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Here's a update. Pic attached is Day 15.

Bensaf
The plants really are growing great, thanks for all the advice. One thing you neglected to tell me is I would have to take the plants out of the water to see them.






tetratech attached this image:


My Scapes

Oh, here's another pic. Let's call it willow wisteria. Actually my tank is go green it looks like green tea with a bamboo straw.



tetratech attached this image:


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The plants really are growing great, thanks for all the advice.

You're welcome. That's the important thing, if the plants are doing that well the current problems will eventually die down. If you are now seeing better plant growth then you previously had you are going to have less issues then you ever had before. Guaranteed. Plants are looking great by the way, very healthy and lush looking

Once this GW thing is licked I don't think you'll have any problems.

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Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

Here's an update parameter wise on my tank:

ph 6.5
kh 2.5 (should this be a concern)
gh 5
co2 23ppm
po4 .25 - .50ppm
no3 10ppm
nh3 0ppm

Bensaf,
That link that you sent LF to about algae mentioned in another link that GW is caused by high po4, high no3 mixed in with some nh3. Wouldn't that be a condition if EI is used at startup and you didn't have enough plant mass to eat the nh3 and the tank went through a regular cycle.

I'm currently treating the GW with the willow branches and I've put a 100ml pack of Purigen in the filter. After this it's lights out.

Last edited by tetratech at 11-Oct-2005 10:52

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tetratech,

Just a thought, you are feeding Potassium, right?

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Yes, I am feeding Flourish Potassium. I had a bottle before I got the dry so4. Since I got the GW I've been dosing very small amounts of no3 and po4 and that's it. There is some potassium in the no3. I'm trying to keep everything within range but on the low end.

Also, whatever I trim is now remaining in the tank as a floating plant to help with sucking up stuff.


Last edited by tetratech at 11-Oct-2005 12:41

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Well I think I solved my cloudy water problem. Didn't get much out of the willow branches (another thread) but my water does appear to be clearing. First I used Seachem's Purigen which according to Seachem will remove what the algae bloom is being supported by (nitrogenous organic waste). Now this removes the support system but won't neccearily remove the current bloom, although you would hope that with the support system gone the plants, etc would do the rest. Well this might have happened eventually but I really had all the green tea I could handle (I'm really java kinda guy), so then after talking with Seachem tech support they recommended (what a surprise) another seachem product called Clarity. Now clarity actually binds and clumps the current bloom into particles big enough for your filter to trap. Unfortunately I went to all my crappy lfs and of course non of them had Seachem's Clarity, so I bought a product from Hagen calle P Clear, which sounded like the same thing. So I dumped it in and it looks like it's working pretty good 2 hours later. I'll know in the morning if it did the job. Here's a link to it in action.

http://www.hagen.com/img/aquatic/addinfo/pclear-demo.ppt

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tetratech,

Great that you seem to have found a solution to your problem. Any idea about possible side effects (besides clean water )?

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Any idea about possible side effects
Don't even say it LF. I woke this morning to a crytal clear tank. I almost cried. Here are a few new pics:

Day 18

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Pic of new foreground plant I added to right front (Lobelia Cardinalis) I don't know much about this plant, but I saw it in my lfs and bought it. Not sure if it fits in well with scape. Might look different once it starts to grow new leaves. Can you spot the albino BN?



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Last edited by tetratech at 13-Oct-2005 10:34[/font]

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Close up shot of mid right showing signs of life on java moss.



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Finally a pic from the side showing clear water.



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Oops, one more, close up of the main grouping.



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Congratulations...

Now only Little Fish's problems need to be solved.

Untitled No. 4.
Been thinking about you because you recommended the Purigen to me. It acted as the first punch against the bloom. I think I'm going to keep it in my cansister as long as it doesn't affect the plants.

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In that case you're going to keep it indefinitely... I've had it in both of my tanks for many months now and I don't have anything to say about it but compliments.

After thinking about it a bit, I thought that you problem might have been similar to something I had a while ago. I had a really bad protein film on my surface for a couple of weeks and it was so thick that algae started growing on it and it looked like an algae film instead... Perhaps your problem was just a case of cloudiness (from the substrate perhaps?) that allowed algae to grow on it rather than an actual algae problem. This is just an assumption, of course, I'm not scientist and although find the scientific side intriguind, I prefer concentrating on growing plants.

If I can still back Bensaf and try to convince you to keep up your macro dosing and even raise the doses a little bit you will probably see great results. I usually read everything but don't post that much as Bensaf always says it all and better than I could.

On a side note, I really like your tank. I've been thinking for a while now about getting a new tank myself and starting from scratch with the what I know now and didn't know before. My tank, although alright in my opinion, is a patchwork. I've added a tube here, a tube there and changed it so much the makers wouldn't recognise it anymore, but I feel that I could do better if I do everything right from the beginning. In any case, it was your tank that started the latest itch and I plan on getting a black substrate as well seeing how well it works with the greens of the plants. I also really like this dark outer-space look and plan on copying it to a certain extent.

Last edited by Untitled No. 4 at 13-Oct-2005 16:10

You Lucky Sun of a Gun

Well, although I am happy for you, I am jealous as well. Why can’t I seem to find my cure?

For real, I think it is great that you finally can look at your fish. Now you can focus on the tasks ahead .

What are you planning to do next anyway?

Stay Tea Free,

Ingo

PS: I will write an update to my tank events later (but nothing like your news, so don’ get excited)

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Hi LF,

Actually I was at a good lfs tonite and was really looking around to decide what the big school of fish is going to be in my tank. I don't know if I want to go with cardinals, their just so unpredictable. I did observe a few fish I really liked but I decided to wait being that the tank is only a few weeks old. The lfs had a nice supply of what they had labeled as penquin pencil fish and and red/coral pencil. Here's a few pics of what I mean.





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And these:



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The Penguins I was told from the LFS owner (very honest) are skittish so I didn't want to take a chance. I think they were 6 for $15 and the Red Pencil were 2 for $12 (very expensive)

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Wow, they look nice.

I love the red one ( $$$ ).

Are pencilfish supposed to be good schoolers? If not, how would it look if you have a lot of the same fish just hanging out all over the place?

