FishProfiles.com Message Forums

Hello

Yesterday I set up a Dupla pressurised C02 system, trialling a bubble rate of 2bps. Seemed as a good a time as any to set up a log, to keep a record for myself. If anyone has the time to give me some tips every now & then, that will be great.

My ferts are:-
KH2P04 1/8th Tspn x 3 times a week
KN03 1/2 Tspn x 3 times a week
Traces 10ml x 3 times a week

My lights are 2 x 10000K 25W(white) plus 1 x 15,000K 20W Tri Power Light (pink/purple). Someone told me this makes my light levels a little low, but it's not in my budget to upgrade them at the moment. (Next expense will be a solenoid).

pH tonight tested at 7.36 & KH tested at 6. Punched this into www.csd.net/~cgadd/aqua/art_plant_co2chart.htm & came up with the answer 7.857ppm. I think I should be aiming for a min. of 10ppm, at least. I think these tests will be off though. LFS yesterday told me if I'm running C02, my KH should be above 5. As mine is consistently 3, he sold me a product which I used to raise it. Now remember Bensaf telling me I shouldn't touch my KH. Not only that, I'd been using a pH down product. The calculator link all tell me this mucks up the results. I don't know how long it will take for the products to work their way out of the tank, but Wednesday will be 50% waterchange, so that should help.

Over the last few weeks, I've been seeing increased algae in my tank. On the glass & some green colour on rocks & brown spots to leaves.

That will do for now.

Cheers
TW

If anyone has the time to give me some tips every now & then, that will be great

Will do Robyn

And welcome to the log world. You will of course have to provide us with loads of pictures, that makes the logs so much more interesting for the normal hobbyist.

First advice: if you can then shoot for at least 20ppm of CO2.

Second advice: check your ferts schedule again, my instincts (which may be off anyway) say that 1/8 tsp of P is too much compared to 1/2tsp of N. Eithe rone should be lowered or the other one upped.

Third advice: Yeah, water changes will help getting rid of your ph altering additive.

Enough for now, I wanna see pictures

Ingo

---

Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Hi TankWatcher, hence forth known as TW

Your kh of 3 is fine, that's about the same as mine. You just don't want it to be 1 as that could lead to ph crashes etc. And ph products are more trouble than they're worth. Ditch it and use what you've got.

For CO2 shoot for 20-30ppm and hold it steady. Messing with CO2 levels - I can attest from personal experience - will hurt you big time. Get them high and stable.

The brown spots are normal at this stage. Just scrape them off, eventually they'll disappear on their own.

Enough for now, I wanna see pictures

Damn straight!

---

Back in the saddle!

Hi Ingo & NowherMan6

First advice: if you can then shoot for at least 20ppm of CO2

Will try to get that level. I'd like my pH to be around 6.8 and my water is usually 3KH when not played around with. If I can get C02 to bring my pH to 6.8 and punch the details in here [link] www.csd.net/~cgadd/aqua/art_plant_co2chart.htm[/link] it gives the no. 14 (in the green colour, which says its good C02 level.) So does that mean 14ppm. If so, that's still below what you recommend. Unless I do raise the KH or drop my pH further, how do I get it higher?

check your ferts schedule again, my instincts (which may be off anyway) say that 1/8 tsp of P is too much compared to 1/2tsp of N. Either one should be lowered or the other one upped.

Back in a thread started in February, I was given this fert schedule. I don't understand enough to change it myself, so which do you suggest I alter (which one up, or down).

The brown spots are normal at this stage. Just scrape them off, eventually they'll disappear on their own.

I can do this on the glass, but I've always had trouble with my stem plants uplifting. Whenever I touch them (to pick up a melted leaf etc) they are just as likely to float to the top of the tank. I'm sure if I tried scraping the leaves, that would happen. Hope C02 makes them grow better, so they become more stable so I can.

Enough for now, I wanna see pictures

After water change (when I'll also clean the algae off the front of the tank) I'll take a pic. Don't expect anything that looks like your tanks, though. A lot of my plants aren't doing that well & I'm not naturally creative either - nevertheless pics will come.

