 myself

><>

I also like the first position best.
I've been thinking of a viv soon to so this will be interesting.

-Vincent

I guess it will be the best to wait with the final decision until the Viv. has more of a context. If I were you then I would lay out a few favorite options and once it is time for setup I would pick one on the fly. In the end, nothing is permanent anyway, or will you glue the wood in place?

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

The wood is very much permanent once I complete the next step, unless I decide to rip out all of the great stuff, which probably won't happen. For this step I'm going to position the driftwood how I like it, probably some rocks and stuff as well in certain places and cover the back, front ledge, waterfall, and the little hill on the left with great stuff. This stuff expands to fit into every nook and tends to hold onto things very well. I'm actually kinda nervous about messing this part up.

Also yesterday I bought the Eco earth, which is the coco fiber bedding, and a hygrometer.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

My vote goes for no. 1, although, as said, it's tough without knowing how you plan to do the rest of the viv. Also, where did you get your hygrometer? How much was it?

Did you useno-see-um to cover the egg-crate?

I got my hygrometer from the Fish Place reptile store. It was $8 without the discount. I only get %15 on the hardgoods there though.

I was basically going to do the rest of the viv around the DW and the hill and waterfall I have set up already. I figured those are the major points of interest and everything else was minor.....no?

The screening I used was left over from my planted tank project. The holes aren't quite as small as the noseeum stuff, but I didn't figure they had to be.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Hi,
I missed something... What's the hydrometer for?
Why would you want to know the specific gravity of the
water?

Frank

AHHHH hyGOmeter!

-->>> The Confidence of Amateurs, is the Envy of Professionals <<<--

Frank,

I believe he said hygrometer - which if I remember correctlly measures humidity levels.

Jim

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Water, taken in moderation, cannot hurt anybody. -- Mark Twain

Frank, you really need to get your glasses upgraded

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Maybe this will help a bit. I think this is about how I like it. The water I'll try to get to flow under the DW branch and down the rock.

Oh yeah, and there's a little rock that I placed that will form a cave after I use the great stuff. It's hiding behind the driftwood.





Yep that's hygrometer, the humidity needs to be between 90-100 percent, so it's pretty critical to get one.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Looks good Matty. Will the froggy be able to climb up the driftwood. It might be the angle of the shot, but it looks kind of steep. But they have their stickly little feet to help, don't they? (Sorry for ignorance when it comes to frogs - I expect I'll have to say that a lot in this log )

Cheers
TW

They can climb up trees so I don't think that incline will be an obsticle.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

I like that setup very much. It's hard to visualize without the expand-o-foam and coco matting in there yet, but I like the placement of the hardscape very much.
Are you worried that the tank might look too small when it's all finished and you have all kinds of broad-leaved plants in there?

Hoping that there must be a word for everything I mean...

Well when it came down to doing business, I found out that I needed to do the waterfall first, completely because once I get the DW in the way I like it it will be impossible for me to get in and silicone the waterfall. So I got the waterfall great stuffed and here are the pics:







As you can see the setup is for the most part, permanent. I won't be taking the pump out for cleaning. I'll be putting a bit of filter floss at the intake and clean that instead. The rock I had to make removeable so I could at least do that much maint on the pump. So there are a couple gaps that I may fill in with a little more great stuff, but overall I'm pretty satisfied with my first attempt with this stuff.

Now I need to silicone it, and throw on the gravel/coco fiber around the sides. I'm thinking of leaving the waterway black silicone. So it will be black in the center, a bit of gravel outside that, then coco fiber down the side.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

I like that setup very much. It's hard to visualize without the expand-o-foam and coco matting in there yet, but I like the placement of the hardscape very much.
Are you worried that the tank might look too small when it's all finished and you have all kinds of broad-leaved plants in there?

Thank you for your comments illustrae. I'm having the same visualization problems, so I'm just kind of hoping it will look good.

Well, the tank is a 10g. So IMO it's going to look small whatever I do. But there are a few things I can do to make it look a bit bigger. I can chose smaller plants, which I will try to do, and maybe a smaller frog. I'm not too sure as I really like the azureus, so I probably won't get any smaller ones. So it's mainly the plants I can play with. Small ferns, mosses, anubias nana. Those will be around the water, and I'll probably try to find some smaller epiphytes for the background. Maybe one small bromiliad. In the end I'm hoping all my hard work on the background will be mostly invisible.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

My first thought when I saw the pictures was "hey, where did the front panel of the tank go?" Only then did I realize that the tank is lying on its side Silly me

Anyway - I guess you did not only affix it so that you can do maintenance on the pump, but also that you are able to completely remove it, in case it breaks and needs replacement. I mean the wire is not fixed, right?

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Nope, I'm not going to be removing the pump any time soon. The wire is fixed in there, for asthetic reasons. These are pretty reliable pumps, and I've already run it for a while to make sure it works. Like I said the only thing I'll be able to do is change the mechanical filter type media I put around the pump. Otherwise it's stuck there. I have my fingers crossed that it will work for quite some time.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

I've already run it for a while to make sure it works

So - if I go ahead and have a light bulb on for a few days to see if it works, and it actually does, this would mean it will work for a long time to come. Right?

Very risky Matty, but - of course - this is only my opinion, but you knew that anyway,

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

So - if I go ahead and have a light bulb on for a few days to see if it works, and it actually does, this would mean it will work for a long time to come. Right?

Nope, all you know is it works. Then you have to cross your fingers and hope that it continues to work. You can also buy one of those fancy screw in compact fluorecent bulbs which are known to last longer. So what's a light bulb got to do with my waterfall.