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

I believe pencilfish are good schoolers based on the conditions of the water. Maybe Bensaf knows, I think he has some. They also had I believe "Beckman" pencil fish as well for a more reasonible price. They had alot alot of rainbow fish as well, but I'm really looking to decide on the big school. The penguins would make a very striking shot in the tank if I got a big school. Anyway after all that I ended up buying for otos to add to the three I have in the tank. No problems yet.

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Those Red Corals are real eye candy. Absolute beauts.

I do have 10 Beckford Pencilfish. Great fish, highly reccomended. They are not the tightest schoolers in the world.But unlike a lot of other Tetras (present company excluded ) they don't just sit around the middle of the tank. They are ideal for a planted tank. They are very active and love interacting with plants. They'll attack any and all algae they come across, although it's usually an excercise in futility on their part, they are way too small to make any kind of dent in a serious algae problem.
I don't find them shy or skittish at all, quite the opposite. Fascinating to watch. They form a very distinct social group and they will battle and display for a while until an alpha male is chosen. He will be easy to spot as he gets bigger and more colorful then the others. After that a very very peaceful fish.
Good looking too. They will really color up in a planted tank, with gold , black, brown colors and very bright flashes of red and white which you may not see in the store but will develop in a good tank quickly. On the occasions when they do decide to school tightly and go on a group tour of the tank they are an awesome sight.
For me they are a "must have" in planted tank. It's a bit like having a flock of humming birds tending to your tank.

Penquins, I've never had but they are easily available in stores here. Never thought much of them. They seem to just sit there and float. Apart from the funny 45 degree angle they swim at I can't see much of interest about them. I've heard they can be a bit on the nippy side.

Black Neons are a good bet too. Very attractive fish. Bigger and much tighter schoolers then the normal Neon.

I've seen a lot of Lemon Tetras pop here recently and they've got my eye. Pretty enough, but seem really tight schooling and pretty active.Might give them a try.

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Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

One of my Pencils !

bensaf attached this image:

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Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

Wow. Just wow. The only complaint I have is that the lobelia looks rather...odd in it's current placement.

Bensaf,

The coral pencil really is as you said "eye candy" in a way though they look alittle like cherry barbs. The beckfords aren't exactly hurting in the looks department, but it sounds like the schooling is sporadic, but I definitely want some in the tank especially after seeing your photo and description. As far as the big school I'm looking for, I'd like to go with the black neons, but for some reason I think a bigger school of smaller tetras would be more of a WOW factor than a smaller school of bigger tetras like the black neon.

Cup,
Thanks for the tank compliments, your right I kinda just put the lobelia there. Not sure it fits, so I'll probably more it or take it out. It was a spur of the moment purchase. I think the plant is used to pave "streets" with it in aquascaping.



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Somehow I managed to miss all the posts on the previous page.

Green Water gone !!!!!

Musta been the NH3 which the purigen removed.

Great looking tank

Love Lobelia. I think it'll look good in the spot once it grows a bit. The leaf shape is a nice contrast to the Wisteria. It looks like emmersed growth, so it shouldn't brighten up and make more of a "statement" as time passes.

Congratulations

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Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

Tetratech,

I think you should get a nice school of those red pencilfish even though they're pricey. They look like a redder version of nannostomus trifasciatus (three-lined pencilfish), which, according to the Baensch Atlas, "many hobbyists consider this the finest of the genus". I've never seen them IRL here, so must be quite rare. I have its cousin, nannostomus marginatus (dwarf pencilfish), and I love them! Very colorful, especially against dark substrate.

Those hockey stick tetras get quite big (I've seen some that are at least 3" long) - definitely bigger than the black neons. Also I don't think they would make as striking a contrast against a dark substrate vs. say cardinals, glowlights, or espei rasboras.

-P

Bensaf,
Thanks, not a hint of green (LF look away) and the water is looking really polished from the purigen.

Interesting thing with the Lobelia my bolivian ram is acting really funny with it. The ram has been covering the plant with the substrate. I've never seen it do this before. I read that some say this plant excretes toxins into the water. Have you ever heard this?



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Maybe the Ram doesn’t like its color

I am glad that you don’t have any green water anymore. So what is your current fertilizer routine?

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Good one LF,

I'm really not dosing alot:

I've been adding 1/4 no3 and 1/16 po4 twice a week.
I've been doing 5ml traces once a week.
I haven't added the potassium at all. Figured I'm getting some anyway.

Also the eco contains alot of stuff.


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Here's another fish I saw a couple of weeks ago, but obviously I wasn't ready for them. Looks like they throw off some flourscent color. Has anyone kept emperor tetras? There are several different species (purpule, black)



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Tetra,

The latin name for Rams is Microphagus (sp?) which roughly translated means little earth mover. It's normal for Rams to decide to poke around and decide to re-arrange you substrate. Maybe he's looking for a pal. Get him a girlfriend, there more fun in groups. Even a couple of males (which I think I have) are fun, they bicker and squabble once in a while but nothing major, usually they hang out together. Maybe have a total of 3 , with the occassional bicker and squabble they'll be just like us

I've had the Purple emperors in the past. Nice fish, they color up beautifully given time, pretty active , don't really school though.

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Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

Bensaf,

I did not know that. Reason I was suprised is that I've had this ram for about a year and never saw it move the earth much, just a little when looking for food. I was going to ask you how many you have together. Here's a pic where it seems to have dug a hole behind the Lobelia






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I think they noramlly dig holes when they feel like breeding. Maybe he ....err....needs a cold shower

They seem quite social, I'd get him a friend , if you could get a female would be great, but as I said both my males seem to get on just fine. They are certainly far less territorial then the Blue Rams I used to have. They would have there own definate areas of the tank. The 2 Bolivians spend 90% of their time togather at the front of the tank. The only real squabble is at feeding , even then it's jus a push or two, no nipping or chasing. The Blues would chase one another all over.