Did a pH test this morning, with the C02 running all night without lights. pH remained at 7.36. So I guess that means tonight I need to increase my bubble count, if I want pH to drop. I should do that gradually though, I think so as not to stress my fishies. Thanks for input.

Cheers
TW

If I'm not mistaken you only planted recently, right? If so, give the plants a few weeks to settle in. New plants will often shed their old growth before coming in with new healthy growth.

---

Back in the saddle!

Major plant took place in February. Some have already been replaced since then though, due to all the leaves falling off & leaving me with only bare stems. Tank looks pretty bad, with lots of brown on leaves, & melting leaves.

check your ferts schedule again, my instincts (which may be off anyway) say that 1/8 tsp of P is too much compared to 1/2tsp of N. Either one should be lowered or the other one upped.

Tonight is my night for dosing the ferts, so if can you pls tell me what the right ratio of P to N is, so that I can do it right tonight.

Thanks

Cheers
TW

Robyn,

Unless I do raise the KH or drop my pH further, how do I get it higher?

Lowering the ph is done with increasing the bubble count (you knew that), raising the KH without chemicals is done with Baking Soda. If you have some handy then go ahead and add one tsp tonight and test tomorrow what your KH is.

so if can you pls tell me what the right ratio of P to N is

The ratio P/N is 1/10 ppm, so 1ppm of P for each 10ppm of N. Aim for a max of N with 20ppm (by the end of the week, just before water change).

I'm not naturally creative either

Hey, that is what we are here for. Without the gang here I probably would have a giant castle in my big tank (well, maybe not).

but I've always had trouble with my stem plants uplifting

Are these healthy stems, and what plants? Do they have any roots developed? They just may not be deep enough in the substrate when planted, how do you plant them?

Ingo

---

Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Is this fert schedule better?

KH2P04 1/16th Tspn x 3 times a week
KN03 1/2 Tspn x 3 times a week
Traces 10ml x 3 times a week

I'm going to target a pH of 6.8 and with my natural KH of 3, that will put me in the "green Good C02 levels" of the C02 calculator grid. Even though I'm increasing my bubble rate, my pH wasn't moving down much yet. But I just discovered that part of the filter box was pinching down on the C02 tube, so I don't think it was going in the tank properly. pH now quickly dropped down to 7.03 (yesterday 7.36). Every time I test it, it is dropping lower. How much is it safe to drop a day? Is this too much, too quick?

Without the gang here I probably would have a giant castle in my big tank

I came close to buying one of the of those broken in half shipwrecks when I bought my tank. Changed my mind to plants instead.

My stems don't appear to develop roots. A few here and there have. They are the ones that don't lift, but the majority, no roots and lift easily. I don't think they really ever started growing properly. When I plant them, I poke a hole in my gravel with my finger as far as I can. Then quickly put the stem in the hole, before the gravel caves back in. I try to put it in deep. I'll try harder.


Cheers
TW

Robyn,

Is this too much, too quick?

No, just think about it how you acclimate fish from the LFS. They go through some potential major ph changes within a max of 2 hours. If your ph would drop from 7.3 to 6.8 in a day that would be just fine (IMHO).

About the stems - what are the plants that don't root (may be a light issue)? A trick to "anchor" stems is be sticking them into the substrate at an angel, like 45degrees. This way, the weight of the substrate on top of the stem will help to keep it down. Are these stems that float up rotting at the base?

Ingo

---

Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

The buffers will mess up the readings.

To overcome this another way of checking Co2 is as follows:
Take a cup full of tank water and test the pH then let it sit for 24hrs and test again. The Co2 will have evaporated by then. The pH will be higher. By comparing the the 2 readings you can tell how much Co2 is in the tank. A increase of 1 pH is equal to 30ppm of Co2.

Note:Take the water testing after the Co2 has been on for a few hours.

---

Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

About your ferts.....

I have a 40G so we are in about the same ball park. What you just changed to with 1/2 tsp of Pot. N. and 1/16 Pot. P. is what I have been running in my tank for the past few weeks. The only major difference is lighting. I have 3.25 WPG and you are only at 1.63WPG. What I am trying to get at is your plants might not need as much because they are not going to grow as fast with the lower light but someone might correct me on this one.

where da pics?