I tested it to make sure it works out of the box. 90% of returns happen when things just don't work out of the box. Shipping damages or faulty craftmanship or something. Then 9.8% is misuse. These are all just theoretical numbers based on working at a LFS for a couple years, also these don't include rio pumps which just catch fire and/or fail for no particular reason 50% of the time(hence my analogy to the screw in PC that lasts longer ). If a pump fails that wasn't misused or not just opened it's usually an old filter and just needs a new impellar or something simple. I've only seen a couple people bring something in that just stopped working after a couple months that didn't show signs of obvious abuse. You're right it's risky, but if I had these odds at a race track, I'd bet the farm. I'm willing to ride on those odds for the sake of asthetics. If it somes down to it, I can cut out the pump with a little work and tempororily house the frog in a plastic shoe box for a couple days. It's easier to whip up a temp frog house than a temp fish house(you know the whole deficating in the same substance you breath thing).

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Well I got a lot of work done on this thing last night. I got almost all of the great stuff work done. It looks pretty good so far and I even have the startings of a ledge. That's all I need to finish today, as I had to do it in layers. There's some parts I need to rip out a bit of because I put down a bit too much stuff. But on to the pictures...There's lots.

The waterfall after siliconing(note how awesomely that rock fits in place ) :


A couple minutes after the great stuff was laid down:



After it set for an hour or so:


With a second layer for the ledge:


What it looks like as of now:


So after the last little layer on the ledge, I'll silicone little sections at a time and mash the coco fiber into it. Then lay a bit of a mixed substrate down on the false bottom. So I had to get that ready for today.

The brick of coco fiber(eco friendly):


In a 2.5g bucket of water for expansion:


3/4 full 2.5g bucket:


Little baking to dry out for use today:

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Hmmmmm, Brownies

Looks delicious Matty

Anyway - very interesting, I have to say that with each new picture I have been tilting my head in all kins of directions just to try to see how it would look upright.

I have to make you a major compliment. Your vision of things to be is fantastic. I would not have been able to pull this off. Right now it looks like a major construction zone, but I am sure once it is completed one will not see anything from this stage anymore

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Hi
Absolutely fascinating to watch this go from idea to
fact.
I'll bet that drying session made the house
smell - well, "funny."
Frank

-->>> The Confidence of Amateurs, is the Envy of Professionals <<<--

Very interesting process to watch. Keen to watch the next step.

Cheers
TW

I have to make you a major compliment. Your vision of things to be is fantastic. I would not have been able to pull this off. Right now it looks like a major construction zone, but I am sure once it is completed one will not see anything from this stage anymore

Thanks Ingo, I hope we don't see any great stuff or anything else from the build.

Frank...There was a bit of smell, but I thought it smelled pretty fresh, nice actually. No complaints from the lady friend.

Thanks Robyn, the next step is already in progress, and I have more than half of the background covered. I want to finish it up tonight after work...but who knows.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

hey matty, do you know if the great stuff is toxic to fish? or do you have to cover it up with silicone?

-Vincent

I'm not sure if it could be used or not Bud. Unless someone states otherwise, I'd use it with caution. It probably would be ok covered in silicone, or marine epoxy or something like that, but I wouldn't try it out on my prize discus first if you know what I mean.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

I found some pet moss at Letchworth St. Pk. whilst on a feild trip for sedimentary geology class. I have it temporarily on my fish tank for constant temp, and a bit of light from a daylight pc bulb. It's in a tupperware with some of the eco earth(coco fiber) under it. Will keep moist until the viv is done....which seems to keep getting pushed back due to school and work.

Attached Image:

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Nice looking moss Matty but I don't think you are soposed to take things in or out of state/national parks. Maybe state parks are alright. When I was in TN for my honey moon I saw all sorts of neat mosses growing on water falls that I was very tempted to take home with me. There were signs everywhere saying to not mess with the plant life though.

Things are starting to look pretty neat. I can't wait to see the next steps.

BTW: some of your pictures really mess with my eyes! Takes me a little while to things figured out.

55G Planted tank thread
19G Container Pond
[IMG]http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y118/Wingsdlc/Ric

I didn't see any signs about plants so I figured it was alright. The only thing they didn't want us to do was litter and feed the wildlife from what I read on the signs. Oh they also thought that climbing the slippery shale gorge was a bad idea. I agreed.

BTW: some of your pictures really mess with my eyes! Takes me a little while to things figured out.

I'm sorry. The only directions I take pics from are from the top looking down, and from the front I think. I have to take them at some funny angles because of how I'm currently working on them at the time. For the most part the tank is on it's back so that the coco fiber can set into the silicone, or so the great stuff doesn't set funny.

So here's a couple shots from my feildtrip and one pic of some of the coco fiber setting into the siliconed background.







And for an explanation so you guys don't have to strain your thinkers so hard...This one is of the tank lying on it's back and I am taking the pic through the top opening. You can kind of make out the ledge which connects from the high part of the false bottom to the driftwood.

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Nice shots Matty!

Thanks for the discription of what we are looking at!

55G Planted tank thread
19G Container Pond
[IMG]http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y118/Wingsdlc/Ric

Thanks Wings.

Well I managed to get the rest of the great stuff siliconed and coco fibered. Hopefully I wont need to do any patching cause I ran out of silicone. That's two whole bottles of silicone in that 10G tank. I never thought I'd use that much. Anywho, I'll give it a couple days to cure before I give the tank a wet run. Can't wait!

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Critical Fertilator: The Micromanager of Macronutrients

Hi,
Isn't it a terrific place? So filled with history.
When we used to go on field trips, we would camp out with
sleeping bags and tents. Hot dogs/burgers and... Beer!

Going in the fall allows most of the plant cover to be
gone and allows you to study the strata... But, it can
be cold, snowy, and rainy all in the same trip.

Have fun in Sedimentology, that is where I hung my hat.

Frank


-->>> The Confidence of Amateurs, is the Envy of Professionals <<<--