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Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

I love both rams and have both but Bolivian rams, due to their size, can be more destructive for plants if they want to. which is when they breed. My couple, especially the male, uprooted all the Hemianthus "Cuba" in my tank, and then dug so many pits that my tank looked like London in the blitzkrieg. Although they bred only in one corner of the tank they made sure that all of it was uprooted, even bits at the other end of the tank. As much as I love them, I love(d) my Hemianthus as well so I moved them to the other tank where there are no small plants to attack and where I don't really care how much digging they do (which is a lot). So if you want to get your fish a friend, you might want to avoid getting a female. If you do get a female put some small slates in your tank which will minimise their digging in case they do want to breed as they prefer spawning on slates. Blue rams, even when spawning can't wreak as much havoc just because they're smaller.

Mind you, those fish are full of personality and each have a different one, so yours might not be anything like mine or like Bensaf's.

my tank looked like London in the blitzkrieg

I also prefer the Germans but the pair I bought didn't make it and died before I could move them into the big tank .

The Bolivians are quite a bit hardier and more forgiving when the water parameters are not optimal. I might just switch to them in a while. But I will wait with that until tetratech can send us pictures from his tank after a "bombardment" .

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Ingo,

I think that the number of the pits they dig and their depth depends mostly on how threatened they feel by other fish. In the tank where they are now they're only with two other fish who know better than to mess with them, so they only dug two pits and they weren't that deep. When they were in my bigger tank they were with cories and shrimps so they prepare several quite large pits and transferred the fry between those pits at least twice a day. The pits wouldn't have bothered me too much, but the destruction of the Hemianthus did as it was not an easy plant to get, and then not an easy plant to grow and then they came and declared war on it. I've collected the bigger bits (it's a very small plant) and replanted them, but it will take ages for it to make any difference, and by that time I hope to start with a new tank.

Tetratech, about the Eco Complete -- what size is it? Is it more like sand or more like gravel? I want to have sand in my next tank and if it is more like sand I will definitely use it as per Frank's five reasons for using Eco complete.

Untitled:
After all this talk about digging I guess I'll stick with the males. I don't want them wrecking the joint. As far as the eco and the grain size, that's an interesting question. Eco is has varied grain size and is suppose to automatically segregate in 2 layers, with the smaller grains on the bottom. But the latest batches I got most of it looked like sand size and goes up my python when I vac. If you want black sand I would go with the Tahitan Moon Sand from the same company (Carib-Sea)

LF:
tetratech can send us pictures from his tank after a "bombardment
Actually don't think my tank is all that bliss:
I have one ram a digging, two bristlenose hairgrassing and 3 pieces of alga on the back glass.

Last edited by tetratech at 15-Oct-2005 07:02

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A couple of developments today. I went to Aquarium Adventure (LF knows the place) and they really had some nice fish. Bolivian rams, chocolate cichlids, keyhole cichlids, beckford pencils, another more elongated pencil (maybe one line),apistogrammas, german rams, black neons.

I didn't love the way the bolivians looked and I was running out of time so I just played it save and picked up 3 beckford pencils and 5 black neons. The black neons were in a tank with a black background and black gravel and the blue line really looked great, so this could become my main school. I'll see how the 5 do. The beckfords look good although they actually look like my otos at first glance. I liked the chocolate cichlid but didn't know enough about them as well as the keyhole which I know gets about 6".

The surprising development (not a good one) is that my tank has a slight haze to it again, which I know will eventually turn green. Now I of course can't prove this but the tank was clear this morning and I dose my macros this morning.

Well maybe the willow will take care of it. See update in that thread.
http://www.fishprofiles.com/files/forums/Planted%20Aquaria/65099.html?200510151215

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I like the Black Neons a lot but I am not sure if they would stand out as well in my tank as they for sure will in yours. If you like how they shine in there then it is for sure a good pick for your large school.

I will keep my fingers crossed that your tank is not getting hazy again. Do you still have the Purigen in the filter? Maybe you are simply tired and it was your eye sight that failed you (I hope).

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Here's a pic of the black neon in my tank. The tank is maybe a little hazy this morning, but nothing to complain about. I actually screwed up the other day when I opened my filter I forgot to plug it back in so it was off for about 10 hours. I don't know if this contributed to the haziness. Not sure why it should, just thinking out loud.



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Here's a pic comparing day 5 and day 21 (this morning). Growth has really been superb. Tank was alittle hazy this morning, but cleared up within 2 hours. Plants doing their thing. I also have 4 branches of willow now sprouting roots. I'll have to stay on top of my nutrients see what's being sucked up. I'd like to try and compare suck up when branches are in and when their not.

Only problems right now are the bristlenoses. They are ruining my hairgrass and eating the lobelia.



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WOw tetra, already the aquascaping looks incredible. great job, can't wait to see it after the plants have grown in a bit. especially the hairgrass carpet.



Last edited by Megil Tel'Zeke at 16-Oct-2005 13:07

That tank is absolutely amazing looking. I wish you lived close by so you coudl help me do mine that well lol. Good Luck with your tank, and please keep posting those awesome pictures!

tetratech,

Lokking sharp, glad that the haziness was only temporary. Or, maybe given your own statement “I'm a little off today, drinking Cabo Tequila and Rum last nite”, maybe I wasn’t so off when I said that “your eye sight that failed you” .

I just love the way the Neon looks in your tank, but I am thinking now that a large school would add a lot of black to a black dominated tank. Maybe the more colorful pencils are better?

Growth is really nice; the Rotala is the dominant plant now. Also, the hairgrass does very well (unlike mine ).

Good job man,

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Thanks alot for the tank compliments. I really appreciate it and glad you enjoy the pics.

LF,
So far the pencilfish hover around the rotala and the Black Neons swim in the open, but other than the first hour in the tank they have not shown a tight schooling formation like rasboras, cardinals or rummys. Maybe I need to add more or a fish that scares them a bit.

Funny think about the haziness. It was three in the morning disappeared a few hours later than when I returned home this evening it was hazy again. Doesn't make much since. I guess it is the Tequila.

Last edited by tetratech at 16-Oct-2005 17:00

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Well there's Camouflage. This guys looks like my eco-complete. Actually my corrupted eco (note the white for the limestone)



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Last edited by tetratech at 16-Oct-2005 17:08[/font]

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Then there's the opposite.