55G Planted tank thread
19G Container Pond
[IMG]http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y118/Wingsdlc/Ric

I tested my pH periodically through the night & each time it kept dropping. By the time I left for work it was at the target of 6.8. Nervous about it dropping further while not home to monitor, so turned down C02 before I left for work.

Stem plants I have problems with are:- Red Ludwigia, Baby tears, Magenta (thats all LFS knew to call it), and another very common one (forgot the name, com??? or cob??? or similar)

When I first buy them, usually no roots. After planting - they lift, the end is sometimes mush, so I cut that off & replant. I will try your angle planting tip Ingo.

If my lights are a problem, I could price what the replacements would be. If I go looking, what wattage & colour are best?. Could maybe replace each tube gradually.

Bensaf, I know the buffers are a problem. The pH buffer was in the tank as my pH is usually too high for my rasboras and I didn't know I was going to get C02 that day. It just sort of happened (YEAH). LFS told me I needed to raise KH for the C02, so I did. Remembered your advice about not altering my KH after I put the stuff in. 50% water change this afternoon should help reduce the chemicals. In the meantime I have some tank water sitting in a cup to test pH in 24hrs.

where da pics?

I was holding off on the pics until after water change, when I'll also do a little tank tidy up at the same time. But here is a pic of when the plants first went in. The plants look worse now & some dead ones have been removed & some others (at the back) have been moved elsewhere.

Worse pics will come later, showing the algae & my sad plants.


Attached Image:


Cheers
TW

Its more than ok to show the bad pictures too. Start looking through some of the logs. Tanks can become a mess at times. Its the process that counts! Luck with everything!

Lighting....Normally 6,700K is best. 2.5 to 3 wpg would get you some sweet growth. One step at a time though. Stay within your $$ limits. There are plants out there that you can work with that are nice.

55G Planted tank thread
19G Container Pond
[IMG]http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y118/Wingsdlc/Ric

Robyn, the tank loks very nice. Good job

KH is fine at 3 absolutely no need to go higher.

Glad the pH has come down. But you have to hold your ground on the bubble rate you get keep turning it up and down. Stability is very very important to prevent algae.

Try to get it right at a time when you are there for a few hours and can monitor the pH. When the gas rate gets you to the pH you need leave it there. Try not to adjust the needle valve again unless you absolutely have to.

---

Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

Robyn,

The "before" picture is awesome .

Seems like a nice full tank, now we need to see the after picture. I am clearly stearing towards low light .

Guess we should have warned you about the cost of the planted tank thing. Simply switching bulbs would most likely not make much of a difference, I smell Compact Flourescent.

Or you follow the other path, adjust your plant selection to fit your existing light. But this for sure would raise the question why you got all the CO2 and stuff.

About the ph: If I read that right then you measured at night or early morning when the ph was at 6.8, right? And I also assume you followed Bensaf's advice of keeping the CO2 on 24/7 right? Naturally, your CO2 would be the highest in this scenario just when the lights go on as during the night you add CO2 and the plants produce some themselves.

Ingo

---

Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

I've done my water change & tidied up a bit in there, so I've got quite a few shots of different angles to share, so here we go. This will take several posts, 'cause I don't know how to make them all show up in the one post.

Here is the full frontal view. In the pic of the tank I posted earlier today (the one just after planting), the Blue Stricta (the one in the rear left corner) was just big enough to cover the filter. It's probably my best growing plant & was getting too tall, so last week I pulled it out & cut some off the stem & replanted. I cut it too short, so I have an ugly view there where you can see the filter. I hope it won't take too long for it to grow & cover it again.

In the top right hand corner, you can see a little breeder, where I have some mollie fry (from my supposedly solitary male mollie)

Attached Image:

Full Frontal

Cheers
TW

Another pic. Ugh - there's that yucky filter

Attached Image:

Left Side Close Up Shot

Cheers
TW

Here's one of my rock tunnels I like to see my fish swim through

Attached Image:

Rock tunnel

Cheers
TW

Middle shot, with a low rock tunnel. I need some more jave moss on the right hand side of the rock.

Attached Image:

Middle View

Cheers
TW

Last one.

Attached Image:

Right Hand View

Cheers
TW