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If your filter was down for 10 hours that's 10 hours when the bio colony in the filter were getting no water flow and no oxygen. $ hours is usually the max for this. Whatever bio colony you had in the filter was probably killed off. The haze you saw was probably a minor bacteria bloom.

I see the same thing if I overdo the cleaning of the canister filter. Get a light white haze for a few hours.

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Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

Yep, definitely thought about that. I guess I need to educate myself more on the livelihood of these little creatures. How does the bacteria in eco complete survive.

Eco Complete includes live Heterotrophic bacteria to rapidly convert fish waste into natural food for your plants. I guess they are of a different form to survive in a closed bag for who knows how long.

Last edited by tetratech at 16-Oct-2005 23:49

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yah the bacteria in eco-complete, are proably few and far between. never taken the time to look at the stuff under a microscope.

An addition to the filter being down for 10 hours thing:

I read that not only does the beneficial bacteria colony die off after 1 hour (some say even less) because of the lack of oxygen but bad bacteria is taking over in the canister (anaerobic sp?) and when the system restarts this bacteria is washed into the tank.

More than once did I read the suggestion that, in case of a longer canister down time, the water in the filter should be disposed off and the content should be cleaned (rinsed off) before the filter is restarted.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

So I guess any good bacteria in the tank is sustained by the plants and some water movement by the fish, etc.

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Yes, that’s right.

I bought a small battery powered air pump for just that purpose (power outage). It will keep the tank aerated and also create some surface agitation.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

My tank definitely has a slight green haze to it and I feel like I'm walking a tightrope to control it. One slip and I'm back to the green fog. What's baffling is I have the purgien in, 4 willow branches sprouting roots and now leaves. I don't think this is the biofilter dying anymore. BTW I never detected any NH3 after the filter was off. Plants are growing great. Bensaf I think I did say that. My plants have never grown this well. Add another beer to your count, well deserved. Here's a closer pick looking in from the upper right down to the center grouping. Very lush (for me anyway)



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Last edited by tetratech at 17-Oct-2005 10:17[/font]

BTW - Have you guys seen my other thread:
http://www.fishprofiles.com/files/forums/Planted%20Aquaria/65329.html?200510170038

Last edited by tetratech at 17-Oct-2005 10:21

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No, I didn’t see your other thread until you mentioned it here (and I responded immediately after I saw it).

I hope your green water doesn’t return. Can it be that your Purigen is already “used up” and either needs to be replaced or re-vitalized?

Ingo

You just wait. Once I am done with my big sucker tank (whenever this may be) I will have to redo my 20 Long and my 29 .

Last edited by LITTLE_FISH at 17-Oct-2005 10:51

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Possibly the purigen needs to be charged. That would be quick but maybe with all the green it got used up quickly. I think you have to soak in bleach.

BTW - My current tank parameters

ph 6.6
kh 3
c02 24ppm
po4 1ppm
no3 10ppm
nh3 0ppm

This is pretty much where I wanted to be. (maybe alittle more co2) This was also taken in the morning. I've been turning on my co2 a few hours before lights and a few hours after lights out to soften the difference between day and nite. Just seemed like a good idea.




Last edited by tetratech at 17-Oct-2005 11:19

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tetratech,

You have to explain to me what you mean by softening the difference between day and night.

I am wondering what your CO2 values are just before you shut down the solenoid. If it is a few hours after lights out, it should be fairly high (maybe not yet as you don’t have too many plants in there) as both, CO2 system and plants, add CO2 to the water.

I am on Tom Barr’s side who says that there no reason to run CO2 when no light is on.

Please be so kind and measure your CO2 tonight. Maybe we can draw some conclusions (and suck Bensaf into another conversation).

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

You have to explain to me what you mean by softening the difference between day and night.
Sometimes I get a gut feeling about something and I try to back it up scientifically. I'm not saying this is a big deal either way (Bensaf keeps co2 24/7 right). My thinking is if I overlap the co2 after lights out there isn't as much time for the ph to raise overnite so there shouldn't be as much of an upswing. In the morning I start the co2 about 2 hours before lights on, so when those lights do come on there is already considerable co2 concentration in the water (my ph this morning was 6.6) so the plants can start enjoy their food early. I noticed my rotala was pearling before 11am this morning.
I would love to hear Uncle Ben's take on this.

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LF
My current tank parameters this morning and this evening were
ph 6.6 / 6.5
kh 3 / 3
c02 24ppm / 28ppm
po4 1ppm / 0.25ppm
no3 10ppm / 10ppm

If this is accurate, my po4 was sucked up but not really nitrate. Could be misleading if tank is still cycling and producing nitrate.

It's interesting to note that we each have hit a snag in our setups. You with so many flavors algae and me with tinted green water. Let's see:

LF - More light, more ferts, more plants, no biofilter at startup
TT - Less light, less ferts, some biofilter (eco-complete that contains live Heterotrophic Bacteria)



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I understand where tetra is going.

Yes I used to run Co2 24/7. I hasten to add this was purely for convenience rather then avouiding pH shifts or such. I don't have a solenoid so it was just simpler to leave the Co2 running all the time.

I've since moved away from that. I now kind of do half of what tetra is doing. I switch on the Co2 a few hours before lights on and switch off imeddiately after lights out (sometimes an hour before lights out , more on that later). This is, again, for no other particuilar reason other then convenience. I still don't have a solenoid. So I manually switch on/off the co2 my self. The reason it gets switched on a few hours before lights on is that's when I leave for work ! I know one day I'm going to run out the door to the office and forget to switch on the Co2 so a solenoid valve is definately on the shopping list (my birthday tomorrow guys, now's your chance to make an old man happy ) . I could get around this by leaving the Co2 on but put the reactor on a timer, only problem is I've noticed if I switch off the powerhead attached to the reactor, when I switch it back on the powerhead won't run unless I take it off the reactor and klet it get started. I don't trust this so leave the reactor running 24/7 and just switch on off the gas supply.

Getting back to the point in hand, the reason I changed to this way of running Co2 was that I noticed if I only had the Co2 running with the lights I could really pump in Co2 heavy during the day, then by switching off at night it was giving a lot more safety margin comfort to the fish. If I was to run at the high bubble rate I run now 24/7 I'm pretty certain I'd have a lot of dead fish.

During the day my pH is anywhere from 6.6 - 6.4 so I have 30-40ppm of Co2. Fish are fine during the day (plants are consuming Co2 and giving out O2) but if I run this rate during the night the fish how signs of discomfort within a couple of hours.

I'm getting much better results this way. With the high Co2, plants are definately more lush, BBA is knocked out I don't get a speck on the Anubias anymore.

One surprising thing I noticed: even though I switch off the Co2 immedtiately after lights out the pH hardly shifts at all ! My ph out of the tap is about 7.4 so I was expecting a big upward swing when the Co2 was off. That didn't happen ! It will still be close to 6.6 in the morning. I guess with running so high during the day there is still a good bit in solution in the water, this plus the co2 production at night is keeping the pH remarkably stable.

So based on my own experience and observations I'd say there nothing wrong with starting up a few hours before lights on, in fact it would be a good thing the plants are ready to go as soon as lights on. But if the reason for running the Co2 a few hours after lights out is the fish, I'd say it's actually safer to turn off Co2 immediately upon lights out ! Especially if you're running a high rate during the day (tetra is running about 5bps, similar to me), I think the risk of ODing the Co2 and harming the fish is much greater then the risk of a pH shift. As I said, from my own experience, if the Co2 is a good rate during the day, the pH won't shift much if at all during the night.

I definately won't be going back to 24/7 running.

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Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

If this is accurate, my po4 was sucked up but not really nitrate

Sorry just saw the latest post.

The numbers make some sense. PO4 really really pushes Nitrate uptake. With your PO4 so low Nitrate uptake will drop.

Also bear in mind the lower your nitrate the more dodgy the test kits get. You may have a lot less NO3 then you think.

This is line with what predicted yesterday, with that kind of growth, you are in real danger of bottoming out. I'd go back up to the normal EI dosages. Assuming you are convinced that it's nothing to do with the GW ???

BTW, the plants look great. You have a real hold on trimming techniques, something I'm lousy at

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Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

Bensaf,

Interesting and nicely detailed entry about your CO2 routine. It almost convinced me to start up my CO2 a little earlier, but I will think about it some more first. Also, I would need to get another timer and plug first, this would be then the 4th timer on the tank.

“my birthday tomorrow guys”

Now this revelation made me really mad . I was planning since a week to create a surprise “Happy Birthday” entry for you, and now you took all the fun out of it. Well, I will have another chance next year .

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Well let me simply say "HAPPY BIRTHDAY". I feel like I should get you something with all the help you've given me. Well maybe I'll think of something (Got some nice willow branches).

Anyway, my thought with the co2 on the backend was what Bensaf said. The co2 concentration will be ready for the plants. The continuing of the co2 after lights off, doesn't concern me because it's only a few hours (not sure, but does plant usage stop immmediately with no light or is there some lingering usage. Another thing with my setup is that I actually have alot of surface agitation,(probably too much) with my return running a little above the water line. My cheap ladder diffusor (original one from hagen kit) seems to be doing a pretty good job. Even with the surface agitation, I'm holding about 25 to 28 ppm.

I'll have to stay on top of my dosing. I'm really getting sick of testing though, especially when you can't believe the results. Still vexed by this GW thing, but reading threads on APC should me it's not all that uncommon and it seems most people cured it with lights out and slowly brining their lights back up. The willow branches are really rooting. I wonder if they are sucking up more po4 than no3. I have to see if they help clear the water, but that's another thread.

You too kind about the Pruning. Let's see how my tank looks in 2 months.




Last edited by tetratech at 18-Oct-2005 05:49

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Here's a couple of pics of the new fish. Bensaf can you ID these for me. Are they definitely Beckford. Many times LFS has them mislabeled.



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And the Black Neons amongst the willow.



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I like the one Neon who is looking into the camera.

I can see him think “What the heck is going on here?”

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

A list , a list

- Actually the plants will probably switch off well before lights off. When do your Rotalas fold up and close shop for the day ? Mine do a hour or so before lights out. This basically the plant done with photosynthesis for the day. I'd assume at that stage it's not consuming anymore Co2.

- Yep thems definately Beckfords. They'll color up real good in a couple days. You'll see alot more gold and the red and white on the fins will get much more intense. Then you'll see their true beauty. How many did you get? Let us know how you like them.

- Ingo, aw shucks, I didn't think anybody cared . Not even sure if the wife remembered. Anyway you've really pleasured me

- Testing is a pain in the rear. I'm sure you're getting a real feel now for how the plants react as you vary dosages, make changes etc. Trust your eye and watch the plants, keep an eye on pearling etc. Looking at the tank is alot more fun then staring at a test kit changing color

I'm feeling proud that my nephews are all grown up now

---

Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

“Anyway you've really pleasured me”

Glad I could help

And sure do I care about your birthday as for the next 1.5 months you are going to be a year older than I am .

With regards to plants closing shop for the night – my Egeria Najas even let their heads hang down before the lights go off.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Looks like I'm the baby of the group and already a fish master.



Last edited by tetratech at 18-Oct-2005 16:48

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It seems like a quiet day on FP. I guess Bensaf took many members to celebrate his birthday. I'm actually kinda miffed I thought Bensaf would be celebrating the big day right here with me. He's probably hitting every pub in town and you know those senior discounts are hard to pass up. And after the "you've really pleasured me" thing with Littlefish, who knows where he is.

Anyway because of all the help you gave me I'd like to dedicate the following pics to you for your birthday. Without you and your constant meddling in my tank affairs these pictures would never have been possible.

First pic is day 1


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Day 12



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Day 24 - Bensaf's Birthday

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Wisteria Grove. My bolivian swishes around in here like a clownfish in an anenome.



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Here's a closer look of my main area. Everything looks nice and lush, healthy. The magic of EI.



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Here's an even closer look of my stargrass and rotala. I like the way the stargrass works it's way around the rocks and hardscape.



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Last edited by tetratech at 19-Oct-2005 21:53[/font]

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And finally. I hoped you "pearled all nite Bensaf" Happy Birthday.



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Gets better every time . Personally, I still think the lobelia should be moved closer towards the center, as it looks out of place in it's current placement.

In any case, what's the complete current stocking of the tank?

Thanks for the dedication.

Glad my "meddling" was of some help.

It looks real good, and as noodles said just keeps getting better.You can trim mine anytime.Errr...tank that is

You've done a superb job on the shaping and grooming.

You should be proud of that tank.

---

Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

"It looks real good, and as noodles said just keeps getting better.You can trim mine anytime.Errr...tank that is "

good lord.

tetratech,

I agree that it is becoming a very nicely arranged environment , albeit one that is not easy to maintain though.

If only the Hairgrass would start filling in some more. Mine doesn’t grow at all; it is barely hanging on to its original size.

And that is a very nice close-up of your Rotala.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Thanks for all your nice comments

Cup_of_Lifenoodles:
Unfortunately the lobelia is being used as a salad bar by my bristlenose. As far as stocking:
Fish wise:5 black neons, 3 pencilfish, 2 rummys, 1 bolivian ram, 1 cory, 7 otos, 2 bristlenose
Plant wise: Stargrass, rotala, wisteria, dwarf hairgrass and a little java moss. I like big groupings of fewer species. I think it will show off a big school of fish better. I would like to have 30 or more of one species eventually.

Bensaf:
Thanks for the trimming accolades. I also as mentioned have only a few species, probably makes it simplier to do.
I'm starting to get some comments when people walk in my house "wow what a tank", "are those plants real" and my favorite was made by my wife a few days ago. "I really like the way the green stripe on the black neons matches the plants"

LittleFish:
The hairgrass I believe is being slowed by the BN uprooting and particles do some to attach to the leaves especially if the are too tall. I've been trimming any tall leaves and vaccuming them out.

albeit one that is not easy to maintain though
In what way do you think LF?


Last edited by tetratech at 20-Oct-2005 12:36

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my favorite was made by my wife a few days ago. "I really like the way the green stripe on the black neons matches the plants

Not quite "your eyes are like dark limpid pools I could lose myself in", but eh we'll take it. We are a sad bunch of men.

LF,

Indica and Stargrass are about the 2 easiest stem plants to maintain. They take a good hack with the trimming scissors very well. The more you trim the bushier they get. A lot of other stem plants wouldn't take as kindly to such treatment.

---

Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

We are a sad bunch of men
Actually I prefer "manchild" thank you!

Is it true that the rotala will only grow 12" to 15" max. A few more cuttings I'll probably have to replant tops.

I also didn't realize the pencilfish like the algae. See them picking at the stop algae on the glass (yes LF I do have some algae).



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No it'll grow much taller then that and then just continue along the surface. If you let it hit the surface it should produce a lot of side shoots.

I thought I mentioned the Pencilfish would keep pecking at the algae (or maybe you guys gave up on listening to me), but yeah they'll poke at all day , they're too small to make much of a dent though.

---

Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

“albeit one that is not easy to maintain though
In what way do you think LF?”

Well, my thoughts plant by plant

Wisteria – Will eventually grow taller and create a stem like structure (although I am not too experienced with this plant). This would take away from the focus area.
Star Grass – By constantly trimming the tops, that upper area will get very dense. The bottom parts (stems and lower leaves) will not receive enough light anymore and turn black and die off.
Rotala – I though I even saw this one mentioned by Bensaf somewhere, but here is my observation. Constant trimming will make the stems look ragged and at some point the stems will have to be taken out and replaced with new cuttings. That process could be a little tricky as it is in such a tight spot between the rocks.

All plants – grow fast, aka high pruning frequency.

And no – we are not a sad bunch of men – we are as interesting as it gets

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Wisteria – Will eventually grow taller and create a stem like structure (although I am not too experienced with this plant). This would take away from the focus area. It's funny I mentioned in my 12g thread that the wisteria is not making a move to the surface. the stems are creeping along the substrate. I've been cutting this plant down so long, that I think "I trained this puppy"

Star Grass – By constantly trimming the tops, that upper area will get very dense. The bottom parts (stems and lower leaves) will not receive enough light anymore and turn black and die off.
Yes that is true, and what I've been doing and it might be too early to tell if it will work long-term, but in addition to shearing on the top I've been triming about two-thirds down some stems from the center to make sure light gets in. We'll see.

Rotala – I though I even saw this one mentioned by Bensaf somewhere, but here is my observation. Constant trimming will make the stems look ragged and at some point the stems will have to be taken out and replaced with new cuttings. That process could be a little tricky as it is in such a tight spot between the rocks.
Yes, this I believe will happen, but the area behind the rock is actually quite large and accessable. It's tough to tell from the photo.

Last edited by tetratech at 21-Oct-2005 07:19

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Constant trimming will make the stems look ragged and at some point the stems will have to be taken out and replaced with new cuttings. That process could be a little tricky as it is in such a tight spot between the rocks.

It's relative. All stem plants will end up looking ragged at the bottom at some stage and need to be uprooted and the bottoms discarded. Some can go quite a long period before having to do this.

Some stem plants need to be uprooted everytime they are trimmed and the bottoms cut off. Plants like Cambomba, Myrio, Ammania,R.Macrandra. This is mainly an appearance thing. These plants are used and look best for their strong vertical shape. Cutting the top off just ruins that shape. Some, like the Ammania and Cambomba don't produce new shoots easily if at all, so topping is not a good thing.

Plants like the Indica and Stargrass take the haircuts relatively well,and get bushier, which is what we want from them, so you can go longer without having to uproot. If the bottoms are well hidden and still get a good amount of light you may never have to uproot them.

You need to bear these things in mind when choosing a location for the plant. Stems should be planted in areas that are easy to access. The plants around them should be carefully chosen, to avoid too much shading or maintaining a certain height to cover the stems behind.

Certain stem plants produce massive root systems, Reineckii and , surprisingly, Macrandra have root systems like a Sword plant, give them some space otherwise everytime you uproot them you also uproot whatever is too close to them.

One of the things I really like about working with a sand substrate now is that it's much easier to maintain. Uprooting a plant doesn't make a huge mess like before and rooting a plant is 100 times easier then using bigger gravel. Just push it in and it's stuck there

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Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

Bensaf,

Thanks for your detailed explanation on the trimming routine that is required for the various stem plants, in particular your information on the R.Macrandra. Guess I will have quite some re-planting to do with that one . BTW, mine is just starting to branch about half way up. Wouldn’t that ruin the vertical growth appearance?

Thanks again,

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

You need to bear these things in mind when choosing a location for the plant. Stems should be planted in areas that are easy to access. The plants around them should be carefully chosen, to avoid too much shading or maintaining a certain height to cover the stems behind.
That's why I'm still a beginner when it comes to aquascaping. There really is a lot that goes in to selection, location. Although I do believe the general statement (Bensaf I think you said this) that if the plants are healthly you could almost drop them in anywhere and it's going to look beautiful, compared to a tank where the plants are unhealthly and located very strategically.

One of the things I really like about working with a sand substrate now is that it's much easier to maintain
I must confess that I didn't realize you were using sand in your "Amano Paradise" setup. The grain size looks very large. How does it compare to the pool filter sand.

Last edited by tetratech at 22-Oct-2005 07:27

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How does it compare to the pool filter sand.

Well it's silica sand hence the larger grain size. I'm not using fine beach sand. It's just ths same as the pool filter sand I think.

---

Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

Day 28 (1 Month) Update:

Pros - plants, hairgrass growth, water clarity
Cons - Spot algae on glass, some black on stargrass, hairgrass damage by BNs.

I think I need to trim more frequently, I'm not used to all this growth.

Also the rock to the right in front of the stargrass, I'm starting to dislike. I think it's too evenly cut and I need a more natural looking piece.

Here's the fist pic a full shot:



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Last edited by tetratech at 23-Oct-2005 12:14

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This shot shows the slope I created from center to side.



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This is a closer look at the Hairgrass, it's definitely coming in despite the damage from my BN. Look at BN squatting on my nice grass.



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A pic of the wisteria. Growth continues to be wide and low some of the leaves are hugh. Don't you love the Willow root section of my tank. I'm thinking new biotope.



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tetratech,

I like the growth in your tank. Spot algae are normal for a healthy tank and should be taken care off during your weekly water change.

I see that your hairgrass is growing, mine just ain’t .

About the rock and how even it looks: Instead of replacing it, have you thought about adding some moss to it? That would look nice (IMHO).

Say, did you get your ballast and if so then how long are the second lights on for? I upped mine from 3 hours to 5 just about 4 days ago (after I reduced them from 10 to 3 about 10 days ago).

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

LF,

SPOT ALGAE
Yes, been doing scraping it during WC and I have some very fat and jolly otos in my tank. I also picked up two Yamato shrimp, haven't seen them since I put them in.

HAIRGRASS
Is growing, but like the moss everything get's stuck in it.
so it's alot of maintenance. BTW do you know if hairgrass sends out runners below and above the subtrate.
ROCK
I have thought about that but as I stated above the java moss has been a pain in my tank. But I might give it another try under present tank conditions. Also my theory with the most relates to obviously water movement. In our co2 tanks we aren't over filtered. Not much water movement good for co2 as far as service agitation. So because there's no strong water current and I believe the nutrients contribute to the amount of stuff getting stuck in the moss. BTW is your moss doing better based on the add'l powerheads or do you think it's because the algae has slowed.
BALLAST
I actually ended up buying a new light (Coralife dual 192watt 6700k) because the ballast was going to cost me $80 and my bulbs were old and they go for around $40 each so the whole reflector wasn't much more. BTW the quality of the coralife over the current usa is much better. As far as light cycle I have 96watts from 9 to 8 and 192 watts from 12 to 4 right now. Similiar to you.

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tetratech,

I have by now 8 Otos in my tank and I am lucky if I see 6 of them. It drives me crazy if I can’t account for all habitants as I always worry they might be dead somewhere in the plants.

My hairgrass seems to have some strings with nodes that grow straight into the water current, but don’t have any ground contact. Is that the runners and if so what do I do with it? I find these strings now also tangled in other plants.

I don’t know if and why my moss is doing better, although it looks better as most of the covering brown slime is gone (ran out of gas ). It could have something to do with the current but the event coincided with the decline in silica. BTW current, I don’t think that a current in the tank would cause too much CO2 exchange as long as you don’t create any ripples on the surface. I either place my power heads so far down that this is avoided or I point the nozzle slightly downwards.

Glad you got a new light, when I was shopping I also considered a Current fixture. Somehow I ended up with the CoraLife as it was a) cheaper and b) I already have a 65W unit on my 29G that I am very happy with. I will have to order another set of legs though as one broke off during my plant work this weekend – the unit slipped too far back and all the weight ended up on that leg, so it caved in. I am not too wild about an outside Reactor as it shows over the top of the tank frame (at least the one that the Doctors sell). Neither do I desire heaters that are built into the filter for cost reasons; the ones that are inline seem to be interesting though.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

My hairgrass seems to have some strings with nodes that grow straight into the water current, but don’t have any ground contact. Is that the runners and if so what do I do with it? I find these strings now also tangled in other plants.

Where the nodes there when you planted the hairgrass? If yes, those you need to cut. I thinks that emersed growth. Either way the hairgrass needs to be cut to help horizontal runner growth.

Yes you are right about the co2, As long as the current is under water. I was just making the point that we tend to have last current in our big tanks because of the tank size in relation to our gph rates.

I actually only purchased a 36" fixture for my 48" tank. The light is setting on tow plastic bumpers atop the glass canopy. The 48" fixture would have given me about 3.7 wpg. I did not want that much. Speaking of canopies, are you eventually going to get the full canopy on top of the tank. It really finishes it off and isolates the tank itself, because the escaping light is not seen.

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tetratech,

No way am I getting a full canopy for my tank. I love the high tech look of the light unit hovering over the tank (I have the clear legs that are less visible). The only light that escapes my light unit is the one that is reflected of the glass top and I don’t mind that at all.

Full canopies, IMHO, also appear way too bulky and give the tank an over-head, if you know what I mean.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Whoa, someones does like full canopies
Actually what I meant with light escaping, is that the canopy blocks all light from your eye other, so the only thing that you look at is the inside of the tank. Best way to describe it is when your in a museum or public aquarium the lights are dimmer and the exhibits really stand out. Downside obviously is you have to remove to work on the tank. I had one on my 46g and it looked really good, then again my tank is in my kitchen, so I have to appease the wife.

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Yeah – I love full canopies ]:|]:|]:|



If I had the spare change I would buy one of these fancy light units that are suspended from the ceiling.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Don't get me excited.

Now your making me think of an open topped aquarium with the driftwood and plants coming above the water line with the suspending Halide lighting. Stop please, stop

Last edited by tetratech at 24-Oct-2005 12:51

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Actually here's a pic of my old 46 showing some of the canopy. Man look at all the java moss.

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You for sure had a nice moss carpet going

What is that plant in the back there, Narrow Leaved Ludwigia?

And look at that, hm, lovely huge block on top of the tank.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

That was all polysperma in the back and a few stems of Cabomba in front of the diffusor.

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Hi,
This is what I did to my StarGrass by clipping it
very very short, and then snipping some at about half
way to the surface.

Frank


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-->>> The Confidence of Amateurs, is the Envy of Professionals <<<--

Frank that looks really nice. How soon after you clipped was that picture taken. The leaves look much smaller than mine and also have a pinkish hue to them. Your Stargrass almost looks like me rotala.



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Your Stargrass almost looks like me rotala.

It is - it's Rotala Rotundifolia.

Water flow is important for spreading nutrients and Co2 enriched water around the tank. A small pump or 2 will do the job without increasing surface agitation.Doesn't need to be blasted out, very small pump will do it, just move the water around without blowing the plants out of the substrate. Having the spraybar on the side glass and blowing aross the lenght of the tank works well. Some plants, like Java Fern (and Moss) do better with a gentle current.

---

Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

Bensaf,
Thanks for the reality check. I thought I was losing it. That must be the stargrass on the bottom really cut short.

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hey tetratech,

I have to ask you again about the Purigen.

As I am going to place an order with Big Al's tomorrow anyways, I am considering getting some Purigen. Despite your tellings, here is part of the description from Big Al's:

"Purigen removes proteins, nitrites and nitrates, ammonia, and a broad spectrum of organics, yet its impact on trace elements is minimal."

So it takes out the nitrates? I thought you said it didn't.

Your confused (as usual ) log buddy,

Ingo

EDIT: and what is the size of the bag that you used for it?

Last edited by LITTLE_FISH at 25-Oct-2005 12:56

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Sorry, I'm not tetratech, but I will try to answer.

Purigen doesn't remove nitrates as such, it just removes nitrogenous waste which would otherwise break into ammonia, nitrite and nitrate. It shouldn't remove all of it anyway, and it doesn't remove nitrate when dosed as KNO3.

What you do have to pay attention to is that Purigen shouldn't be used with amine based water conditioners. Actually, you can use it, but only once as amines bind to the Purigen and then recharging will make it toxic for reuse. If you use Prime then you need not worry. I don't know about other conditioners.

Other than that I think it's an excellent product, but that's just me and what do I know?

Yup,
It's rotilla, sold as Stargrass, and thus embedded within
the grey matter incorrectly.
In any event, I treated as a Bonsai plant. I kept trimming
and trimming it I would trim a stem, and it would grow
a couple of replacement stalks which in turn were trimmed
etc. Eventually I wound up with that "ball" or mass of
plant.

Frank


-->>> The Confidence of Amateurs, is the Envy of Professionals <<<--

LF,

Pretty much what UNTITLED said. It removes waste before it breaks down into nh3,n02,n03. Do I know if it's doing anything? Absolutely NOT. Is my water clear? Absolutely YES, but I also have 5 willow branches and I'm dancing around the tank once a day. I bought a 100ml pouch, that's suppose treat 100 gallons. It is also reuseable. They also sell it loose that you have to put it in your own fine size filter bag.

Frank,

They sold rotala as stargrass. Now I've heard everything.

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I'm dancing around the tank once a day.

Careful, people, the boy's losing it :%):%)

Got this strange picture of tetra in a grass skirt, bone through the nose,the words fish master daubed on his body with Purigen residue, spinning and chanting around the tank while offering sacrifices of KNO3 and Flourish to the Planted Tank Gods and trying to invoke Tombarrus the algae avenging demon from the netherworld.

It ain't pretty.



Ok, suddenly I'm not sure who's losing it

---

Some days you're the pigeon and some days you're the statue.

Remember that age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

Bensaf,

Don&#8217;t worry &#8211; you are not losing it. I am sure you lost it already a long time ago.

Untitled and tetratech &#8211; Thanks, so I will go ahead and order it, maybe it does something.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Got this strange picture of tetra in a grass skirt, bone through the nose,the words fish master daubed on his body with Purigen residue


Thanks Bensaf. That's a great idea for my halloween costume this year. Think people will get it? Well I'm doing it I don't care what the wife says.

Untitled and tetratech &#8211; Thanks, so I will go ahead and order it, maybe it does something
I would try the dance first in full costume.

Last edited by tetratech at 26-Oct-2005 13:20

Last edited by tetratech at 26-Oct-2005 19:23

My Scapes

Update 31
Everything is going good fish and plant wise. So since I'm still waiting for Bensaf to post some new pics of his "Bensaf does Amano" tank here's the same boring pic of mine. I personally think Bensaf has an algae problem and is waiting for it to clear up. :88)

LF I think your right about the Stargrass, my grouping to the right grows better than the one to the left and it's the one that gets some current from the return which is located above the rotala and angled to the right.

I've also decided to start growing the wisteria to the left side too. I think some green was needed near the rocks and wood over there. The rotala is growing so fast it literally needs to be trimmed everyday.

tetratech attached this image:


Last edited by tetratech at 26-Oct-2005 19:48[/font]

Last edited by tetratech at 26-Oct-2005 19:51

My Scapes

Pic 98.8k doesn't go through.




tetratech attached this image:


My Scapes